Forum Replies Created
AZ -“How does LE accurately determine who the good guy with a guy is in a matter of a split second.”
That just happened in Queens. The perp had a fake gun, but the cops killed a detective & shot his partner!
“For a civilian in a situation with elevated adrenaline levels this may be impossible.”
You’re right. I don’t own a gun, but if I bought one – it would be a shotgun. They even have them in pistol form.
Ubiq -“Oh and FYI Illinois 8th in gun control and 31st in gun deaths so all in all a safer place to live than Missouri.”
People don’t live in states per se, they live in cities. Chicago is the number 7 on the list of murders, in cities with the population of over 500 thousand.
“guns are easily purchased in neighboring Missouri”
That’s not the problem. If these perps wouldn’t get it there they would get it elsewhere!
There’s a problem in the US with illegal guns – it not just drugs.
M -“Does anyone here have any ideas?”
Buy a machete. It’s a lot cheaper than a gun.
CA -“Amazon out socialism in”
Actually it’s Not socialism, but Communism!
Communism in theory makes e/o equal. But you see how that worked out in all the Commy countries!
Eg. – the NY Governor & NYC Mayor were willing to give tax breaks to Amazon in return for them to create jobs. This would create more NY Tax dollars.
The Commies in the Democrat party refused to even consider that proposal, because e/o has to be on an equal basis, no matter how logical the proposal was!
Obviously you’ll see what I’m posting is accurate from the this article.
You’ll also see that Shlomo Hamelech thought it was important to know where Krias Yam Suf was!
“Chariot Wheels litter the bottom of the Red Sea.
Horse bones discovered in the Red Sea off Neweiba Beach. Many human and horse bones have been recovered from the bottom of the Red Sea. What other evidence is there that an army was destroyed by water?
The story began in 1978 when a man by the name of Ron Wyatt chartered a small air-plane and was flying over the Sea of Aqaba south of Israel. Wyatt was a part-time Bible explorer who was in the area on some archeological research at the sites of Sodom and Gomorrah along side of the Dead Sea.
As he flew over Neweiba Beach he commented to the pilot — “That looks like the area the Bible describes where Moses was trapped between the Red Sea and Pharaoh’s army. I need to go down there and take a closer look.”
Wadi WatirNeweiba Beach, Egypt, is now a resort area along the coast of the Sea of Aqaba (Red Sea).
When Wyatt drove to Neweiba Beach, he had to go through a long winding canyon called the Wadi Watir. He recalled how that Pharaoh had said — “They are entangled in the land, the wilderness has shut them in.” (Exodus 14:3)
Once Moses and the Hebrews entered into the canyon there was no escape. Soon the million or so escaping slaves were crowded onto a sandy beach. Before them lay the Red Sea. Behind them came one of the most powerful armies in the world. They were trapped between the mountains and the Red Sea.
The steep canyon sides of the Wadi Watir leading to Neweiba Beach, Egypt.
Pharaoh’s army pursued thinking that an easy massacre was just hours away. They were right! But Pharaoh and his commanders had no way of knowing that they would be the ones destroyed by walls of water that loomed up nearly 900 feet on either side of them.
Pillar marking the crossing site of the Exodus.
When Mr. Wyatt arrived at Neweiba Beach he soon found evidence that this was, in fact, the very spot where Moses and his followers crossed the Red Sea. A huge stone column was found lying in the water and the inscription had long been washed away. But an identical column found across the Red Sea had Hebrew writing giving glory to the God of Israel who delivered His people through the Red Sea. It is believed that King Solomon erected those columns as a permanent memorial of the Exodus!
An identical column was found on the opposite side of the Red Sea along the coast of the ancient land of Midian which is now Saudi Arabia.
Chariot Wheels in the Red Sea have been discovered. Mr. Wyatt reasoned that if this were truly the site of the Red Sea Exodus, there could be evidence in the waters. What he was about to find was truly remarkable!
Wyatt began investigating underwater off the coast of Neweiba Beach. One of the first things he found was a beautiful gold plated chariot wheel, very fragile but clearly visible in the clear waters of the Red Sea!
Later, Wyatt and his sons found numerous other man-made artifacts and chariot wheels. The shapes of the battle debris were still intact because coral had attached themselves to the wood, preserving evidence of the historical accuracy of the Biblical account of the Exodus and the destruction of Pharaoh’s army, estimated to be as many as 250,000 soldiers and horse drawn chariots.
Coral encrusted chariot wheel found in the water of the Red Sea.
Four, six and eight-spoked wheels were found in the Red Sea. These wheels were typical of the wheels used in the 18th Dynasty at the time of Moses and the Red Sea Exodus.
Man-made axle and wheel found in the waters of the Red Sea.Artists rendering of the wooden spokes and axle, now gone but the shape has been preserved by coral!
4 and 6 Spoked Wheels From The 5th Dynasty of Egypt:
Typical chariot wheel from the 18th Dynasty of Egypt, the time of Moses and the Exodus.
Wyatt recovered the hub of a wheel with the remains of eight spokes and gave this significant find to Nassif Mohammed Hassan, Director of Antiquities in Cairo. Mr. Hassan immediately identified the artifact as a chariot wheel dating over 3500 years ago during the 18th Dynasty, the only time the ancient Egyptians used an eight-spoked wheel. The hub and spokes are on display in Cairo, Egypt.
Coral attached themselves to the remains of the chariots and preserved them for 3500 years!
Mr. Wyatt commented that the bottom of the Red Sea was littered like a junk yard.
Who would have ever thought that such significant evidence would be preserved for nearly 3,500 years!
An excellent book and DVD are available detailing recent scientific research that has verified Mr. Wyatt’s discoveries. “The Exodus Case” is available at Amazon.DVD “The Exodus Revealed” is available at Amazon.
