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Lightbrite, the question is whether he keeps anyone in check. When I knew him thirty years ago I had the distinct impression that he was personally frummer than he let on. In fact, he once commented that many people who started with him would no longer daven in HIR – and did not seem displeased. Today he is 72 and sort-of retired (he said that he would like to retire the word “retire”) and has turned over his shul to a younger man.
The word “gentile” ‘derives from Latin gentilis, which itself derives from the Latin gens … meaning clan or tribe” (Wikipedia). The word “goy” in Biblical Hebrew means “nation”. In fact, we are referred to as a goy kadosh. In Rabbinic Hebrew the word “goy” came to mean an idolater whereas a non-Jew who was not an idolater was called a ger toshav (without getting into the discussion regarding accepting them today). Ben Noach in the Gemara and Mishne Torah clearly is a general term for non-Jews. The Gemara (Megilla 13a) says that anyone who denies idolatry is called “Yehudi” (from meyahed – unite). In fact, the Gemara never refers to us a Yehudim (the use in Megillat Esther apparently refers to the fact that they were from Shevet Yehuda) but as Yisrael.
However, today the academic term “Noahide” has come to mean a non-Jew who has taken the sheva mitzvot upon himself. There are several Noahide organizations, each with its own website (you can google “Noahide” to find them).
Time, I do not know that Rav Dovid Feinstein holds. His father (IM, OC 2:80) held that it is permissible if the gentile is not instructed to operate the elevator. See also “Shabbos elevators: Rav Meir Triebitz’s Teshuva” where he even allows asking a gentile to push the button (although he does not wish to advertise this heter). In any case, you have no right to disparage people who are lenient as they have ample halachic grounds to do so.
Kitov,
1. I know someone who did not get married until age 57.
2. Women are exempt from peria v’rivia. This is halacha pesuka.
Lilmod, it depends. If a man knows that he cannot have children and this yetzer hara is not bothering him he is not required to get married.
Time , that is what I have received from my rabbanim. In fact, Rav Shlomo Zalman has very strong rebuttals of the Chazon Ish’s opinion as Well as Rav Schmelkes’ opinion that it ismolid zerem. Among other rebuttals he says that closing a circuit is like closing a door. Moreover, it is not permanent so it cannot be a Torah prohibition. Regarding the issue at hand (in case you have forgotten, riding in an elevator that was activated by a gentile) see Rabbi Chaim Jachter’s on-line series of articles “The Use of Elevators on Shabbat” and “Non-Shabbos elevator on Shabbat” by Rabbi David Sperling (also on-line).
Yossi, I am an idea man not an educator.
Geordie, that is because it is written in Hebrew.
Lilmod, there is also a difference between telling someone not to go out with a particular person because of a halachic (e.g. cohen and gerusha) or personal (e.g. a health issue) reason. However, in the latter case the person must tell you the reason and you are not allowed to fully believe it but only to have a suspicion and seek to clarify it if you can. Unfortunately, it does happen that people exaggerate or even outright lie either to exact revenge or because of personal prejudices.
Joseph,
The SA says that he is only talking about a case where someone does not want to marry at all. However, if he says that he is waiting for a good shidduch the bet din does not interfere. He does not say anything about forcing someone to marry a particular girl. In fact, Yeshayahu did not force Chizkiahu to marry his daughter. He simply told him that if he did not agree to marry someone he would die. Chizkiahu then suggested the specific shidduch. In any case, the Rema says that today we do not interfere at all. Your kal v’chomer is not a kal v’chomer. Someone who does not want to marry at all at any time is violating a Torah mitzva. Someone who is waiting for the proper person or circumstances (in Lithuania it was common for men to postpone marriage until relatively late in life in order to learn full-time without financial pressures) merely wants to wait to do it properly.
As for marrying off the daughter without her permission and your “age old Jewish tradition”, Chazal say not to do either until she decides that she wants the guy. So far as I know, the only times it was actually practiced were during the Crusades, when no one knew if it would be possible later, and in Yemen, where girls whose fathers died were forcibly converted to Islam unless they were married.
Lilmod, what is the difference between telling him not to marry a certain girl and to marry a certain girl? Why should he ask a bet din? RJS obviously did not think that he was required to do so. This is a matter of the spiritual connection between the people themselves. Their lives, thieeir decision.
Yossi, in that case the later books of the Tanach as well as the Mishna and Gemaar are in lashon hakodesh mekulkelet (“lashon’ is feminine). Forexmple, the books of Daniel and Esther refer to the servant who brings food as a meltzar, which is Persian. “Sanhedrin” is Greek as is “hediot” (it comes form the same word as “idiot’). In any case, lashon hakodesh mekulkelet is still a form of lashon hakodesh. Yiddish is a corrupted form of German along with corruptions of Hebrew (e.g. “goniff” from “ganav”) and Slavic languages (e.g. “bubbi” from “babushka”). Thus many referred to it as “Jargon”.
