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Complete the following sentence-
Son, I’m concerned that you’re wearing jeans because _________.
I assume they have good reasons, but it is not readily apparent to me what good can come from a debate like this.
PY wrote: “JAG and Jewess, I am not kidding, as it is no worse than any other solution that has so far been put forth, and this one can actually work, if people really want to end the crisis.”
Instead of asking if you are joking, I’ll ask this- are you trying to satirize the other solutions that have so far been put forth?
No.
I have a serious question, which is Pashuteh Yid, are you serious?
Now that I look at it in a different light- good one.
Who cares? Arabic is a language. Its taught lots of places.
And by the way yw editor, as predictable as your response was, Obama doesn’t determine what’s taught in Chicago classrooms. But of course, this is step 1 in his effort to remake the U.S. as an islamic republic, right?
neatfreak’s point makes no sense. He’s entitled to free food but someone born in another country who is here legally is not?
As for illegals being able to get food stamps, that is simply not correct. Here’s a link that shows that, if the moderators allow it.
http://www.ssa.gov/pubs/10101.html#who
Do illegals get benefits by fraud? sure. Do Americans get benefits by fraud? sure.
hss- neatfreak wasn’t talking about illegals. He said non-u.s. citizens. There are non-u.s. citizens who are here legally and may be eligible for foodstamps. Illegals are not.
neatfreak- how is a non-u.s. citizen receiving benefits any more stealing than a u.s. citizen getting food and medical insurance that other people pay for. I’m not saying that I think non-citizens should be able to get the benefits- I’m not really sure how I feel. But I don’t understand why one is stealing and the other is not. Both are getting something.
MM- you say you have no beef with Bemused but you speak in a very disrespectful and inappropriate matter.
I’m entitled to be a curmudgeon.
Mazca- I can no longer follow your train of thought vis a vis materialsitic society and whatnot.
Mybat- where did I say that we should be comfortable and flaunt anything? The original poster asked about Argentina, Brazil, Venezuela and the U.S. and I said I think the U.S. is better than the first three. That doesn’t mean the U.S. isn’t golus, or that Jews here shouldn’t be vigilant, it just addresses the initial post.
Do you disagree?
Mazca- why did you ask a question asking for people’s opinions if you don’t want answers. You asked, I gave an opinion, and now you misattribute thoughts I have to myself.
Since you ask why do I feel so secure in the United STates, I’ll answer again.
First, I never said I feel so secure. Please show me where in my short post I did. You asked about Venezuela, Brazil, Aregentina and the U.S. and I said that I think its better in the U.S.
Why do I think that? Well, we’ve had large communities of Yidden flourishing for years, we have Yidden (maybe not your kind of Yidden, but Yidden nonethteless) in prominent powerful political positions and throught private industry. Prominent Members of the U.S. Senate, house of representatives, U.S. Supreme Court are Jewish. How about in Venezuela, Brazil, Argentina.
If you don’t want to hear anyone’s answer, why ask a question.
I’ll suggest that one should be more worried about anti-semitism in Brazil and Argentina (where they have the descendants of Nazi’s who fled europe) and Venezuela, where they are led by ahmadinjead’s buddy, than in the United States, where there may be plenty of anti-semitism, but there are also better legal protections.
I have great respect for the moderators who do an excellent job with a very important task. I happen to feel thought, that my above post which indicates that it was edited, was edited such that the meaning is lost. Thus, I ask that people not consider it and respond to it. That said, I am not pleading with the moderator to reconsider his decision, who is always reasonable.
Bemused- I think you’re willfully misunderstanding cantoresq’s comment.
But Good Shabbos to you as well.
The Torah, the Gemara, etc., are all complex. They require interpretation. If they weren’t, there’d be nothing to learn. When people post here, they are posting their specific selections, and thereby inject an extra layer of interpretation into the discussion.
MM, why don’t you clarify- does the Gemara you rely on refer only to a full time learner, or does it cover anyone who manages to squeeze in some time in the Bais Hamedrash?
