Health

mommamia22 -“Health -You really seem to have such a negative view of women.”

Where in my words did you get such a conclusion?

It seems Toi was right when he posted -“i find it ironic that health as a divorced man is recieving nothing but criticism for expressing his views on divorce, while i strongly assume that any woman on here in the same postion would recieve nothing but sympathy.”

Stop making generalizations. Your views Do Not represent All Women!

“Granted there are some who walk into marriage with unreasonably high expectations. However, when I say “well” I mean common basic courtesy. If a man is wonderful to a woman, speaks lovingly, kindly, considerately, she won’t be so quick to leave knowing what’s out there may not be better.”

On this we can basically agree.

“We’re not talking about extremes here of life with a kind man living in horrendous poverty”

What does this mean? A woman can walk out if the husband is poor?

Poor people shouldn’t get married and if they make the mistake of getting married -the woman should walk out?!?

“or a so called JAP who expects the unreasonable. We’re talking about regular people with typical life hopes and expectations of basic commitment to frumkeit, overall kind behavior, and general responsible attitude towards life. Perhaps I don’t know common expectations, but the women I know would never leave a man who offers the above. They might lament not having more, but they would never leave.”

Well obviously we walk in different circles. I admit I know plenty of women who would never leave their husband who treats her normally. OTOH, I know plenty of women who have divorced or made their husband miserable when they didn’t get what they want!

miritchka -“Health: I usually respect and look forwrd to your comments. And i still do, which is why this comment made me do a double take after i read it: “you get is response from some Hatzolah members that e/o who is a member is a perfect little angel.” While you may not be directly bashing Hatzoloh, this wasnt a very nice comment to write, especially after the many times that other posters (whom i am assuming are members of hatzoloh) post time and again that unfortunately not everyone is 100% honest with the temporary priviledges given to them.”

While you are correct that some people own up to the truth, my attitude comes from those that are in total denial and bash you for saying the truth.

Here is an example of s/o owning up to the truth, even though he did it as a defense instead of just a plain admission:

“cb1

Music Producer –

People, how about a little Dan L’kaf Zchus here!! Most Hatzolah members do NOT abuse their privileges!!”

He said most.

OTOH, here is an example of the other way. From the topic of “Joining Hatzalah”:

“Poster -Hatzola is there for anyone that needs it R”L. They put their personal schedule to the back burner for any call. No one should have the chutzpa to speak bad about them no matter what.”

2scents -“Correct me if I am wrong, in NJ EMTs are not allowed to have red lights or pass through red lights, they have to follow the regular traffic rules. That is why cops would pull over EMTs that respond in their personal cars.”

Wrong. First of all, I didn’t go through any red lights and was pulled over, nor did I use L & S. Technically they have to have blue lights on their vehicles, not L & S. It’s only allowed (L & S) for the Chief or Captain of the service. (Only one person per squad.) Already many moons ago, many Hatzolah members in NJ in the areas that they respond have L & S. They use these with impunity and disobey all traffic laws like they are emergency vehicles. I personally don’t care – I’m not from the complainers, but I’m not going to sweep the truth under the carpet either.

“I did not understand what you wrote regarding two units responding with the ambulance en route, all units respond on a code 1 unless advised otherwise, even if the ambulance is already on the way, the ambulance without EMTs is not worth much.”

I’m not going to explain it, if you didn’t understand it. Perhaps reread it. The gist of my point was that anybody with a scanner and a little knowledge of how Hatzolah works can easily tell if a Hatzolah guy using L & S is legit. I personally don’t care what abuse is going on -it’s not my business. It’s the responsibility of the Vol. squad and the Gov. But if the OP and others are so bothered by this, they can easily find those who abuse their priviliges and then they can document it. And then they can report it to the proper authorities.

And around the track they go. It’s neck in neck. It seems that the white horse is leading the brown horse. But we won’t know until they cross the finish line – who the winner is.

2scents -“First, Cops DO pull over cars even if they have EMT or VAS plates.”

What it boils down to is the cop’s perception. I’ve been pulled over many times by cops during a response. Of course since I was legit – I didn’t get a ticket. In parts of NJ where they aren’t used to having people respond in personal vehicles, I’ve gotten pulled over. This was probably true once upon a time in NY. Nowadays with almost every cop in NY and other areas where Hatzolah responds, you’d be hardpressed to find a cop who’s ignorant about personal response. So they don’t pull over cars with Cherrys anymore. This is how people who aren’t even a member of any emerg. org. get away with using lights and sirens -they don’t check up anymore. So if a cop sees a Frum man using lights and sirens, he just assumes they are Hatzolah and ignores them.

“Regarding lights and sirens, I do not believe that Hatzoloh members abuse them, the consequences are to big to use them when not on an emergency.”