Rav Moshe Soloveichik objected to his son’s choice. Rav Joseph Soloveichik wrote a very respectful letter whose bottom line was that he did not have to listen. RMS said that he was right. As for ruach hakodesh, that does not exist in our times except maybe one in a generation. Even then he does not pasken according to it. How many Jews perished because they were told not to leave Europe when they had the chance? There was a guy in Givat Shaul who was telling people who had been happily married for decades that according to ruach hakodesh they had to get divorced. Rav Mordechai Eliahu ran him out of town. There was another one in Maalot Dafna who claimed to check mezzuzot according to ruach hakodesh. Rav Yaakov Hillel tested him and found that he did not even know what the Shulchan Aruch says. Some have done much worse things which I doubt that the Moderator will allow to be mentioned. IMHO, it is absolutely prohibited to go to people like that.
Neville, I can take it and I can dish it out too. Be warned!
Lightbrite, TY for the commentary. Once when asked what he meant by something he wrote Agnon told his questioner to ask a certain literary critic so I am in good company. However, as an man ofd truth I must admit that I was referring to literally waving their fingers during a discussion. This is an expression in yeshiva circles for pilpul with nothing behind it. BTW, according to the Urban Dictionary “When you interface with any kind of computer that requires manual input (whether by keyboard, or a touchscreen) there is the chance for making a mistake. Such mistakes are playfully called ‘at Finger Disease’.”
Time, by calling Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach’s sheeta, which is the consensus sheeta, aberrant you have put yourself beyond the pale, anecdotal statements notwithstanding.
CTL, I was not questioning anyone’s ethics. I was merely asking questions for my edification. You cannot know my tone as there is no tone in typing. I am sorry if you were offended.
Neville, look in the mirror when you write statements like that. if i am sometimes sharp I am only following a hallowed Jewish tradition. See on this Chavat Yair 152, generally printed after Sefer Chafetz Chaim.
It should be noted that Rav Ovadia does not say that he must divorce her. In fact, he says explicitly that the situation in our times could be reason to allow him to stay married to her.
CTL, we live to make problems. Someone told me that that is the difference between a rosh yeshiva and a rav. The former makes problems and the latter solves them. BTW, you might be interested in a series on the halachic aspects of law practice on the YU site by a rav named Mordechai Torczyner even if none of the pertain to your practice – I presume that you do not have much occasion to deal with bulls that gore cows either).
Lightbrite, I am not accusing him of anything. He mentioned it in connection with the halachic implications of his practice so I commented here. As I do not even know who he is or even exactly where he lives so I have no other forum.
Lilmod, Rav Moshe’s teshuva is in Iggrot Moshe Even HaEzer vol. 1. 114. Rav Ovadia disagrees (Yabia Omer vol. 3, Even HaEzer 21). So it would turn on who is muchzak (has possession ofthe asset) as in such a case we leave it with him or her. The Supreme Rabbinical Court (file 835204/1 – available on-line) in fact ruled that the husband is muchzak in the ketuba so here she would lose it. What an American bet din would do is another question as it is a machloket (see’Shiur #12: “Muchzakut” With Regard to the Ketuba Payment” by Rav Yair Kahn Translated by David Silverberg available on-line) However, the rabbinical courts here have accepted the Community Property Law as halachically binding as minhag hamedina. Thus they are both muchzak in matrimonial property. An interesting situation would be if she grabs the value ofthe ketuba before leaving as she might then be considered the muchzeket (see
????? ?????? ??? ?? ???? ???? – available on-line).
FuturePOTUS, to my understanding OO is not condoning acts but looking the other way. Is this different than looking the other way regarding people who commit financial crimes (also a toeva – Devarim 25:13).
CTL, in the case of Jews the wills may not be valid halachically. In such a case there might be a problem a gezel. there might also be an issue of ribbit regarding estate planning. Having non-Jewish juniors do it is not a solution, especially if they are your employees as there might be a rabbinic prohibition of amira l’akum (this does not only apply to Shabbat).
Iacisrmma, you would be surprised at how quickly small children pick up a language.