Underwater land bride stretching across the Red Sea. This remarkable excape route provided by God is nearly 200 yards wide!Wyatt also discovered that there was an under-water causeway or land bridge stretching from the shores of Neweiba Beach, across the deep waters
of the Red Sea to Saudi Arabia, the ancient land of Midian where Moses and his people gathered at Mount Sinai. The land bridge provided by the Lord for His people, slopes gently down to almost 900 feet before going back up to the other side! Imagine walls of water 900 feet high . . . little wonder that Pharaoh’s army was totally destroyed!
Underwater land bride through the Red Sea!
Finding the crossing site was the key in locating the real Mount Sinai in the land of Midian.
For hundreds of years, people thought that Mount Sinai was located in the southern tip of the of the Sinai Peninsula (see red “X” above. But after many archaeological digs in the area, it has been concluded that there was never an encampment there.”
There is a video that follows Bnai Yisroel out of Egypt. The Yam Suf is the Gulf of Aqaba. Then they went to Saudi Arabia, where they got the Torah on Har Sinai. It’s the Southwestern part of the country.
DY -“I bet there are some convincing anti-vax videos as well.”
Actually the Anti-vaxxed movement is Not that cheap. They made a real movie called “Vaxxed”. Those guys have Big Bucks behind them.
The Anti-vaxxed movie is just people talking; but the Har Sinai Vid you actually see the 2-toned mountain & the whole area.
Seeing is Believing!
GH -“As far as “gold dust”, the area has been home to traders for thousands of years so you’d probably have to look hard to find some area w/o traces of gold dust”
I know it’s hard to believe, but I just saw the video on YouTube.
The guy who made the vid believes in the old testament. He’s scared that Muslims will destroy the area. He’s probably a x-tian.
Btw, it’s probably the place where the Egel was burnt, because it’s only there, not everwhere where there is Gold Dust!
keeto123 -“Har Sinai is in Saudi Arabia … and off limits without connections to the gov.”
I hate to bring up old things, But you’re RIGHT!
I just saw a video – the top part of the mountain is black. (Very weird IMHO).
The Saudi prince is building an underground city there – the size larger than NYC.
What is very much, what I’d consider a proof, in that video, where the guy says where the Egel was, they found gold dust. There isn’t a gold mine in the area.
Kalman. M -“I don’t think you read the actual study”
1. Who are you talking to?
2. And which post?
3. Are you an Anti-Vaxxer or a Pro – vaxxer?
From the News on the West Coast:
From the “Daily Beast”:
“Parents Are at War Over Measles Outbreak”
“One mom vented: ‘Honestly what is wrong with people? Let’s eradicate a disease—but then bring it back just for fun because we’re a stupid society!’”
please read this month Z’Man article on this topic.”
I don’t get the Zman. If you have a point – Post it!
SCS -“It appears from our Jewish orthodox leaders, the answer is clearly NO”
IDK about other towns, but here in Lakewood they only removed the kids from schools during the Measles epdemic. It’s probably the same everywhere. You could send your kid to Jewish school even if they aren’t vaxxed!
Now that we have over 1800 posts on this topic – Why do we have epidemics of Measels in the Frum communties? These Anti-Vaxxers should Not be allowed in Frum schools!
2scents -“More from older textbooks.
Those that are advocating against vaccines have the luxury of not being exposed to these terrible diseases only because of vaccines.
Dr. H. Richardiere
Well – Now that we have Anti-vaxxers – we Now have a resurgence of Pertussis (Whooping Cough).
The Gov. switched to DTaP, instead of DTP.
“A Shot at the Dark – DPT vs DTaP
Everyone knows that the DPT vaccine caused a lot of vaccine injuries, right?
“I got interested in the topic of vaccines way back in medical school. A friend of mine convinced me to read a book about vaccines, and it ended up being a very anti-vaccine book. It was all about an old vaccine called the DTP vaccine that we don’t use anymore. But the book talked a lot about the risks and the dangers of that vaccine. The author of that book was calling for that vaccine to no longer be used.
A number of years later, it turns out that they did discover that vaccine was causing a lot of very severe, life-threatening, even fatal side effects, so they did end up taking that vaccine off the market.
So it kind of opened my eyes to the fact that there are some very severe, fortunately very rare, side effects to vaccines, and I wanted to learn more about this issue. I started reading a lot more books.”
Bob Sears, MD on The Vaccine War
After all, it was after reports of those vaccine injuries, including seizures and encephalitis, that led to:
lawsuits and many pharmaceutical companies to stop making vaccines
the DPT: Vaccine Roulette special airing on TV
Barbara Loe Fisher, believing that her child was damaged by the DPT vaccine, forming the Dissatisfied Parents Together organization (she later changed the name to the National Vaccine Information Center), and writing the book DPT: A Shot in the Dark (this is the anti-vaccine book that Bob Sears is talking about above)
the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Act passing in 1986, creating the National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program and the Vaccine Court
the DTaP vaccine replacing the DTP vaccine
But were those reports true?
And did they ever really discover that the DPT “vaccine was causing a lot of very severe, life-threatening, even fatal side effects,” which led to them “taking that vaccine off the market” as Dr. Bob said?
A Shot at the Dark
It is easy to think that they were true, as we don’t use the DTP vaccine anymore.
But was it ever “taken off the market?”
“During the period of transition from use of whole-cell DTP to DTaP, whole-cell DTP is an acceptable alternative to DTaP for any of the five doses. For the first four doses, whole-cell DTP combined with Hib vaccine (DTP-Hib vaccine) is an acceptable alternative to DTaP and Hib vaccine administered at separate sites.”
