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Rachel, its not like frum men are rushing out to join the NYPD so that frum men get special handling when they break the law.
Dovid I think your suggestion is admirable. It would be heartening to see Masbia benefit from these chickens. 4H is alive and well in NYC, they may be a good resource for assistance in caring for the birds. They also do outreach to schools, both public and private. 4H and their members (and the state Extension Service) could teach Jewish youth the proper care for these animals. Wouldn’t everyone be happier if the news coverage of Kaparos in NYC showed some positive improvements?
Will it eliminate PETA protests? Probably not since most of those folks are anti meat, but the general public could see that Jews practicing this ritual do care about the animals they sacrifice both before and after the ritual.
Yes my agenda is clear. I expect adults to clean up the messes they make in public. Argue all you want, you can kill as many chickens as you like. Just clean up after yourself. That’s not so hard is it? We raise our children not to make messes and to clean up after themselves. Why is this so hard for adults to do?
Milhouse, I’d love to believe you. But none of the photos here on YWN show anything that indicates these animals are being processed for food. The films showing sanitation workers cleaning up show bags of dead chickens piled high and some exploding as the garbage truck mashes them down. None of the yiddin on the scene are doing anything about picking of the mess which is on a public street. I would love to see a well run kaparos stand. Do you have a website you can recommend?
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Bshtei_Einayim You are wrong. I’m not a protester. If you feel that animal sacrifice is necessary to your faith do it by all means. Respect the creature you are using while it is alive with proper care and handling. Clean up your mess. Don’t let blood drain into city sewers or permit bags of dead creatures to litter the street when you are done with your ritual. Is this too much to ask for?Meh, writing a book about the famous people one meets sounds a bit ego driven. Not my cuppa at all.
Well you are talking about national legislation I suspect. There are states whose gun laws comply with your dictum, and at the federal level there is accomodation for compassionate release and rational release (as in your example). Many state have also adopted these policies and procedures. Fining airlines is perhaps a federal matter since the do control air transport in this country.
At this point I have zero recommendations. Certainly we can’t legislate that people are nice to each other or don’t call names.
I saw some videos of the carnage clean up on a NYC street. No one can tell me that piles of dead chickens and blood strewn sidewalks is healthy and complying with city and state laws. Of course block voting may explain why nothing is done about it and taxpayers pay for the cleanup.And yea if you claim you’ve always seen kaparos vendors cleaning up after themselves for forty years take some videos and get them posted. Engage in a campaign that shows that the necessary sanitary laws are being kept.
For those that practice kaparos, why is it so hard to comply with basic sanitary codes and the safe handling of live poultry? I’ve seen children and adults handling chicken without gloves and not the least bit mindful of salmonella transmission from bird to human.
How much do you pay for a kaparos chicken?
Laskern it is extremely painful to the chicken to be held by it’s wings, and it is painful when you hold them by their legs upside down. The proper way to hold a chicken is to cup both it’s wings with your hands, gently but firmly. I’ve not seen one healthy chicken in any of the kaparos photos posted. All look like they are battery hens with breasts plucked clean from nervous pecking and some even exhibit clipped beaks. All are dirty with feces.
Joseph, it is my understanding that kapparos chickens are given to needy families for food. Keeping their food free of feces is a good way to ensure that the humans who eat them don’t get ill. In my case I use their eggs, and the chances of salmonella increase with poor feeding practices. As to the water, chickens get thirsty too, what is wrong with ensuring that all get their chance at sufficient freshwater? Goodness it’s not like my chickens are coming in the house to sleep in my bed.
Well Joseph, at least you won’t be mislabeled a compassionate conservative.
I just saw an article in the Lkwd Scoop about Kaparos and the improved treatment of their chickens. The water basin was too deep for the chickens to reach and too small for the flock. Every 4 chickens need 1 quart of water per day at the minimum. The feed was just placed on a rimmed cookie sheet that allowed the flock to deposit feces on their food. There are inexpensive feeders designed to keep this from happening. It’s a pity there is such a steep learning curve for the humane treatment of these creatures. A call to their local Extension Service (or a google) could place these folks on the right path when it comes to poultry care.
I am not a PETA member but I’ve managed to keep backyard chickens in the years I haven’t lived rurally. It is not a steep learning curve. When I first started with chickens decades ago Extension Services was a valuable resource, that kept me and my hens healthy and happy.
Ok I’ll give this a try.