EDITED
Bemused- I’ll wait for cantoresq to chime in and defend himself, but in my opinion, cantoresq made the reasonable assumption that what MM was saying was that a woman who is waiting for a husband to come home from the Bais Hamidrash is waiting for a full-time learner, ergo, waiting for someone to come home from work won’t warrant a place in the Olam Haboh. Second, you insist that there are scholars and non-scholars who go to the Bais HaMedrash. Why make this distinction? If you have a husband who works and then learns after work, call him a scholar? He’s engaged in scholarship isn’t he? If he was also a part-time plumber, would you say, how dare you call him a plumber, he’s only plumbing when he’s not learning.
Your post doesn’t clear anything up, it just reiterates the mistake you already made.
All cantoresq did was interpret, either correctly or incorrectly, MM’s position, which itself could be construed as offenseive, i.e., only a woman who supports a learner merits a place in the world to come.
Esterh, well said.
Bemused- I think you need to read carefully- cantoresq merely asked a question of MM. I think cantoresq agrees with you. Cantoresq’s question does not imply what you think it does. Scholar is a compliment, and I for one, am happy to call someone who goes to the Beis Hamedrash, whether for an hour after work, or all day, a scholar. I can’t make heads or tails of why you are offended.
We came and learned English (otherwise the YWN would be in German, Russian, Polish or Yiddish for most of us)
I think the posts on this website suggest that the learning of english was pretty minimal.
MM- I don’t really disagree, but we need surgeons. They get compensated for it. What’s the problem?
Jothar- a top surgeon may be well compensated, but he also helps people and saves lives and although not sitting in the Beis Midrash, I would say that he spends his day engaged in mitzvos.
hss- I’m very disturbed by your post where you say you wouldn’t mind them so much if they would become American. I guess you think that’s ok for you to say, but what if wasps felt the same way about Jews- I wouldn’t mind them so much if they would become American- you know, go to public schools, stop living amongst themselves, dressing differently, eating different foods, and why do they have to leave work early on friday and take all of these days off in the fall? Don’t they know they’re in America now?
We were once strangers in the land of Egypt. In America too, for that matter.
MM- where did I disagree?
Ben Melech- I challenge you to show a real situation where someone earning a salary ends up with a net of less money than someone earning a lower salary. I’m not talking about situations where child care, transportation and other attendant expense make working not worthwhile. I understand that happens. I’m talking about a situation where taxes and government programs alone end up giving the non-earner, or low earner more after tax income.
MM- then why is someone who previously neglectful of hygiene but then cleans up only doing it to ingratiate himself with the opposite gender?
MM- a) why would you do that and b) why would that lower the cost of school?
MM wrote “Since the guy is acting different than he would have (whether showering or whatever) if he was in a guy only environment, it is clear that his reason is to try to ingratiate himself with nearby people of the opposite gender. That is objectionable according to our Torah traditions.”
This is absurd. First, people should maintain proper hygiene, at all times, regardless of whether they are in a mixed environment or not. When you walk around dirty and smelly and are identifiable as a Jew, you make a chilul Hashem. Second, just because the presence of women might alert someone that its not acceptable to go around with bad body odor, whereas they’d be oblivious only among men, does not mean that the only reason that they wake up and clean up is to “ingratiate himself with nearby people of the opposite gender.” It is proper to maintain good hygiene and whatever alerts someone to that is a good thing. There is absolutely nothing in our Torah traditions that requires anyone to maintain themselves in a state where they are repulsive to the other gender. Nothing at all. Maintain standards of tznius, of course. But let your hygiene go- no way.
yswo- I don’t know where you live, but if you do end up buying a gun (which I do not recommend, but I sense your mind is made up), please make sure that you educate yourself about the applicable ownership/possession/carry laws for your jurisdiction. They can be both very complicated and very harsh if violated, particularly in New York and New Jersey. While I don’t want anyone to be accidentally shot with your gun, I also don’t want you to wind up in jail because of a paperwork problem that can be avoided.
Josh31- what funding is good enough for the Kavod of Torah?
The public bus problem described by the OP, is what I refer to as the “world problem.”
Everyone should make sure they are not missing out on the earned income tax credit.