ACIP on Pertussis Vaccination: Use of Acellular Pertussis Vaccines Among Infants and Young Children Recommendations of the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices
No, it was replaced by a newer vaccine – DTaP.
And actually, it is still used in some parts of the world.
The whole-cell DTP vaccine did cause more side effects than the newer DTaP vaccine, but we are talking about relatively mild side effects, like local reactions, pain, and fever. And while that it is good, it comes at a cost, a less effective vaccine.
What about epilepsy and encephalitis?
After all of the scare about the DPT vaccine, studies quickly showed that it didn’t cause all of the bad side effects that folks say it did.
After all of the scare about the DPT vaccine, studies quickly showed that it didn’t cause all of the bad side effects that folks say it did.
One clue that the DTP vaccine didn’t cause many of the problems that were blamed on it, is that the same vaccine lawsuits that were succeeding in driving vaccine manufacturers out of business in the United States, were failing in the UK.
“Where given effects, such as serious neurological disease or permanent brain damage, occur with or without pertussis vaccination, it is only possible to assess whether the vaccine is a cause, or more precisely a risk factor, when the background incidence of the disease is taken into account. The question therefore is, does the effect occur more often after pertussis vaccination than could be expected by chance?”
Justice Jeremy Stuart-Smith
There is also the fact that many children who were originally thought to have been vaccine injured after their DPT vaccine are now known to have Dravet syndrome.
Without a diagnosis, Cossolotto said, she would probably still believe — erroneously — that the DPT shot caused Michaela’s illness. “I understand this is a genetic condition,” she said. “Having an answer does make a difference.”
Medical mystery: Seizures strike baby after routine vaccine
And then there are the reports and studies that found:
no association with brain injury, epilepsy, SIDS, or infantile spasms
no increased risk for serious neurological illness in the week after getting vaccinated with DPT
no increased risk for encephalopathy in the 90 days after receiving DTP and MMR vaccines
no difference in severe reactions after DPT vs DTaP, including encephalopathy, seizures, and allergic reactions
So no, the DPT vaccine was never really as dangerous as folks said or thought it was, despite what you might read or hear in anti-vaccine books or news reports.
What to Know About the Safety of the DPT Vaccine
Misconceptions about the risks and safety of the DPT vaccine created the modern anti-vaccine movement and unfortunately, continues to influence many people.”
DTP lasts longer than DTaP!
From NIH Online:
“Long-term Protection: Differences between DTP and DTaP
Although DTaP vaccines wane rapidly, an important issue was whether long-term protection, particularly during pertussis outbreaks, differed among individuals who had only received DTaP and those who received DTP. To address this, we investigated whether pertussis risk during the California epidemic differed among teenagers according to vaccine type (DTP/DTaP) received in infancy and early childhood. This case-control study included subjects born between 1994 through 1999, spanning the transition from DTP to DTaP vaccines, who had received their first 4 pertussis vaccines in KPNC. Teenagers (10–17 y old in 2010) who had received 4 doses of DTaP during the first two years of life were approximately 6 times more likely to be PCR positive for pertussis than were those who had received 4 doses of DTP (OR 5.6, 95% CI 2.6–12.5).69 Further, each additional DTaP received instead of DTP was associated with, on average, a 40% increased risk of pertussis (OR 1.4 95% CI 1.2–1.6). This study demonstrated that DTaP provided substantially less long-term protection against pertussis during the California outbreak.”January 31, 2019 2:32 pm at 2:32 pm in reply to: If Nassi is wrong, how do you explain why 1000’s of older girls are stil single? #1671720
chugibugi -The real reason for the so called SHIDUCH crisis with so many older single girls,is a very simple one and everybody knows it but hasn’t the guts to come out and say it.
the reason is a simple one ” a large percentage of boys in the frum so called chareidi circles are just not marriageable material,in other words they are simply boys with problems either off the derech either completely or half ways or just not frum enough or have problems with either “drinking or drugs or mental issues etc,etc”
Your post emplifies the crux of the problem.
If you would have said severe mental problems – that could be a correct point.
But what you said shows where the real problem is – Not Frum Enough or Drink a little bit or some mental issues. You post – Not marriagable material!
This is nothing New in this World; just Nowadays they label everything.
In the older times there wasn’t these LABELS.
The Unfortunate thing is they only Label Men/boys, Not Women/girls.
They are both equal & this has been going on for generations!
I wouldn’t be surprised if actually Women/girls have more problems, and because of the Goody – Two -Shoes – it’s Well HIDDEN.
Doomsday -“This is Fake News MANUFACTURED Hysteria about an illness nobody was concerned about years ago.”
Another Lie! You Anti-vaxxers have pushed many in the Frum community not to Vaxx & Nowadays there is nothing to worry about!
This is very much far from the Truth.
The Frum community & their schools don’t tolerate TV & unfiltered internet in peoples’ homes.
But they tolerate Non-vaxxers – which are spreading diseases!
Here is the Truth:
“Measles Morbidity and Mortality in the Developed World are Greater than
the Public Perceives.
James D. Cherry, MD, MSc, FIDSA1
and Ulrich Heininger, MD2
Diseases, University of California, Los Angeles, David Geffen School of Medicine, Los
Angeles, California, 2
University of Basel Children’s Hospital, Basel, Switzerland
Session: 233. Clinical: Respiratory Track
Saturday, October 7, 2017: 12:30 PM
Background. Measles mortality and morbidity are staggering in the developing
world partly because of widespread malnutrition. In the U.S. and other developed
countries, individuals with compromised cellular immunity from immune-suppres-
sive treatments and HIV are also at increased risk of measles complications; however
measles is perceived by many as a routine childhood illness of little consequence.