Floyd Patterson
Elmer Bernstein
Beverly Sills
Jan Peerce
Robert Merrill
Richard Tucker
Paul Robeson
Richard, Pat and Tricia Nixon
Daniel Segretti
Leroy Neiman
Ronald Reagan
Sir Roger Penrose
Bill and Hillary Clinton
Barack and Michelle Obama
Joe and Jill Biden
Jimmy Roosevelt
Anna Freud
William F. Kuntzler
Jesse Jackson
Ozzie and Harriet Nelson
Christine Jorgenson
Bobby Seale
Jackie Mason
Alan KingAll these folks were beyond a handshake meetings and the list is in no particular order. I’ve also known a number of professional athletes as well as rock and roll performers (I worked in the industry for a number of years. )
TY Avi, I’ll put that in my tomorrow file. My book budget is already exhausted for this month. I mentioned Eliach’s book without checking her voluminous bibliography, I’m sure she has some credible sources listed.
Point of information :Please read ‘There once was a world’ by Yaffa Eliach. She documents some very impressive instances where Germans were killed by Nazis for harboring Jews.
I learned of this book while reading The Coffee Room with my husband and immediately ordered. I don’t recall who mentioned it but thanks, this book is a treasure of history.
I can only off you sympathy and good wishes. This seems to be something that happens more frequently where there are larger groups of Jews living in community. Are there any support groups for divorced Jewish women in your area?
Last March FL gave $2M to private Jewish schools for security, NY state received $25 million this past June, some of the funds were allocated to Hebrew Academy of the Five Towns and Rockaway (HAFTR) and Magen David Yeshivah, just to name a few. (Do a bit of googling to find the entire list of the awardees and amounts, then ask your school what has become of the $$.)
The nonprofit Security Grant Program provides Jewish schools with far more $$ for security enhancements than they do for other religious schools. Separate states also have security funding for schools. Investigate, see if the schools in your town have received any of these funds and how the funding was allocated after it reached the local level.
Whitecar, you seem to live in a very black and white world. Funding local public schools is benefit to society and the community at large. Because I don’t live in your black and white world our community supports school funding via the tax base regardless of party. The impact on homeowners is mitigated by the large tax base in my community (manufacturing, research,service sector, retail etc. )
High desert is quite different than desert RebYidd. Each ecosystem supports different plant and animal life. In CA greasewood is found in the chaparral biome and is a major source of fuel. In areas that haven’t historically burned the vegetation is dense and adapted to drought and low moisture levels. Deserts have vegetation that is much sparser than the chaparral and fires are easily localized.
Because in many areas it is difficult to manage underbrush, the areas are far too remote. Controlled burns are also almost impossible to control in these areas because of unpredictable winds. Many folks think these fires are occurring in lust verdant areas but they are not. High deserts contain an enormous amount of fuel, and frankly no one can control lightning strikes or arsonists. I know several folks whose homes are being threatened by the Holy fire. I once lived in a rural area that was evacuated three days ago. Many of these people have practiced good fire prevention tactics over the years. They’ve cleaned a radius of brush around their property, often plowing or digging fire breaks pre need, roofed with fireproof or fire resistant materials. They also manage to store some water and keep generators on hand for when power goes out and they need to wet down houses and property. But frankly 10, 000 gallons of water don’t last very long when you are dumping it on a property.
Gadolh.. I live in a town where robots are big biz. We’ve got robots making other robots, making hip replacement parts, making the insides of some surgical implants. There is one place that makes them for military application, but they won’t say much else. Most of these places are open for tours.
In 1969 Bobby Seale was gagged and chained during the Chicago 7 trial. Gagging defendants is not unusual and does happen with frequency here in the US. Typically, if facilities permit, disruptive defendants are removed from the courtroom to another room equipped with closed circuit TV where they can review the proceedings.
“Empire of Red Gold” is documentary of how the Chinese have cornered the processed tomato market world wide. That can of tomato paste your spouse used for dinner tonight likely came from China. The tomatoes were grown and processed in China shipped back to different processors in 55 gallon drums and reprocessed (adding, sugar, salt etc) and canned on consumer sized containers. This film also addresses some of the constituents added when the tomatoes are processed into highly concentrated pastes.
Do you mean the ones who assemble automobiles (welding or painting), or help manufacture surgical appliances, the ones that move merchandise in warehouses, the ones who act as the eyes of a building or manufacturing facility or the ones that put together other robots?
Curious, Pence has spoken at meetings to these xtian pacs. He has offered his opinion that contraceptives should be illegal. I do the fact checking before I post. Unfortunately this is a site that doesn’t permit links. I would suggest that you use google, it’s not difficult to find quotes and transcripts of his speeches to these groups. As I mentioned earlier I won’t respond to your straw men, again, you appear to have difficulty responding directly to comments.
