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While more funding is certainly needed, Joseph’s statement is a disservice to the cause because Jewish Federations across North Amarica have given hundreds of millions of dollars in support of chareidi Jewish educational institutions and programs over the years.
UJM: When as you said that Rav Moshe paskins: “it is assur to talk to the opposite gender in a social context”, does he mean “any talk” or does he allow “bare minimum talk”?
It’s much easier if your food is very fresh.
With Romaine you need to have the attitude that the outer leaves are only the wrapping for the lettuce and discard the first or second layers of leaves without even looking at them.
Then cut away about the lower third of the Romaine (that’s where bugs hang out) and discard.
It’s like having anonymous talk.
Dovid Hamelech had dogs but kept them in a kennel.
A dog is not muktza to its owner.
I think what you’re saying is that you feel bad there are Jewish criminals, not that Jewish criminals should not go to jail.
Parents, please warn children that “cute” animals can be vicious too.
How often do we read of the chochem who climbs over the rail to play with the cute polar bears, but doesn’t live to tell his story.
Also remember that a squirrel is a rat with a cute busy tail.
areivimzehlazeh: Just curious; would you prefer that the two drug suppliers did not go to jail?
yossiea: Excellent observation.
Had I made it that comment, the peanut brains would be all over me.
But now that you have my hascama (although it’s unsigned), watch your back.
cantoresq: I would not have believed your story except for something that happened several months ago:
My brother-in-law lives in Crown Heights and does not drive.
He and my my sister-in-law had a Lavaya in Boro Park at 9AM one morning for a relative and arrive on time in a car service. He sees the place empty and asks the owner if there is another funeral home in the vicinity and was told that there was no other (in fact, there is one with a similar sounding name a few blocks away.
So my brother-in-law asks the owner if he can use the telephone since they did not have a cell phone. The owner tell him to look for one out in the streets (there was none in the area).
End of story: They did not attend the lavaya of their relative because of the jealousy of one funeral home for the business of another.
WOW! Such lomdus, but you’re making me do the work.
How about a summary when you get a chance?
Actually, “holding the door open” is a good barometer for the girl to gage the “boy”, like any other behavior displayed by the “boy”, to see which world he is living in, rather than an halachuk issue.
I was very specific with the Rav.
Like I said before, our G’dolim are not shy when they are ready to issue a directive. Just a few weeks ago, they SIGNED a pronouncement that we raise funds and support the families in our communities who are out of work. Their signatures ring loud and their signed proclamation was inserted into every frum newspaper. This is the manner in which funds are collected from the Jewish community although they certainly target and solicit privately from wealthier individuals.
I think the Japanese government would be much more responsive to a community displaying regret and remorse than the obstinate behavior reflected in your comments.
And it’s also difficult to believe that if a cause is really Emes, than why the need for deceptive and evasive tactics?
ames: That’s a well know speed trap in Flatbush. Also, on Bay Parkway, between Avenue J and McDonald Ave., and Bay Parkway between McDonald and 60th Street.
Joseph: Where have you seen their signatures?
Joseph, gut voch.
Jothar: Your halachik presentations and expertise are quite impressive. I was waiting for Mayan_Dvash’s sources but you came through for him.
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Thanks Joseph, I feel relieved now, however,
1. M’thinks perhaps they should have worked behind the scenes (scene 1; scene 2 scene3) for that big event a while back.
By the way, no one’s approached me for $ yet.
Also, ir would be a good idea to advise your Askanim that instead of campaigning for funds from the community, they should solicit the cartel who are the partners in this enterprise.
Joseph and qwertyuiop: you opened the door by presenting an article written by an interested party and therefore is suspect; especially considering that the young men’s own attorney disputed “facts” stated in the article. And jail conditions are certainly what everyone is yammering about. Do you think that the U.S. federal prison system dorms inmates together because they are friends? Vos noch?
But all this is not the main thrust of my concern. No matter how many times you say it, this is not Pidyon Sh’vuyim. “The roads to hell are paved with good intentions” is a saying quite appropriate here.
Joseph, you say,”The Gedolim, as a rule, work behind the scenes. You can be assured there are many Gedolim involved”
Do you know something that no one else does? Now it’s your turn to present back-up documentation.
