Thinking out loud

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  • in reply to: EXPLAINER: Covid Regulations Post-Vaccine #1949575
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    For context: Can anyone describe a different illness in which a vaccinated person can give the illness to others, while not sick themselves?

    Is this specific to Covid 19? Is it specific to the system of using mRna to create the protection?

    Actual real knowledge is appreciated. Please include your sources. If you are expressing an opinion, or a personal conclusion based on a combination of whatsapp, legacy media and you neighbors, please just make that clear!

    Thanks!

    in reply to: White Pages for Frum Boro Park Community #1949574
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Have you ever heard of the “Smartlist” App?

    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    You do NOT need a minyan to get married. You need a chassan, a kallah, and 2 kosher Eidim. (It’s a good idea for at least one of those eidim to know the detailed halachos of Erusin, Kedushin etc. to be mesader)

    At such a wedding, there would be no sheva berachos at bentching, since you do need 10 men for that.

    That being said, this is indeed a very painful and sad situation, as historically we certainly have always celebrated chasunos with family and friends sharing, and being mesamayach chassan and kallah. May the powerful tefilos of any chassan and kallah getting married under such circumstances bring us the yeshuos we need at this time!

    “מהרה ישמע בערי יהודה, ובחוצות ירושלים, קול ששון וקול שמחה, קול חתן וקול כלה”

    in reply to: recieved this email today #1839887
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    You do all realize that this exact message is going around currently on Whatsapp, right? I received it twice already. And apparently it’s at least 10 years old, based on this thread!
    These things to NOT make people focus on meaning, Yiras Shamayim, or anything else. They promote cynicism, and distraction from the appropriate response to an Eis Tzarah. And that is the fault of whomever started this thing….

    in reply to: Videos on Tisha B’Av #1770814
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    @ Lightbrite
    On Tisha B’av itself, if there is no event located in your location, you can watch online programs applicable to the day.
    Possibly on this site, and others, there will be a livestream of lectures pertaining to the day. Use google to find Tisha B’av programs.
    There are also programs presented by the Chofetz Chaim Heritage Foundation, and Project Inspire, in many locations throughout the world. If none are near you, you can probably watch them online for a fee.

    Again, use google to find Tisha B’av programs video.

    I hope that helps.

    in reply to: Videos on Tisha B’Av #1770809
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    @csr1
    Forgive my long reply, but if you read it fully, you will see where I have directly addressed your posts.

    Tisha B’av is indeed a day of sadness and mourning. We have a mesora of how to spend the time before chatzos, focused completely on the churban, and its devastating impact on our lives throughout galus. We do this by reciting kinos, painful, emotion laden dirges, written by our leaders referencing the details of the destruction of the Bais Hamikdosh, the dispersion of Klal Yisrael into galus, and the terrible tragedies we have experienced throughout this long galus.

    At chatzos, the tone changes somewhat. Although we are not supposed to distract ourselves from the mourning that is the essence of the day, we are PERMITTED to do other things as needed. I don’t know the source, but there does come a time in the day, where we talk about the future, teshuva, and hope for a return of the shechina to Eretz Yisrael, with the coming of Moshiach.

    Chazal tell us that in any generation that the Bais Hamikdosh is not rebuilt, it is as if that generation is equally responsible for its destruction as we were at the time of the churban. In other words, we need to make changes in OUR lives, in the areas that we have been told would have prevented the churban, and as it follows, can reverse it, and lead to the return of the Bais Hamikdosh, and the open manifestation of the Shechina, with the coming of Moshiach Tzidkeinu.

    Some people are able to maintain the focus on the enormous tragedy of our continued exile by learning parts of Torah that refer to galus, and its causes, or reading intense, painful books and stories of the terrible things that have happened to our nation as a whole, even in recent times. An example of this would be books describing the violence of the crusades, the fires of the Spanish Inquisition, and most recently, the horrors of the Nazi holocaust.