Misinformation about alleged risks of measles containing vaccines (MCV) has led to
continued endemic and epidemic measles in the developed world.
Methods. Present CDC data and data published by one of us (JDC) are reviewed
for measles morbidity and mortality. The categories examined included: deaths,
encephalitis, subacute sclerosing panencephalitis (SSPE) and post measles immune
amnesia (PMIA). Data are presented as rates per 100,000 per year and are stratified by
age, sex and degree of immune competence.
Results. The following approximate numbers per 100,000 cases in immunocom-
petent persons were determined: deaths – 200; encephalitis – 100; SSPE – 100; PMIA
– 12. Ratios for death and SSPE were higher in males and in infants. The infant with
measles will have an overall risk of a severe outcome (death, SSPE or encephalitis of
1:215). Similarly, the risk in an older child would be 1:379. The risk in males is greater
than in females. The risk for death due to PMIA is small; however, the risk of specific
diseases such as pneumonia and meningitis are considerable.
Conclusion. Measles is endemic and epidemic in Europe, much of Asia, and in
Africa. Therefore, importations into the U.S. will continue to occur and non-immune
persons will get measles.
To prevent the extended morbidity and mortality as described, and to protect those
who cannot receive a MCV, extended immunization efforts need to be carried out in
the U.S. These efforts include: giving the second dose of a measles, mumps, rubella
(MMR) vaccine at 15 months rather than 4–6 years, fill immunization gaps by seeing
that they all have received 2 doses of a MCV or have demonstrated serum antibody to
measles virus in adults, and discourage travel to measles endemic and epidemic areas
by all persons who are not immune (infants < 1 yr of age and persons who have not
received 2 doses of vaccine or have evidence of measles serum antibody).”
doomsday -“Health, Do you work for VAXOPEDIA?”
“If not, why do you keep posting quotes from VAXOPEDIA or other Pro-Vax Websites?”
Because they speak the Truth!
“Or maybe you work for Pharmaceutical Company?”
“Pharmaceutical is a TRILLION Dollar Industry – Biggest, Most Powerful Industry IN THE WORLD!”
Why do you constantly repeat yourself?
“Health, Vaxopedia is caught in a LIE once again!
Anti-Vaxxers don’t claim that better hygiene and better nutrition ELIMINATED DISEASE.
The claim is that the DEATH RATE from the disease declined 90% BEFORE Vaccines.
It is extremely rare for a child in USA or other first world country to die from
Measles, Chicken Pox, Roto Virus, Rubella or Whooping Cough.”
The Only Ones who Lie are the Anti-Vaxxers!
“Measles Deaths in the 21st Century
Breaking News – there are reports of two new deaths in Italy, including a young patient who died of measles encephalitis in 2017 and a young adult with leukemia just last month. (see below)
Measles is a big killer.
According to the WHO, “In 2015, there were 134,200 measles deaths globally – about 367 deaths every day or 15 deaths every hour.”
But it wasn’t that long ago, in 1980, that measles was causing at least 2.6 million deaths a year. And just 17 years ago, in 2000, measles caused about 777,000 deaths worldwide.
Measles Deaths in the 21st Century
While some experts doubt if we will ever truly eradicate measles, like we have done for smallpox, a lot of progress is being made on reducing measles outbreaks and deaths thanks to routine and supplemental immunizations.
Tragically, measles still kills.
“For every 1,000 children who get measles, one or two will die from it.”
CDC – Complications of Measles
And it is not just in developing countries that don’t have access to vaccines or adequate levels of vitamin A or modern healthcare. It should also be obvious, when you look at the cases below, that you don’t have to wait for there to be a 1,000 people in an outbreak for there to be a death. It could be the first person in the outbreak or you might see three deaths between cases 3,000 to 4,000.
Dr. Bob Sears actually reassured parents that measles wasn’t deadly in developed countries, neglecting to mention the dozens of people who have died in outbreaks in Europe – another well-nourished population with lower vaccination rates than the U.S.
During the 2010 and 2011 outbreaks in Europe, after all, with about 30,000 cases of measles each year, there were at least 28 deaths. It’s worse now…
The National Center for Communicable Disease Control and Control in Romania is now reporting 59 measles deaths.
In the last few years, there are reports of at least 118 deaths in the measles outbreaks across Europe, including:
the death of a 10-month-old unvaccinated child in Bulgaria (among just 163 cases)
four deaths in France – a 16-year-old unvaccinated girl from Nice, who died in Marseille, a 32-year-old unvaccinated women in Poitiers, a 26-year-old with immune system problems who was probably infected by an unvaccinated relative, and a 16-year-old in Bordeaux, an immunosuppressed girl who had received a heart transplant when she was 2 years old. Three of the deaths have occurred in 2018 and there have been just 2,567 reported cases since November 2017.
the death of a 37-year-old partially vaccinated women (the mother of 3 kids) in Essen, Germany (among about 866 cases)
four deaths in Greece, where there have been 2,830 cases – including an 11-month-old unvaccinated infant, a 35-year old partially vaccinated mother, an unvaccinated 17-year-old, and a vaccinated, but immunosuppressed 18-year-old.
at least twelve deaths in Italy (four in 2017 and six in 2018, among just 7,649 cases), including a 6-year-old boy with leukemia who reportedly caught measles from an unvaccinated sibling. The other deaths included an unvaccinated 9-year-old girl, a 16-month-old, a man with a compromised immune system, a 27-year-old woman, a 25-year-old woman, and a 10-month-old boy.
two deaths in Kosovo, including a baby who died in a hospital in Pristina.
the death of a 17-year-old girl who was not vaccinated in Portugal (among just 31 cases)
59 deaths in Romania, almost all unvaccinated children without preexisting conditions, including a three week old baby (among 14,142 cases since January 2016)
at least 15 deaths in Serbia (among about 5,598 cases), including a 20-year-old unvaccinated man, a two year old boy and mother, an unvaccinated 4-year-old, and a previously healthy, unvaccinated 30 year old woman.
one death in Spain
the death of a vaccinated man who was being treated for leukemia in Switzerland (among just 69 cases)
17 deaths in Ukraine – eleven children and six adults, including an unvaccinated toddler who died at a children’s hospital in Odessa and a 10-month old (among about 24,000 cases, mostly unvaccinated children). This includes five deaths in 2017 – three children and two adults, among about 4,782 cases.