Joseph,
Actually the Sheeta Mekubetzet says that it the Raavad questioned if someone is yotzi talmud Torah in a gentile language (and Yiddish is not even a language but a corrupt form of German). A person who speaks in Lashon HaKodesh merits Olam HaBa, Geula and long life (Yerushalmi Shabbat 1:3). The Gra considered speaking it to be a mitzva and spoke it himself (Biur HaGra YD 245,10 and Responsa Divrei Yetziv YD 52-53) as did Rav Kook (in fact, when Rav Charlap first met him he addressed him in Yiddish and Rav Kook informed him that he was not to be addressed in “Jargon”).
The language one speaks influences one’s mind-set. Thus the more one speaks in Lashon HaKodesh the more kedusha he internalizes. Ezra very much lamented the linguistic situation in his time. However, we see from the Mishna and Gemara in later times talmidei chachamim spoke it although more so in EY (holy land, holy language). It could be that the Chatam Sofer means that the people in Tanachic times added words from other languages to express foreign concepts as did the Tannaim (who sometimes used Greek and Latin words).
Benignuman, Rav Moshe says (IM EH 1:114, 4:32) that that does not apply in a community where women disregard the requirement. According to “Nefesh HaRav” Rav Soloveichik held the same view.
One can ask a non-Jew to do an issur d’rabbanan for the sake of a mitzva or great need (SA OC 307:5). According to most opinions using electricity (other than incandescent lights) is such a prohibition. Some claim that Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach even said that really there is no prohibition but minhag Yisrael is to be machmir.
So far as the extra weight question is concerned see “The Shabbat Elevator” by
Rabbi Yisrael Rozen (on-line). As for the sensor, if the non-Jew enters with the Jew and is first I would imagine that the Jew did not do anything (and the non-Jew did it for himself). See also “When May I Ask a Gentile for Help on Shabbos? Part II” by Rabbi Yirmiyohu Kaganoff (also on-line).
Joseph, that is a discussion that centers on whether or not it is a ????. In any case, is only if he is Gd-fearing like his father and the tzibbor wants him. There was one kehilla that had a by-law that no relative of a member could be the rav. When the rav passed away his son-in-law claimed the position but it turned out that he had a relative in the community. If I remember correctly the Chatam Sofer ruled that he could not become the rav.
Joseph?
1. I did not see where the Seridei Esh says that. In fact, the Chafetz Chaim rescinded an invitation Rav Meir Shapiro when the latter asked that the CC’s wife not sit at the same table.
2. The Levush (Minhagim 36) defends mixed seating at weddings. Rav Moshe also permits it (Iggerot Moshe OC 1:41).
Time, I hope that he did not give any to people who are allergic. In nay case, it could be that the Steipler realized from speaking to them that their illnesses were psychosomatic. Once a woman who was suffering from a seriosu illness asked the Noda b’Yehuda for a kameia. He gavce her a rolled-up rag and told her to open it in a week. If it was blank it meant that she was permanently cured. She got better and to her joy when she opened it it was blank – as it always had been (see Meiri regarding the evil eye on Baba Metzia 107b and compare the masakana regarding pairs on Pesachim 110b).
Gavra, generally speaking in Litvish communities people are not choshesh.
Time, yes he is a talmid.
HaLevi, the question is on what level is it true. The Maharal(Ber Hagolah 6) says that they are referring to the spiritual world and not the physical world. Indeed, it is very difficult to think that Ravina and Rav Ashi put scientific statements into the Gemara, which is a Torah work and not a scientific work. It could very well be that the spiritual counterpart of a physical phenomenon behaves differently. It could also be that a legal definition differs from a scientific definition. Thus putting food into water a keli sheini does not cook it halachically even if it does cook it chemically.
JM, they can have whatever opinion they want butthey will have to jsutify it with sources. They will also have to find a terutz for the reality of guys who are going OTD and worse because it is not for them and they do not have an alternative.
Zahavasdad, you should join the remedial reading class. According to Dictionary.com “Should” means “must; ought (used to indicate duty, propriety, or expediency)”.
Geordie, I am here so that you can drink from the fountain of my wisdom. Insulting an entire segment of the Jewish population is a prerequisite for membership in the CR.
Lilmod, in fact, I know a Chareidi rav who tried to justify the fact that some “frum” guy helped people receive insurance payments even though they were not insured by saying that he did not personally profit but just wanted to do chesed (interestingly, the Torah says that marrying one’s sister is chesed). So far as I know, OO rabbis say that certain acts are sins but that the sinners should be mekareved by looking the other way.
Time, your points are also true about people in other factions. There enough opinions for people to pick and choose. There is even an opinion that it is permitted to rob a goy (Baba Metzia 111b). Ok so it’s not the halacha but why can’t one rely it anyway? Not saying lashon hara about a fellow Jew? You call him a Jew? Not derided a talmid chacham? You call him a talmid chacham?