And while your askanim are raising the $millions for these three young men from the klal, let them also raise a few more $million for Rabbeim’s salaries that have been held back (Yeshiva tuitions are not being paid due to the economic meltdown).
kapusta: “…what is the purpose of their being innocent or guilty. Point is they are 3 boys who are Jewish just like we are, and that means we are willing to extend a hand to one another…If it was your child…”
Kapusta, I agree, if it were my son, as a parent I would spend every cent I had, whether he was innocent or guilty, to get him home.
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chofetzchaim: “shl’meel”, someone with no mazal,is derived from Shloomiel ben Tzurishaddai, whose parsha is not leined in the above scenario, so “he’s” someone out of luck.
P.S. In addition to the article, a full page ad also appears in the JP. Hmm,makes you wonder.
I can’t fault you guys for trying; but all that means almost nothing. The writers have no documentation and in fact I’ve seen reports that say quite the opposite and coming from much more authoritative sources.
They have spent close to a $million already on attorneys and PR and a lot more spending ($500,000) is planned. Where’s all this money coming from?
When and if the G’dolim demonstrate a unified effort and instruct K’lal Yisroel, I will act accordingly. And this does not mean an ad from someone stating that we should send our checks to various Rabbonim and Roshei Yeshiva. In the mean time, I do respect your efforts, but I’ve been around a bit longer than you and have seen similar MO’s. I will agree though that I don’t think they realized the seriousness of what they were doing, or the consequences if they were caught.
Welcome h2; you’re gonna find out that we’re all a bit confused and need help.
gavra_at_work: I know that Gemorra, but it’s not so poshit and I was trying to make it work; i.e.; The Satan and the Malach Hamaves are distinctive entities with missions whereas the Yetzer Hara is a personal force.
So Joseph, if that’s how you feel, then what are you doing to be m’kayim this “Mitzvah Rabba”? And what are the Gedolim doing? I haven’t heard anything from them.
Joseph, that’s all fine in the perfect world when we are in our land with our Sanhedren. And even then, B’dinei Adom they may be Patur, but not necessarily B’dinei Shamayim. And we have Dina D’malchusa issues; Chillul Hashem issues; Sh’vichas Domim issues; not to mention that because of them now all Yeshiva bochrim and other frum looking people are thoroughly scrutinized.
ThinkStraight: “If things just happen to come up at lighting time, then you know it’s the yetzer hora!”
I think you mean “it’s the Satan!” The Satan works much harder on erev Shabbos to find things for us to do and cause Chillul Shabbos and also gets very involved in Shalom Bais issues.
I once heard of a “s’gula” for Shalom Bais for Shabbos: Sharpen your knives erev Shabbos by rubbing two knife blades against each another. I thought of a “s’vara” for this “s’gula”. Anyone want to venture an opinion?
Thanks for addressing the issues everyone. It’s always nice talking to the wall.
From many of your posts it seems that the real villains here are the “boy”s’ mothers. How could they allow their young children to go off all by their own little lone selves to a far away country? Such neglect and abuse! Look world, not only did they not do anything wrong, the “bochrim” were actually engaged in doing a mitzvah at the time, a Jewish commandment, so lay off all you Jew haters!
I think my “mea culpa”, however heartfelt, was a bit premature.
So we say to them that when you rob or murder or rape, you are no longer a child and you are responsible for your crime.
You are all right and I’m glad you responded in the way you did, but I’m not an angel and I’m just telling you what’s in my heart, however, wrong.
By not telling it exactly the way it is, some people out there will say that other parts are also not true.
I think it’s a disservice to the integrity of the case to call them “boys” when they are now longer teenagers and a Chillel Hashem to refer to them as “bochrim”.
While everything possible needs to be done to effect their release from this Anti-Semetic country, I can’t help but think that especially in these very hard economic times, when family breadwinners are losing their parnosas, that we are using vast amounts of our very limited resources for criminals rather than for those emesdik children who we need to feed and clothe and house.
lakewoodwife: ask your own LOR, but mine said that if I make a trip or quad recipe I should take Challah without a Brocha.
Many years ago, I spoke to Rav Moshe Feinstein ZT”L about this issue.
He told me that while in the best case situation children should follow parental advice regarding shidduchim, but ultimately, the child is not m’chuyav to obey the parents if they are opposed to the match.