Unfortunately, measles cases continue to rise in most of these countries and many others”
doomsday -“Along also came FLUSH TOILETS, Running CLEAN Water, MORE FOOD and LESS OVERCROWDING. Etc.”
Do you work for Age of Autism, or another Anti-vaxx site?
If not, why do you keep posting the theories from those Anti-vaxx sites?
“Did Better Hygiene and Sanitation Get Rid of Vaccine-Preventable Diseases?
Anti-vaccine folks, in addition to trying to argue that vaccines are full of poison, typically try to make a case that vaccines aren’t even necessary.
They had good hygiene and sanitation in Brooklyn when my uncle got polio in 1950. What they didn’t yet have was a polio vaccine.
They had good hygiene and sanitation in Brooklyn when my uncle got polio in 1950. What they didn’t yet have was a polio vaccine. If the wide use of indoor plumbing got rid of the plague in the early 1900s, why didn’t it get rid of all other infectious diseases at the same time?
Because, they claim, vaccines don’t even work. They claim that it was better hygiene and sanitation, not vaccines that helped get rid of smallpox, polio, and measles.
Did Better Hygiene and Sanitation Get Rid of Vaccine-Preventable Diseases?
On the surface, the idea that better hygiene and sanitation helped get rid disease makes a lot of sense.
“The 19th century shift in population from country to city that accompanied industrialization and immigration led to overcrowding in poor housing served by inadequate or nonexistent public water supplies and waste-disposal systems. These conditions resulted in repeated outbreaks of cholera, dysentery, TB, typhoid fever, influenza, yellow fever, and malaria.
By 1900, however, the incidence of many of these diseases had begun to decline because of public health improvements, implementation of which continued into the 20th century. Local, state, and federal efforts to improve sanitation and hygiene reinforced the concept of collective “public health” action (e.g., to prevent infection by providing clean drinking water).”
Achievements in Public Health, 1900-1999: Control of Infectious Diseases
It makes a lot of sense because better hygiene and sanitation did actually help control and eliminate many infectious diseases, including cholera, dysentery, and typhoid fever.
Others, like yellow fever and malaria, decreased because the mosquitoes that spread them were brought under control.
“Strategic vaccination campaigns have virtually eliminated diseases that previously were common in the United States, including diphtheria, tetanus, poliomyelitis, smallpox, measles, mumps, rubella, and Haemophilus influenzae type b meningitis.”
Achievements in Public Health, 1900-1999: Control of Infectious Diseases
That still left a lot of work for vaccines.
After all, we had good hygiene and sanitation in the United States when kids were routinely dying of polio, measles, Hib meningitis, pneumococcal meningitis, and rotavirus, etc.
Any way, if better hygiene and sanitation can get rid of so many diseases, why has each vaccine-preventable disease been controlled at a different time – yellow fever (1905), polio (1979), smallpox (1980), measles (2000), neonatal tetanus (2000), congenital rubella syndrome (2004), respiratory diphtheria (2009)?
What about the infectious diseases which don’t have vaccines? Why hasn’t better hygiene and sanitation helped control those diseases yet, like RSV, norovirus, Ebola, and Zika, etc.?
“Perhaps the best evidence that vaccines, and not hygiene and nutrition, are responsible for the sharp drop in disease and death rates is chickenpox. If hygiene and nutrition alone were enough to prevent infectious diseases, chickenpox rates would have dropped long before the introduction of the varicella vaccine, which was not available until the mid-1990s. Instead, the number of chickenpox cases in the United States in the early 1990s, before the vaccine was introduced in 1995, was about four million a year. By 2004, the disease incidence had dropped by about 85%.”
Misconceptions about Vaccines
And why does better hygiene and sanitation only work for chicken pox in countries that routinely use the chicken pox vaccine?
Do you want to believe that vaccines don’t work to justify skipping or delaying your child’s vaccines and leaving them unvaccinated and unprotected?
Be more skeptical, learn more about vaccines, and make the right choice to get your kids vaccinated.”
doomsday -“If anyone is make TRILLIONS off this SCAM – its the Pharmaceutical Industry.
And they don’t care how many Millions of Children they Injure – as long as they get their $$$$$$$$$$$”
It’s not a scam, no matter what you say.
There’s such a thing as Rx. companies. They reasearch diseases & then they produce vaccines and/or meds to combat them.
It cost them billions of dollars – and then they want to make a profit, like all companies.
Eastern Medicine has been around for thousands of years, but it mostly doesn’t work!
The Alternative medicine guys want you to believe in them, but in the beginning of the last century, humans didn’t live too long.
Along came modern medicine that prolongs human life.
Now we have people like you, that harp on every little glitch.
Why do you do it – if it’s Not for Money?!?
doomsday -“It was seeing all the FRAUD committed by the Vaccines are Safe Studies that make me
No – You became an Anti-vaxxer because of all the money you get from pushing Alternative Therapies for people that are desperate. Like ASD, which has No magic bullet in Real Medicine!
Press87 -“Schools have begun to give midwinter break.”
I have No problem with it, as long as Summer vacation will be 3 weeks from after Tisha B’Av.