Jothar- I’m not sure what you mean that animals don’t have to work to have their food. They don’t have jobs, and they don’t have to shop at supersol, but certain animals have to “work” very hard to track down the food they eat.
Jothar- it doesn’t matter if the studies show that the boys do better without girls around, if you’re trying to teach them a skill that they’d need to replicated in a mixed workplace.
MM- I don’t want to speak for truthsharer, but there is such a thing as historical research that might be written about in a book. To say that a book is not such a book, requires no chutzpa whatsoever.
Jewess, Jewishandworking22, etc.,
I had always understood that quote to be a paraphrasing of the highest degree of Tzedaka on the Rambam’s ladder.
“over those with a narrow world view”
Like HaRav Elya Svei? HaRav Ahron Kotler? HaRav Boruch Ber Liebowitz? HaRav Elchonon Wasserman?
In the practice of law in New York state and federal courts? Yes.
In Torah, and overall understanding of Hashem and the world, not even close.
I am not oblivious to them because I am a well educated professional and draw on the totality of my education to creatively solve my clients problems every day, without compartmentalizing, oh, this question comes from my torts class, this one from 3rd grade math. I draw on a lot of sources in helping my clients and it gives me an advantage over those with a narrow world view.
I disagree. Accountants deal with tax laws and advise people with tax problems. Tax laws are made by politicians. I’d prefer an accountant with a little understanding about how laws are made and how the tax laws come about.
Much as Yidden must remain a nation apart, the world is inter-connected, and a professional, to remain competitive, must be well-educated.
I would need to know what you think is unnecessary.
Joseph- why do you think those courses are unnecessary and unrelated to trades?
Trades do not exist in a vacuum. Professionals help people with real world problems, and therefore need to know about that world. If you own a widget factory and need an accountant, lawyer, etc., and find a frum accountant who says, I’d love to be your accountant and I’m a great accountant, but I don’t know what a widget is, are you going to hire him?
And now they don’t dress that way, so its distinctive and identifies someone as Jewish.
No businessmen, except frum yidden, wear large Borsalino hats. Goyische and secular businessmen wear different color suits, shirts, shoes, etc.
Anyone who works in business in NY could pick out a frum Jew vs. a gentile “suit” 10 times out of ten, even without the kippah.
Dveykus613, english translation, por favor.
Joseph- fair enough, but I do my part to get them to not think that by not actually thinking that.
To get back on track, nobody has explained to me why this action is anti-semitic. If an FBI agent investigating trafficking in weapons poses as a Russian gangster who’d like to buy weapons, is that anti-Russian?
If the possible anti-semitism depends on an assumption that an Israeli looking to buy secrets would be believable, I think you’re reaching. Everyone knows that Israeli’s are players in the international spy game- the operation cleverly played on the gentile scientists belief that Israeli’s might plausibly be interested in paying him.
“Do you think when these officers are in the bar or privacy of their clubs they are complimenting us?”
I think (and my thinking is based on working with police in my professional capacity, and counting one goyische police officer as a personal friend (no, I don’t eat in his house or attend his church)) that a few of them who’ve patrolled a Jewish neighborhood for a longtime have a certain admiration for the community and way of life, others are wholly indifferent and don’t compliment or denigrate us one way or the other, and then a third group dislikes us. Of course, the size of this third group would increase in size if they came to believe that every time a Jew thanks them and gives them a plaque and applauds their work with their community, the Jew is really thinking to himself, I hope this dumb goyische kup is falling for this, as I know he’d just as soon stab me in the back, but until Moschiach comes, I need his protection, so I hope he doesn’t catch on to how false this whole charade is.
Joseph- glad to see we’re in agreement regarding Rush (somewhat) and Giuliani (as well as the purpose of wearing black and white, see, some other thread), but you still haven’t answered my question- are the police and firefighters and other who attend these ceremonies that YWN photographs and covers supposed to understand that the Jewish position is that every gentile is an anti-semite?
Why is it wrong for an FBI agent to pose an Israeli in order to catch a gentile American who is willing to sell out American secrets for money?
Can someone explain it to me in rational terms?