Of course, the given here is that both the boy and girl are definitely Yidden.
Jothar: “Anything stupid is assur- the Rov”.
“.. but this line could be used to assur anything you don’t like. I think chazzanus is stupid. Chazzanus is now assur. Great quote, thanks!”
Jothar, yes but the Rav did not say that Chazzanus was stupid. He did say, however, that it was wrong for chazzonim to repeat words during t’fila.
From the looks of things, you probably don’t care for chazzonis (neither does my wife unless its at a live concert) so it might be assur for you to listen to chazzonis if it’s going to give you tzar.
I think Rav Moshe approves of timers when used for electric lights but not for other purposes.
Also, the “Yisroel” in “Chalav Yisroel” is a camera focused on the cow(s)while the Yid sits at home watching the milking. So why the exorbitant prices?
Jothar: You continue to attribute to me that which I never said. Please don’t put words on my mouth and don’t second guess what I did not say.
Gavra_at_work posted a machshava why Rav Dovid Cohen may have labeled Yiddish “holy”. So I agreed that it may have been Rav Dovid Cohen’s reasoning. But I don’t know for sure.
I don’t question my Rav’s pronouncements and likewise if Rav Dovid Cohen calls Yiddish “holy”, I don’t question him either and, anyhow, it’s really not that vital an issue for me. Had Rav Dovid Cohen or my Rav said that Yiddish was not “holy”, that would have been ok with me too. But since a Godol B’Torah and a Tzaddik labeled Yiddish “holy”, who am I to disagree?
Now I will also agree with you, if this is what you meant: that there is an issue of semantics here; where something is called “holy”, meaning a higher spiritual level of purity; but not actual Kedusha.
So my opinion is that all things being equal: A piece of Torah in Yiddish is of a purer level than when said in English. However, Yiddish devoid of its religiosity or Torah has no status when compared to English with Torah.
Mayan_Dvash: Please support your claim.
gavra_at_work: agreed
Mayan_Dvash: You’re right, when the Sanzer Rav zt”l, and gedolim in EY, and other gedolim past and present, honestly puts divrei kedusha to “goyishe” tunes, it gets elevated. Not when oisvarfs put divrei kedusha to music.
heimesheyid: very good, very funny.
Jothar: in fact, I have learned large portions of the sefer.
There is no Halacha with regard to Yiddish over any other language, i.e., it’s assur to talk during davining whether in English, Yiddish or Lashon Hakodesh.
As gavra_at_work pointed out earlier, the gemorra considers ancient Greek to be on a higher level of kedusha than other goyish languages. Yiddish of course had not yet evolved in Talmudic times.
So while there is no language on the holy level of Loshon Hakodesh or even ancient Greek, Yiddish is considered “holy” in the abstract for all the reasons shown previously.
It’s one thing when a Tzaddik or a Rebbe is m’kadeish a tune from the street; or a Carlbach niggun; or adapts a waltz or a peasant’s song.
When T’fila is sung to Goyish tunes, you are in all likelyhood also thinking of the goyish words rather than the t’fila exclusively.
rabbiofberlin; Jothar: Rav Dovid Cohen has written many s’farim. If you don’t know who he is then ask your Rav or any Posek.
So if you have any questions, why don’t you either call the Rav or buy the sefer and learn it. You wanted to know “Vi steit?”; well here you have a whole sefer vi steit.
I think if you’re going or coming to work and you wear jeans to work, then it would be acceptable, b’d’eved.
But, otherwise, it seems disrespectful to me to come so casually dressed (and certainly not in rumpled/soiled white shirt; jacket; slacks) to G-d’s house and to beseech Him in prayer (it only takes a few minutes to change from casual/comfortable to appropriate attire).
In the sefer, Rav Dovid Cohen includes the origins of scores of Yiddish phrases and expressions in Tanach, Medrish and Gemara.
While my memory is hazy on this, I recall years ago that the last Lubavitcher Rebbe remarked that Yidden should keep books in their homes written in Yiddish, whether of a religious nature or not. Lulavitchers: Is this correct? Or was it just books written with Hebrew letters?
Bracha for Ames: Du zalst zein matzliach b’chol inyanim. All the best!