Catch, you are correct but that is not the spirit of some in the CR. BTW, the reason why the majority in Lakewood are no longer learning full-time is that budget cuts forced the yeshivots to give exams and cutoff those who were not up to pa. This si what I meant (@Golfer) but “waving their fat fingers”. Full-time life-long learning should be only for a small elite. They should also be paid at least as much as research fellows and could be if the butterflies (as they are called in Israel) are put to work.
Catch,
1. I was referring to current practices. In Israel only 45% of Chareidi men work and most of those are in low-paying “religious” jobs. Some leaders have issued bans against secular education, even in Chareidi settings, which effectively ban professional training. In America the situation is different although among some Chassidim there is great opposition even to learning and using English.
2. I do not remember the name of the person who did that but various problematic practices were recorded in the book “??? ??????” which caused the Gra to issue the cherem.
3. I agree that tolerance is a good midda. What about tolerance for MO and RZ?
K-cup,
As a matter of fact, according to Rav Kook (Ein Ayah on masechet Shabbat 2:8) every movement that rises up has some part in Truth. However, there is also much falsehood. The task of chachamim in every generation is to show how some current movement has a Torah source but after it falls we need not refer to it any more.
As for Chassidut, it started as a populist rebellion against the learned elites and therefore was very problematic. One leader said horrible things about talmidei chachamim and another announced during Yom Kippur that he had seen through ruach hakodesh that the gates of Heaven were closed and there was no longer a reason to fast. He then had something to eat. The Baal HaTanya did a great deal to bring it back into the fold.Later the rebbes of Gur, the Sochochover and others made it a halachic movement.
As for reinterpretation of Halacha and hashkafa, what about the current notions about full-time life-long learning for all men, women supporting families while their husbands wave their fat fingers and rabbanim having the answers to all questions, including purely secular matters (even though it is, of course, absolutely forbidden to study secular subjects).
CTL, the more highly educated the jurors the less you can engage in histrionics when neither the law nor justice is on your side. LOL BTW, just out of curiosity, what do you do if a Jew comes to you wanting to sue another Jew? I heard that once a frum judge rebuked two Chassidim for not going to a bet din.
There is an OO manifesto (“Open orthodoxy! A modern Orthodox rabbi’s creed”) which is on-line and by itself seems fine to me. However, Some OO “rabbis” have crossed the line perhaps due to the influence of other groups on YCT. This has led to a push-back by rabbis such as Avraham Gordimer.
So far as I know from what I read on the Internet (I live in Israel) there is a difference in the shuls welcoming (apparently looking the other way) active (as opposed to celibate) gays and giving greater roles to women (e.g. aliyot, leading Kabbalat Shabbat). Hopefully they will take the criticism to heart and retreat a bit as did the Chassidim (according to the Tzemach Tzedek quoted in “Mekor Baruch” by Rabbi Baruch Epstein). According to Rav Kook this is the purpose of opposition to a new group.
I think that MO is a bit more traditional in synagogue practice although now there is also Centrist Orthodoxy and Morethodoxy. Maybe the list of subgroups will become so cumbersome that people will return to tzaddikim/benoni’im/resh’im (also Rav Kook’s view).
Maybe they should move to Houston. They take pride in not having zoning laws.
CTL, how were you allowed on a jury? My understanding was that lawyers do not want anyone who will exercise great influence over the other jurors because of his status and/or who knows too much.
Yehudayona, if you google “Trial Juries: Exemptions, Terms of Service, and Payment” you will find a list of exemptions by jurisdiction. Some are very interesting. For example, Ohio explicitly exempts Amish. In any case, I concede that most jurisdictions do not explicitly exempt clergy but I would imagine that it would make getting a religious exemption easier.
Rav Kook says that there is yeridat hadorot by talmidei chachamim but aliyat hadorot by ammei aratzot. In fact, we see a difference in attitude towards ammei aratzot already in the time of the Amoraim. Apparently education for the masses, started by Yehoshua ben Gamla, did the trick but at the expense of a certain lowering of the level of the elite, perhaps due to diversion of resources.
CTL, someone with semicha might have an extra claim to a religious exemption as some authorities say that Rabbi Eleazer b’Rabbi Shimon was only wrong (Baba Metzia 83b) becuase a talmid chacham should not engage in such activities (Bet Yosef Choshen Mishpat 388 near the end of the siman). I do not know about other religions but it would seem logical that they would have similar attitudes. In any case, I remind you that I wrote “probably” not “definitely”. Please learn the proper use of the English language. You yourself implied that in some jurisdictions there is an official clergy exemption.