    For many, it is difficult to maintain that focus for an entire day. Others, due to the physical burden of the fast itself, find it difficult to learn, or even read. Being that some activities are permitted after chatzos, they become distracted from the meaning of the day altogether. It is these conditions that have prompted some organizations to create programs that focus on mussar, and self introspection, with the goal of encouraging us to make the changes necessary to bring geulah. It is a different, less intense way to stay connected to the severity of our remaining in galus.

    This galus is said to have been caused by “sinas chinam”, which is translated as BASELESS hate or disregard for other observant Jews, because of perceived imperfection, or simply because of (non-halachic) cultural differences. Over the years, events have been organized, to provide excellent lectures on the topics that are appropriate for Tisha B’av, specifically improving our interpersonal standards as required by Torah. These live events feature talented speakers who educate, and remind us of our obligation to do teshuva, and thus hopefully precipitate the coming of Moshiach and the Geula. In addition, there are masterful video presentations available, geared to acknowledging such shortcomings, and hopefully inspiring us to change our attitudes, and behaviors, with the same intended goal, of making us worthy once again.

    In more recent years, there has been movement to challenge us to recognize that the overwhelming loss of Jews to intermarriage, is equally as tragic and devastating as the murder of our brethren. This is a unique tragedy to our generation. Millions of Jews are either intentionally, or due to circumstance, ignorant of our heritage, and thus almost guaranteed to sever their ties to Judaism. This reality has been referred to as a Spiritual Holocaust. Each individual who cuts himself off, also cuts off untold numbers of potential descendants from Torah observance. Their right of passage to Eternity is being lost forever. This dire situation should disturb us as much as any physical threat to our brothers.

    There are individuals who have been attempting to wake us up to this reality, recognize it for the tragedy that it is, and INSPIRE us to care about our brothers, and ACT before they are lost forever. In an effort to impress the seriousness of this message to us, video presentations have been created to be shown on Tisha B’av, highlighting the lives and activities of individuals who recognize[d] the severity of this threat, and did not sit idly by while other Jews are being lost. The intention is to sensitize us to this form of destruction within our nation, and inspire us to act accordingly. The loss of masses of Jews to assimilation, is also an example of epic destruction to our Nation, and should be no less disturbing than the holocaust.

    The message is: if you could save just ONE Jew from a train headed to Auschwitz, would you? If you can prevent the termination of just ONE Jewis family’s ETERNITY, how can you not?

    For those who can maintain their awareness throughout the day, continuously mourning, and feeling the profound tragedy of our continued exile, such videos may be considered somewhat of an entertaining distraction, and perhaps should be viewed at a different time. For many others, such videos assist in feeling appropriate distress of our current Galus, and hopefully inspire them to care, and make a difference. In this way, Tisha B’av afternoon changes from a time of mindless distraction to meaningful inspiration for change that will hopefully bring the Geula. Individuals ought to be honest with themselves about what is or is not going to keep their attention properly focused on the sadness of Tisha B’av.

    in reply to: “Eretz” Yisroel = Frummer? #1741251
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    As far back as I remember, as a very young child, “Eretz Yisrael” was a part of the Judaism I grew up with. Before I ever heard of Zionism, Politics, or Refugees, there was a place called Eretz Yisrael, part of our lexicon both at home and in school. It was definitely not to “sound” frum!

    Avrohom Avinu was promised that Eretz Yisrael would belong to his decendants. Getting us into Eretz Yisrael was was one of the significant things Hashem did with us after He took us out of Mitzrayim, sung with gusto in Dayeinu. That was the place that Moshe Rabeinu begged to enter, and about which the meraglim spoke negatively, much to our detriment for thousands of years since. Eretz Yisroel is/was the land referred to in Shema; in the parsha of “Vehaya im Shamoa”, which we were warned we would lose if we turn away from Hashem. You get the idea. There was never any reason for me to start calling it Israel!

    As an adult, I do sometimes use the term “Israel”; mostly in political discussion, or when checking flight arrivals and departures.