Poor Camp Owners.
TIH -“What about the SIDS study? You’re OK that the public has been fooled into thinking the Back To Sleep campaign lowered SIDS rates, when it never did?”
Why do you Anti-vaxxers lie?
Stop with your Lying!
From the AAP:
“Reducing Sudden Infant Death with “Back to Sleep”
Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS), also re- ferred to as “crib death,” occurs without warning and is associated with a sleep period. A diagnosis of SIDS is given when no expla- nation can found for the baby’s death after a complete postmortem investigation. SIDS is the leading cause of death for infants between 1 month and 1 year of age. In 1993 alone, nearly 4,700 U.S. infants died from SIDS.
Research found that if infants were placed to sleep on their stomachs, their risk of dying from SIDS increased by at least two-fold.
As a result, the “Back-to-Sleep” Campaign was initiated in 1994 by a collaboration between the National Institute of Child Health and Development, the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP), the Maternal and Child Health Bureau of the Health Resources and Services Administration and SIDS groups.
The focus of the campaign was to en- courage parents to put their babies to sleep on their backs in order to reduce the risk of SIDS. The AAP Task Force on SIDS published a policy statement in 2005 encouraging the practice of “Back-to-Sleep” for all infants.
Research showed that between 1993 and 2010 the percent of infants placed to sleep on their backs increased from 17% to 73%. Following the initiation of the “Back-to-Sleep” campaign, the number of infants dying from SIDS has decreased to 2,063 per year as of 2010.”
doomsday -“If anything, homes were cleaner from 1950-1980 with modern appliances and
STAY AT HOME Mothers but allergies didn’t explode until 1990s – when mothers
were working and housekeeping was lower standard.”
You so don’t understand the point; but then again you don’t believe in Vaxxing – so no surprise here.
Listen we’re talking about kids – Moms didn’t care if the kids got dirty. Nowadays, even if the Moms are working they make sure the Goyta keeps the house & the kids spotless!
Yidd23-“the reason Americans have peanut allergies is mostly due to lack of early exposure in the form of Bamba.”
You’re right & wrong. While Bamba causes Israeli kids not to have so much allergies, it’s not a cure all.
The medical theory in the US that there is an uptick with regards to Allergies, is because parents are more Neurotic with their child-rearing. Once upon a time, kids would play in the dirt & the street. Nowadays, parents are obssesed with cleaniest. The lack of exposure to the environment causes allergies, when they finally are exposed to those things.
T2-2T – If what you’re saying is true, then you can’t support such an org.
Doomsday -“CDC’s own chart to show you that there is a Massive Autism Epidemic – and it keeps going up.”
It’s going up, but Not because of vaccines.
Off the subject – Do you work for Age of Autism or any other Anti-vaxx site?!?
From Science Based Medicine.org:
“One of the central narratives of the antivaccine movement is that we are in the midst of an “autism epidemic,” which I’ve sometimes heard called an “autism tsunami.” This narrative is essential to the idea that vaccines cause autism because of the expansion of the vaccine schedule in the 1990s that antivaxers blame for the “epidemic” that’s occurred over the last 25 years. Basically, no autism epidemic, no vaccine causation. Antivaxers know this. Unfortunately, what they either don’t know or refuse to acknowledge is that an increase in diagnoses of a condition is not necessarily the same thing as a true increase in prevalence. An increase in diagnoses without a true increase in prevalence (on a biological basis) can occur through, for example, changing of the diagnostic criteria over time or increased screening.”
doomsday -“And we have an AUTISM EPIDEMIC”
There is No such thing according to Science Based Medicine website.
It’s something made up from the Anti-vaxx movement.
Even the CDC is involved with this conspiracy, just like they Push vaccinations.
The Only Epidemic is the Measles Epidemic!
In the Frum communities and Now in Washington State.
From the News:
“The dangerous measles outbreak near Portland, Oregon, is what happens when people refuse to vaccinate their kids”
doomsday-“Here is the Autism Rate Per the HOLY CDC – VACCINE PUSHER:
1995 1:1,000 – notice the HUGE Increase after CDC began increasing vaccine Schedule
1999: 1: 500
Stop with your Hypocrisy!
You say the CDC Lies when it comes to vaccines; but you believe them when it comes to Autism rates.
SBM says it’s wrong numbers.
DOOMSDAY – “Because GENES /People do not change so dramatically in 50 years!
It is Scientifically IMPOSSIBLE for Autism to go from 1:10,000 in 1970 to 1:50 today
if Autism was Solely Genetics!
There HAS to be something in the ENVIRONMENT that is causing the Autism Epidemic”
You claim you have at least a high school education. In high school they teach the 3 laws of Mendel. (That’s Not Mendel the Mouse.)
So things can change from generation to another (that can even be only 20 years.)
Anyways the Vaxxing sites, like Science Based Medicine, write there is really Not an increase in Autism from 1990-2010. Look it up – to find out why!
doomsday -“Of those who DO research vaccines – most don’t vaccinate!”
Well I don’t work in Peds, but most of medical professionals that aren’t in Peds, that have done research, DO VAXX.
doomsday -“But since Amish have a Very Low Vaccination Rate – they have very little Autism.”
Why do you keep Lying?
Is it because you worship the Anti-vaxx movement?
You must of posted all the Anti-vaxx theories in these 33 pages.
Did you miss any?
Is there any theory that you posted – that is your own?
(Not from Anti-Vaxx sites.)
Actually about 70% of Amish do Vaxx!
“The idea that the Amish do not vaccinate their children is untrue,” says Dr. Kevin Strauss, MD, a pediatrician at the CSC.
“We run a weekly vaccination clinic and it’s very busy.”