Either you’re very ignorant or you have an agenda.

I’ve have friends admit to me that they have abused their lights and sirens. And these are guys who are very on the up & up, but anybody can fall prey to the Yetzer Hora. So what do you think about the guy on Hatzolah who isn’t there for the right reasons?

Do you think he never abuses his priviliges?

“You might see someone turn on the lights and sirens only to shut them a few seconds later, this happens all the time, either the patient stopped choking or the first member on scene radioed the units to slow it down.”

Or the guy got through the red light and didn’t need the lights & siren anymore. (Whether on a call or not.) Your scenarios are possible but it’s easy to tell if this is indeed the case. A guy with a scanner can easily tell by listening if there are any calls in the neighborhod. Even during a call it’s easy to tell, if let’s say two units who were dispatched report on the scene and with the ambulance already responding. So there would be no units with lights and sirens enroute. You have to be dispatched to the call -you just can’t go.

These abuses are real, despite any denial from some posters here.

But like I said before, if you want change, the only ones that can make change are the elected/gov. officials. Coming here does nothing besides making you feel good.

hurtfirefighter -“Health- As someone who is in the ‘parsha’ of yeshivos, I have to disagree. Though steins has a good name, there is no argument that Yeshiva Gedolah D’Brick has a higher level of learning than steins. As someone who has friends in yeshiva gedolah dbrick, I am not lying when I tell you that there can be bochrim in the beis medrash on any given night until 12:30!”

What? And their are no Bochurim up late at nite in Steins?

Stein’s Yeshiva is probably bigger and even though e/o gets individual attention -Yeshiva D’Brick is probably even more attention. But not e/o needs such personal attention.

As far as learning goes, I stand by my statement of Stein’s is a higher level of learning. R. N’ Stein is a very big Talmud Chachum.

ZK – Health and Health and Health.

Never changed, but have been blocked a few times.

Also I fess up – I Lo Aleinu have internet.

Avhaben -Speak to your elected officials.

There was a time that gov. officials in NYC were abusing their NYPD Placards. Enough people complained until the gov. cracked down on them.

The same can be done with people who abuse VAS plates and/or lights and sirens. Unfortunately there are always some bad apples who will abuse a privledge given to them.

VM -“Whiteberry, I commend your questions.”

While you ask good questions – I think with regards to Yeshiva D’Brick -I think the answers will be in the positive. I never per se have asked all these questions to them, but I’ve been there quite often and still continue to be there occasionally and spoken to many Bochurim and I get a positive response by many.

Another Yeshiva that I have personal info about is R’ N. Stein’s Yeshiva on the cor. of 9th & Monmouth. It also seems like a very good Yeshiva. The learning here is probably higher than Yeshiva D’Brick.

VM -“if they were in fact interested in protecting babies’ health.”

I don’t think you understood my point. I don’t think the Gov. has any business getting involved, even though they claim to care about Jewish babies. I’ve had too much experience with their love towards Yidden – that to me it’s only the fox guarding the hen house. If they care about human babies -how about regulating Abortion? (I mean much more regs.) Notice I didn’t say stopping it totally because that is protected by the Supreme Court. But regulating it would probably pass Federal Court scrutiny. So, I don’t live in some sort of dream world.

But my problem is -two wrongs don’t make a right. While I agree that these orgs. should fight these regs. -I don’t agree with their attitude -that there is no problem. Why do our leaders & our orgs. always put their head in the sand when it comes to important issues? I could post a long list of everything that’s been swept under the carpet, but that would be off topic.

I don’t think they do this because they don’t care about kid’s health, but because they are not versed in science they end up doing what’s PC in the Frum comunity.

If they want to address the issue of MBP -they should start by implementing a guideline that would make MBP virtually safe for everyone!

VM -“In case it wasn’t obvious from my post, I am anti-MbP. I had a long discussion about this with a classmate who is pro-MbP, and he felt strongly that the legal challenge would prevail.”

I’d agree with you, but if you read my posts here -I figured out a way to have MBP. So I see nothing wrong with doing it -if they implement some sort of guideline.

The whole court case is a red herring. What these orgs. should be concerned about is the health of the kids. Do what you can to make MBP safe -so there will no problem in the first place.

Borough Park Mensch -“Health, This is not about me. This is not about anyone else here. This is only about you.

You claimed to be an “expert in medicine.” I asked you very politely if you have an M.D. degree and a license to practice medicine.

What is your problem in answering?

I did not ask your name, where you work, where you live or where you daven. Just if you are a graduate from medical school and a practicing physician.”

And I’m not interested in the topic being about me -so I didn’t answer.

“By the way, it is indeed possible to read back pages of this website that were posted even years before one became a member.”