Litebrite, a rodef is not necessarily someone who is threatening one’s life. he could even be a forger (Rema Choshen Mishpat 388,12).
CTL, I am surprised that you are not familiar with “In Re Jenison “, that established a religious exemption from jury duty.
Time, I asked Rabbi Hominick and he said that he never heard Rav Soloveichik say such a thing. He added that for RS there was no one greater than Rambam.
CTL, I very strongly suggest that you take a remedial reading course. I wrote “probably”. Even if there is no official exemption I would imagine that the judge has discretion to excuse people based on occupation.
Joseph,
1. I strongly suggest that you join CTL. If enough of you get together you can even lobby the bar association for CLE credit. I wrote that one should ask one’s rav. If you google “jury duty halacha” you will find several opinions. I personally have difficulty with two:
a. One opinion says that it is safek gezel. As the litigants accepted the jury that should not be a problem (see SA CM 22:1 – mishna in Sanhedrin [3,2] says even three shepherds).
b. Another opinion says that experts should judge and not lay people. I have the same difficulty with this opinion.
Of course , the plaintiff is committing a chillul Hashem if he does not have permission from a bet din but in our case the litigants are already in court. BTW, I heard of a case where two Chassidim took their dispute to a secular court and were rebuked by the frum judge for not going to a bet din.
2. The secular authorities have the right and obligation to enact criminal laws for the maintenance. These courts are not bound by halachic rules. YWN coffee room capital punisment. See the extended discussion at http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/capital-punishment. See also (on-line) “Serving as Judge in Secular Courts”.
Joseph, maybe the person should first ask his rav if there is a halachic problem. Even if both parties are Jewish there might not be as the jury generally acts as an arbitration panel. It might even be an opportunity for a kiddush Hashem as a knowledgeable person could bring in Talmudic principles such as ??? ??? ???? ???? ???? ??? ????. BTW, if a person has semicha he probably can get a clergy exemption.
Time,
1. If you are referring to Rabbi Yaakov Hominick, I happen to know him and bli neder I will ask him.
2. I find that very difficult to believe unless Rav Moshe was a child at the time (his father also ordered him to teachh is son himself as his Chabad melamed was spending time on Tanya and neglecting Gemara).
Zhavasdad, mi hu Chareidi?
Zahavasdad,
1. In 1900 JTS was an Orthodox institution. As late as the 1980s it had several Orthodox rabbanim on its faculty (they resigned over the ordination of women).
2. American Orthodox institutions began to be built much earlier. Young Israel was formed in 1912 and YU was established by the merger of Yeshiva College and RIETS in 1915.
Litebrite, regarding Chareidim who are not chreidim l’devar Hashem read Rav Kook’s essay “Massa HaMachonot” in “Maamarei HaRaya”. There he discusses how these labels prevent teshuva. The proof is the fact that every Israeli prison has a”Torani wing”. For that matter, I read that there is a prison in America that has two minyanim – Aguda and Young Israel. There is also a prison in upstate NY that has a kosher kitchen run by a man who murdered his wife and child (but is shomer Shabbat). He also blows the shofar on Rosh HaShana for himself and the other Jewish inmates.
Lilmod, while the Mizrahi (actually there were two until they merged to form the National Religious Party sixty years ago, Mizrahi, which represented the urban middle class, and HaPoel HaMizrahi, which represented the kibbutzim and moshavim) considered Rav Kook to be their posek and he held them in high regard he was never a member of any political movement. His dream was to establish a non-political coalition of all frum people who wanted to work for yishuv Eretz Yisrael to be called Degel Yerushalayim. Unfortunately, he could not find talented organizers and the plan was never actualized. His son, Rav Tzvi Yehuda, never explicitly endorsed any party but gave a beracha to anyone who asked for one as he considered all to have a part of the truth.
Less, actually set prayers and shuls began after the destruction of the First Temple (Hoshea 14:3). Archaeologists have found the remains of shuls from the Second Temple period.
As for the claim that no changes having been made since Sinai, this is errant nonsense. We just celebrated a change (Chanuka) and iy”h we will celebrate another one in Adar. Minhagim are all changes. Kabbalat Shabbat, for example, was instituted by the Chochmei Tzefat (which is why Ashkenazim say it from the bima – to stress that it is not part of Arvit).
Gavra, the Rema says (Choshen Mishpat 163,1) that whenever there is a disagreement over some public matter each person should give his opinion l’shem Shemayim. His opinion and not his rav’s opinion. L’shem Shemayim and not l’shem interests.
Winnie, within the religious public the term “dos” is used to refer to anyone who is more machmir than the speaker.