He says Amish vaccinations rates are lower than the general population’s, but younger Amish are more likely to be vaccinated than older generations.”
TIH – “Dr. Frank Noonan is a doctor who treats Amish children in Lancaster County, Pennsylvania. He has said that he has seen no cases of autism in the thousands of Amish children he has treated over 25 years.”
Another Anti-Vaxx misconception or Lie!
From the Amish Clinic in Pa.
“Strauss also sees plenty of Amish children showing symptoms of autism.
“Autism isn’t a diagnosis – it’s a description of behavior. We see autistic behaviors along with seizure disorders or mental retardation or a genetic disorder, where the autism is part of a more complicated clinical spectrum.”
Fragile X syndrome and Rett Syndrome is also common among the clinic’s patients.”
Doomsday -“Genetics ALONE causes 1:10,000 to be Autistic”
Says who? That was in 1970, not today!
“Vaccines + Genetics Cause 1:50 to be Autistic.”
Says Who? You? Prove that.
Doomsday -“No. Autism is VERY Rare in 100% Unvaxxed Kids. About 1:10,000.”
Says who? You? Maybe it’s 1:50?
“It is the VAXXED kids that are 1:50 Autistic!”
Well maybe the Unvaxxed Kids are also 1:50 Autistic?!?
doomsday -“I don’t know why they are autistic.”
Well I know! Because Autism is Genetic!
Not because of Vaxxing.
“The number is from Psychology Today (A PRO-VAX Magazine)
“In 1970, only 1 child in 10,000 was diagnosed with autism. Today, according to the Centers for Disease Control, the number is 1 in 59.”
Ok; so what does this have to do with Today?
Maybe Autism in Unvaxxed Kids is 1 in 59?!?
whitecar -“I got married! The shidduch crisis is over”
So What? I got married also! But the shidduch crisis is NOT over, because I’m divorced.
doomsday -“I never said unvaxxed NEVER get Autism – I said it is VERY RARE, about 1:10,000.”
Why would they get Autism – they weren’t Vaxxed?
Where do you get that number from – Prove it?!?
doomsday -“The Japan study was not about autism in 100% unvaccinated children so stop lying and claiming
that the Japan study was about unvaccinated children!”
Even if you’re right, you gotta read my whole post that Proves – Autism in 100% UNVAXXED KIDS!!!
Stop with the Conspiracy Theories!
2scents -“Health, distraction tactics, diluting a discussion and focusing on gotchas and labels is not a mature or productive way to have a discussion.”
You’re right – when it comes to a normal argument. When after 32 pages of this nonsense, I & others get frustrated.
The bottom line is, even if there is some danger in getting Vaxxed (which I highly doubt), the benefit of people
to get vaccinations, far outweigh any possible adverse effects!
doomsday -“So either produce a study showing children who were 100% unvaccinated with Autism
OR ADMIT YOU LIED!”
The only Liar is You!
Just in case you think I’m 2scents or s/o else – I don’t post by any other SN.
Like I posted many times – I am NOT talking to you, but to people sitting on the fence with regards to this issue.
From VeryWell Health:
“Both Vaccinated and Unvaccinated Children Can Have Autism
And since vaccines don’t cause autism, it shouldn’t be surprising that there are unvaccinated children with autism. The only reason there aren’t more is that most parents vaccinate their children, so, of course, most autistic children are going to be vaccinated.
Unvaccinated Children with Autism
You may not hear about these children very often, but there are certainly unvaccinated children with autism. Several comparison studies have been made of autism rates between vaccinated and unvaccinated children and found no difference. One such study was from Japan where the MMR vaccine was withdrawn from the country due to concerns about aseptic meningitis. In the study, at least 170 children were found to have developed autism even though they had not received the MMR vaccine.
But that’s just one vaccine, there are also many examples of completely unvaccinated children who have developed autism. A study published in the February 2014 issue of Autism found that “the rates of autism spectrum disorder diagnosis did not differ between immunized and nonimmunized younger sib groups.”
Lara Lohne, although she was never vaccinated because her parents were anti-vaccine, had every intention of vaccinating her own child. She didn’t though, because of financial issues. And although he had never received any vaccines, her son developed autism:
“I must admit that it was through conversations with a coworker that I began to suspect something might be wrong with my youngest son. It concerned me so much that I started looking for information online. I read some of the stories and they sounded similar to what I was experiencing with my son – with the symptoms, the regression and the age at which it all started to become apparent.”
In a more common scenario, a parent might have a child with autism and decide to not vaccine their next child. These unvaccinated children are certainly not protected against vaccine-preventable diseases and they aren’t at any less risk for developing autism.
There are many more stories like this. They include authors and contributors to anti-vaccine websites that have unvaccinated children with autism.
More on Autism Among Unvaccinated Children
You only have to look at personal stories and posts in parenting forums to see that there are many cases of autism among unvaccinated and partially vaccinated children:
“It is highly likely my 4-year-old son is autistic. And he is completely 100 percent vaccine-free. And I am just at a total loss.”
“I have unvaxxed kids on the spectrum, and my friend does as well.”
“A good friend’s son is autistic. He is totally non-vaxxed.”
“I seriously delayed vaccinating my son, so had very few vaxxes at the time he was diagnosed”
“We have autism in our unvaxxed children”
“I know two little boys who are both autistic, completely non-vaxxed”
“I have two unvaccinated children who are on the autism spectrum and have never vaccinated any of my children.”
“I am not sure what caused my son’s autism, but autistic he is. He is completely unvaxxed as we stopped vaxxing 10 years ago.”
“I have a 10 year old daughter with autism spectrum disorder… My daughter has never had a vaccine, a decision I made shortly after she was born, after much research.”