Good idea. I’ve already explained in detail why I won’t answer this question -so go back and find my old posts. You can even do a search of the CR.

yeshivish kofer -“I went to Ner Yisrael for Mechina and they do not have a serious secular studies program. People have the impression that since they allow guys to go to college (albeit begrudgingly) it’s a more modern yehiva but in fact it is a right wing yeshivisha place.”

I disagree with your comment, even though I posted above very similar to it. I agree with this guy’s comment:

“arc -When you compare NIRC to other yeshivos they have a good english dept.”

In other words -I’m inbetween.

It’s definitely a lot better than going to some MO or Modern high school.

best aunt -“montrael”

Never heard of this city. It’s either Montreal or Mont R`eal.

bubka -“Though I do recall seeing an old post of yours saying you are in school.”

Yes and perhaps the schooling has ended?

“If I was wrong about the speculation of your health-industry status, you wouldn’t be unable to “recall”, since you would’ve immediately known you obviously never made such an incorrect comment. That you only don’t recall making it, indicates your status is in fact what I inquired.”

Did you really think that I’d answer your question -so you could play process of elimination? I won’t respond to anybody – whether denying or confirming my degree(s).

And btw, it seems that you know nothing about medical education because acc. to your train of thought I admitted that I’m a nurse and a PA. While anything is possible – most nurses who want to practice medicine usually become NP’s, not PA’s. If you want to believe that I’m from this rare breed -it’s fine by me. I’m not going to admit or deny anything.

bubka -“Health: Didn’t you say you are a nurse or in school to become some kind of PA?”

Not that I recall. Maybe others asked me that, but I never answered.

I have no understanding of what you mean by quality and even if true – what’s your point?

“shmoel

And there is no biological degradation until at least the late-50’s.”

ChanieE -“The scientific literature indicates that it starts earlier.

I guess that depends which studies you read … Interested parties should contact their doctors instead of relying on coffee room experts”

You seem to have an agenda and I’m not sure what it is.

I am in the medical field and I just rechecked it. Healthy men can have kids even into their 80’s. Whatever point you are trying to make about quality, even if true, is irrevelant. The reason a woman in her 30’s should consider a man in his 40’s -50’s is because her time clock is running out, while a man’s time clock will go on till his 80’s. Once the woman can’t have kids anymore, she is limited to men who can’t or don’t want kids.

This obviously is what she has been doing till now and it’s not working. I’m sure she goes out with 30 year olds. Are there 30 y.o. whom only go out with girls in their twenties? Probably, but you can’t force them to go out with girls their same age.

How come so many women can’t think out of the box?

I know so many women in their 40’s and 50’s who can’t have kids anymore. Yes, they can still get married, but they are limited to men who have kids already and don’t want anymore and are either divorced or widowed. There aren’t a lot of men like this!

“Men DO have biological clocks, they are just less obvious than women’s.”

Yes, they do. Somewhere in the 70’s or 80’s. That’s why I posted this above:- “Don’t forget you have a time clock regarding kids -they don’t!”

This is a lot different than women. If you went to college -you’d have probably learnt this in Biology.

PBA -“You pay admission, but then if you want to the animals you need to be a separate fee.”

No, you don’t. On Wed. it’s free. I once made the mistake of going to the Bronx zoo on Chol Hamoed on a Wed. Almost every Jew in the tri-state was there.

gregaaron -“Again, the fact that a paper was published does not make it “current medical practice”. Medical and professional literature is full of papers advocating conflicting and contradictory viewpoints.”

Until there is another conflicting viewpoint, if there ever will be, from a reliable medical source, the AAP’s study stands as current medical practice!

PBA & gregaaron -I now understand your point, but last night I looked at the study. It seems to my limited knowledge of statistics that there was never a Hava Mina that there can be any other cause besides the mother. I can understand why they wouldn’t think food (“that they all used the same brand of baby food”), but what about other family members?

To perhaps to understand where they are coming from – perhaps they believe that if other family members were HSV pos. then it would be next to impossible for the mother to be HSV -neg. The mother has the most contact with the baby, so if the baby got it from another family source it stands to reason the mother would also get HSV from the same family member, but both the mother and baby tested HSV -neg. A recent source such as MBP would explain HSV -neg in the baby. There has to be a source for the HSV.

This study is not similar to cases in NY were family members testified that some other kids in the family had cold sores.

Again, I’m not an expert in Statistics and perhaps there is an entirely different reason why they came to this conclusion, not the theory I posted above.

But the AAP who accepted this article are experts in Statistics and they wouldn’t have accepted a flawed study.

All I can tell you to answer your questions is to go and review the whole article again. And if you still have Kashas contact the Medical Doctors who published the study.

But as of right now, the AAP’s study stands as current medical practice.