Curio, Pence often shares his views on the availability of contraception when in his speeches tofundamentalist xtian PACs. (FRC Action, Xtian Advocates Serving, and AFA just to mention a few. ) Sometime it’s worthy to look at the coverage of these meetings/rallies/fundraiser, the uber xtian press gives them great coverage.
Takes Two, that’s the reason I mentioned it, people need to learn about unsustainably grown farmed fish. These fish are also fed a great many fungicides to keep them ‘healthy’. I read about a sustainable talapia farm out in Montana or South Dakota, a while ago. It’s an interesting operation and bio culture. I’m happy to live where fresh fish are wild, safe and reasonably priced.
I’m with CTL on pet food. As to people food, I’m not going to chance it. I find it interesting that many people who distrust food packaged in China (or in the far east) will still buy talapia farmed in China or salmon farmed and processed in China.
C, I’m going to give you a couple of examples as to why its a waste to address your points. I mention access to contraception, you ignore the fact that the VP is adamant about making contraception illegal and go off about who pays. I mention regulation of insurance, you mention cost, ignoring the fact that states fix prices on insurances sold in their states. You choose to ignore the most recent (today’s) administration edicts on ins. coverage and standards of coverage. Im guessing you choose to respond to topics with generalized straw men I could be wrong, but meh, it’s not going to keep me awake nights.
Have a good day and a pleasant tomorrow.
You will have to get used to the fact that I do not respond item by item in posts. It’s time consuming and frankly I can’t see the point in investing the effort. Individuals here are very very vested in their opinions, a mere post or argument on an internet forum isn’t sufficient to move the hearts and mind of an individual. I’m not here to make converts, insult others or to demean different POVs.
Why bother? YWN doesn’t bother proofreading their stories before publishing them online.
Personally I don’t find realistic immigration policies, regulation of health care, workers rights, maternal wellness, access to contraceptives, tax breaks that are fare to working Americans, pathways to citizenship via military service, asylum for the victims of domestic and political abues et al nefarious. You are free to disagree. Admittedly I do have some biases, I am a first generation American, I feel that the current immigration roundups that target brown skinned people incredibly unfair. My feelings would be tempered if ICE were doing sweeps in Brighton Beach or other enclaves of non caucasian immigrants. And I would feel much differently if our current administration were not mustering out those immigrants who were using military service as a pathway to citizenship. Certainly our president if free to change his mind about chain immigration now that his inlaws have citizenship, but it does make him look a bit two faced.
Oh goodness, talk about a broad brush. Why would anyone think that all democrats are for open borders?? Why would anyone who believes in the democracy that is America want citizens to be shipped to a foreign country simply because they disagree with an individuals politics? Sounds like fascism to me.
First off these are not tattoos. They are merely non permanent decorations. These decorations go back centuries and were not limited to Indians, or Arabic peoples. As mentioned above they are common among some Yemenite Jews. Why not look at some images of them on google to form an opinion? IMHO it’s easy enough to learn how to do these at home.
Unfortunately our President refuses note taking under any circumstance. Since Reagan presidents had full time stenographers following them about to record their conversations and meetings. Heck Nixon had tapes made. President Obama often mentioned that it was cumbersome but helpful, he could always go back to the record. Our current President has no concern for such official record keeping so we only know what he tells us. There is no way anything he says about the conversations he’s had with Putin can be fact checked.
Carmine is a color, perhaps you mean carminic acid that is extracted from cochineal insects to produce the color carmine?
Where I live, which as I have said, is an area with a modern Muslim population, we do see news coverage on a local and state wide basis. There are sites on the internet, Patheos for instance, where their voices are heard as well, the religion section of Huffpo also reports on MMs, sometimes Mojo. Those are three international sites you can search for their reportage.
As to message boards where MMs defend Jews, I’ve never done the Google, it’s never been a concern of mine. But since it is your concern you may want to consider doing the Google and seeing what the results are. Report back with your findings ok?
I’m pretty far left wing, and registered simply to respond to this post. I live in a community with a very diverse population here in the US. Muslims are my neighbors and members of my community. Just like Jews or any other religious group there are individuals who are more modern. My small town has two mosques. One rather conservative and one considerably more modern.
I don’t support fundamentalists of any kind, be they Jews, Xtians, or Moslems. The voice of moderate and modern Mulims is not something that is heard, esp. when it comes to frum publications. I’m pro human.