Unfortunately, while realizing that unvaccinated children can develop autism does help some parents move away from anti-vaccine myths and conspiracy theories, others get pushed deeper into the idea that it is just about toxins. It is not uncommon for some of these parents to blame vaccines they got while pregnant or even before they became pregnant, Rhogam shots, or mercury fillings in their teeth, etc.
Not all, though. Juniper Russo “was afraid of autism, of chemicals, of pharmaceutical companies, of pills, of needles” when she had her baby. She just knew that vaccines caused autism when she first visited her pediatrician after her baby was born and knew all of the anti-vaccine talking points. She also later began to realize that her completely unvaccinated daughter had significant developmental delays. Instead of continuing to believe that vaccines cause autism, Ms. Russo understands some things about her daughter and that she “could no longer deny three things: she was developmentally different, she needed to be vaccinated, and vaccines had nothing to do with her differences.”
MRS PLONY -“Thirty one pages. Is this a new CR record?”
The only record here is that YWN is giving a voice to conspiracy theories!
I wonder why Anti-vaxx is tolerated in Frum communties?
We pride ourselves in keeping the Torah, but the Anti-vaxx movement has made significant inroads in the Frum communties.
doomsday -” In the vaccine injury trial of Yates Hazlehurst, Government Lawyers LIED that Dr. Zimmerman’s opinion is that Vaccines NEVER cause Autism when Dr. Zimmerman TOLD the Government Lawyers that Vaccines CAN cause Autism! In Dr. Zimmerman’s opinion, Yates Hazlehurst’s autism WAS caused by vaccines, but Government Lawyers LIED that Dr. Zimmerman’s opinion is that vaccines NEVER cause autism. Another example of government LYING to cover up Vaccines Cause Autism!”
Stop being a Sock-puppet for the Anti-vaxx movement!
You keep pushing their LIES!
Why do Frum people believe them?
“The usual suspects are alleging fraud during the in the Vaccine Court Omnibus Proceedings.
Most folks remember that the Vaccine Court Omnibus Autism Proceedings were a series of cases that were used to test theories that vaccines could contribute to or cause autism.
Vaccines are not associated with autism.
So what’s the problem?
“Robert F. Kennedy Jr., Chairman of Children’s Health Defense (CHD), and Rolf Hazlehurst, parent of a vaccine-injured child, petitioned the Department of Justice (DOJ) Office of Inspector General (OIG), and the Senate and House Judiciary Committees today to investigate actions taken by federal personnel during the “Vaccine Court” Omnibus Autism Proceedings (OAP).”
Kennedy and Hazlehurst claim to have evidence of “obstruction of justice and appallingly consequential fraud by two DOJ lawyers who represented the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) in 2007.”
Kennedy and Hazlehurst claim that “that the leading HHS expert, whose written report was used to deny compensation to over 5,000 petitioners in the OAP, provided clarification to the DOJ lawyers that vaccines could, in fact, cause autism in children with underlying and otherwise benign mitochondrial disorders.”
Who is this expert?
It is Andrew Zimmerman, MD, a pediatric neurologist.
There is also a claim that Dr. Zimmerman, along with Dr. Richard Kelley, who was also an expert witness in the Vaccine Court Omnibus Autism Proceedings, served as expert witnesses in a medical malpractice case against a pediatrician who vaccinated a child, supposedly causing him to become autistic.
Yates Hazlehurst, who was the second test case in the Vaccine Court Omnibus Proceedings…”
“They claim that its Bashert for over 10% of the girls per grade per year to stay single.”
Who is the “they”?
And there are plenty of males in the 30’s, 40’s, & 50’s!
If a woman wants to get married & have kids – there are plenty of options.
The problem is that they are Picky!
JOE -“Syag, plus everyone has a zivug, a bashert, from 40 days before birth. So it cannot be that there’s even one Yid ever who cannot get married. Correct?”
So why do people marry twice – to two never married women?!?
Wolf- “Yes, and that’s because the disease was eradicated. It’s only because it was eradicated that we stopped taking the vaccine. If the disease was still out there, we’d still be vaccinating for it.”
You forgot to mention why it was eradicated.
Vaccination was the main reason for the eradication.
From the CDC:
“Global Smallpox Eradication Program
The Intensified Eradication Program began in 1967 with a promise of renewed efforts. This time, laboratories in many countries where smallpox occurred regularly (endemic countries) were able to produce more, higher quality freeze-dried vaccine. A number of other factors also played an important role in the success of the intensified efforts, including the development of the bifurcated needle, establishment of a surveillance system to detect and investigate cases, and mass vaccination campaigns, to name a few.”
doomsday -“QUADRUPLED the vaccine schedule and we now have the SICKEST children in history.”
Not because of people who Vax, but because of people like you – who don’t VAXX!!!
Yserbius123 -“It is ridiculously expensive and that money can be put to far better use”
Since the DemonCrats won’t listen to the lastest Trump offer, the only reasonable solution is to close the Southern Border!
We must end this Shutdown Now!!
Too many people are Suffering!
doomsday -“the doctor gave my nephew 7 vaccines at once. He was diagnosed with autism 2 weeks after the 7 vaccinations”
That is a bit much. It’s possible that this situation triggered Autism.
So what you’re doing is denying the Benefit of Vaxxing.
You’re using one case (or a few cases) to Push your wicked agenda!
Stop denying the fact that Vaccines have saved Millions of Lives!
MS -” No. He’s painted himself into a corner from which he cannot escape. The best thing he can do for both himself and the country is to step aside in favor of Vice President Pence. This will satisfy the sensibilities and values of the hardcore Republican base while simultaneously allowing President Trump to save face and humiliation.”
I AGREE! Now we will have a moral country.
The libs will go Nuts; Much More than the Donald!