You have not Upshlogged it, even if you make some points. I & e/o else have to assume there are answers to these points, just you didn’t completely understand the study.

Try rereading the study and if this doesn’t work contact these Doctors. I’m sure they thought of anything you could possibly ask.

If in the one-in-a-million chance they can’t answer you, then go ahead and submit your questions and their ridiculous answers to the AAP for publication.

PBA -“Because you cannot establish causation without looking at the cases where the same exposure happened and did not cause infection. Without that, the whole study is just naarishkeit.”

I really don’t understand what you’re saying here. I’m not a Boki in statistics, but why can’t they just assume that most MBP didn’t cause HSV?

nishtdayngesheft -“Health,

I did not say I am the expert, you however say you are an expert.”

I said in my post clearly that I’m not an expert in Statistics, only in Medicine.

“Yet even me, a non expert sees many fallacies in the study. Certainly when the result was the first part of the study written. A study that only reports the cases that supports is allegations is no study at all. There were no cases of MbP that did not result in HSV? That is what the study would like to allege. They only looked at cases were there was a concurrence of MbP and HSV. Hardly an objective study at all.”

You’re not even making any sense over here. Their objective was only to prove that sometimes MBP causes HSV, not all the time.

So why in the world would they have to look at cases where the kid didn’t come down with HSV?

“And, non expert that I am easily located the study on the NIH about nursing. My quote was directly from the NIH.”

I said that I was taking your word for it, but I wasn’t looking it up.

“The studies seems to say that the occurence would be more likely by nursing than by MbP. Yet it is clear that that is not considered a danger, ergo the alleged sakonah associated with MpB is not considered a sakonah.”

I don’t care whether the Goyim consider it a danger or not.

I was talking acc. to Halacha.

“There has been no study that supported allegations that a person with non active HSV can infect a child. Mohelim that have active HSV do not do MbP.”

Again where in that study does it say all the Mohelim had an active case of HSV with cold sores?

“But I never called my self Health and said that I am an expert in the Health field. You on the other hand do so and yet you post comments that directly disprove that assertion of yours.”

I fail to see anywhere that I contradicted myself.

“With your attitude I can understand why an issue of nursing would never be nogeiah you.”

Hey, I’ve been married and there are other ways to feed babies. I’m sure you’ve never heard of formula.

“It was not necessary for you to interrupt your Yom Tov preparations to post what you did. Have a good Yom Tov.”

That’s not what I wrote. That line wasn’t your Gesheft (nisht dayn gesheft) – it was to PBA!

Just curious -Is r’ osher kalmanowitz r’ avrohom kalmanowitz’s son or r’ shraga moshe’s son?

nishtdayngesheft -“Health,I can hardly believe you would try to pass yourself of as a health professional without noting the numerous glaring holes in the alleged study. Which as everyone knows had the conclusion written before the study began.”

Since you’re the expert, please post all the statistical flaws in the actual study. And after you do that – submit it to the AAP for publication. If they except it, then we can take your word that the study was flawed.

“I wonder if that is is how some justify the colossal chillul Hashem perpetrated by this individual? Because he has a half baked study?”

I was not defending any individual, just proving a point about MBP.

“Please, even his original target has performed Grissom many thousands of times and he can only find two cases to pin on him? That alone flies in the face of his own study.”

This study has nothing to do with that Mohel. As far as I know, that Mohel can even be HSV -neg.

“Besides I wonder if you any clue what sakonas necashos means.”

Actually I wonder if you do. You seem not to have the foggiest idea about medical science.

“As I stated numerous times above, we are not talking about when there is an active case. Mohel in do not so MbP then anyway. What is manufactured is that there is any real risk of shedding from non active cases.”

Well it seems from the study that it isn’t manufactured as you say. It seems HSV was passed onto babies during the Bris and I don’t think the Mohelim had cold sores at the time. Again, if you have specific data that their study was flawed, you can post it here.

“If there were, then it would be ossur to nurse because the sakonah is at least as great then. Are you suggesting that it should be ossur to nurse as well? You should if your consistent.”

Here again you prove you don’t know Halacha or Medicine.

I never heard of a study saying Nursing can pass on HSV. Even if you’re correct, then go ask a Rov the Shaila. It’s not B’chlal Nogieah me, so I’m not going into the Shaila, if even there is one.

But for you to compare one to the other is ridiculous. Like I said, I’ll take your word that nursing is a Sakana. E/o knows the Heter of “Hakol Doshin Bo”. They are always quoting R’ Moshe on smoking with this. (Oh btw, for you guys who go to Yeshivos that allow smoking -R’ Moshe’s son said -R’ Moshe would never Mattir smoking nowadays.) Nursing would probably have the Heter of “Hakol Doshin Bo”, but I don’t see how this Heter could be used for MBP!