    At times, it does somehow sound less complicated to just say “Israel” when referring to my destination for a yomtov, or a place to learn Torah. However, when I do that, it really feels empty; like something is missing. The depth of its meaning to me, and the kedusha that is woven into its fabric, somehow feels incomplete when I refer to it as Israel. Israel is just another location, albeit where many of my relatives live. Eretz Yisrael is the holy land, given to us Jews, by Hashem, and it is that holiness that is the basic reason that we go there, despite terrorism, and despite the fact that there are many other beautiful places on Earth to visit.

    It’s not a frumkeit thing. It’s an identity thing. “Israel” is just too shallow a description for a land with which I have a relationship! Eretz Yisrael describes the only place I know which transcends the description of a location.

    in reply to: Hechsherim in Israel #1736330
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    searchin345:
    Please don’t attack me for not providing a sources, I’m not as learned as many here.

    If i say something halachic on a forum, then i definitely have heard it from somebody who is clearly a talmid chochom, and baki b’ halacha. In this case i can’t remember who it was, but it made a roshem. Generally, i am more of a skeptic.

    Maybe everyone else knows this , but
    I have only recently learned that Yashan in Eretz Yisrael is not a chumra.

    Outside of EY, it is still considered a chumra to refrain from chadash, because there are significant chilukei dayos haposkim of whether it applies. I don’t think there’s much disagreement that eating only yashan is REQUIRED in Eretz Yisrael. That applies to food that grew there, AND [If understood this correctly] also to food that you bring in, if you’re going to eat it there! (The sandwich you didn’t end up eating on the plane). You do have the option of holding on to your (crackers?) and eat them once you have left the holy Land. And… food that is chodosh, that grew in E.Y. has no special requirement to be avoided outside E.Y. (unless of course you are following the chumra of eating only yoshon outside of E.Y.)

    If you are frum, you are quite likely to have learned that there are special halachos that apply to food in E.Y. As a Torah observant jew, if you go to E.Y., it is up to you to prepare, and learn how to follow the halachos that pertain only to there. You should find about them from the outset, or immediately upon arriving there.(You probably DO make sure to check the weather forecast before you go, not leaving it up to chance!). It shouldn’t be up to the OU to notify you that INSIDE E.Y., you must eat only yoshon, no matter where it comes from. For such issues, kashrus is highly dependent on how and where a product is consumed.

    Regarding milk powder, Rav Moshe Feinstein’s psak about chalav yisroel affects how we look at the issue. For those not in the U.S.A., it is a far different matter. There apparently is strong reason to conclude that although chalav yisroel is non-negotiable (outside of the U.S., where Reb Moshe’s psak has any significance at all), milk powder as a substance is changed so drastically in the process, that for some reason it no longer requires to be of a chalav yisroel source for some reason – I don’t remember the details.

    in reply to: SBS crazy? #1544968
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    litvishechosid: Welcome to the New York City Public Transit system, used by an average of 5.7 MILLION riders daily! Here is a broader view, that may clarify things for you:

    SBS buses are express buses. They make only “select” stops on an otherwise very long route, and are used primarily by commuters; people who are using the bus daily, twice a day. This system has significantly improved the travel time of commuters on heavily traveled long routes that are not serviced by the subway system.

    New York has a comprehensive public transit system, but it is quite costly for the typical lower/middle class commuter. The MTA has systems in place to somewhat reduce that very high cost of using public transit. A very high percentage of commuters buy a weekly or monthly unlimited metrocard, for a significant savings, so individual rides, including those on the SBS routes are already prepaid, just by owning either type of unlimited metrocard.

    Additionally, most commuters in NYC, especially those who use buses, have a 2-leg commute. Meaning, they use either a bus and a (subway) train, or 2 buses. Even those who are not using a monthly unlimited metrocard, are very likely making use of a free transfer, which is included with almost all trips using a regular pay-per-ride metrocard. The free transfer only works if your metrocard was used (and paid) within the previous 2 hours on a different route.

    I suspect that the actuaries who work for the MTA have concluded that the SBS routes are covered at a very high percentage by the fare that was/will be paid on the previous, or connecting route, or by the use of prepaid unlimited monthly metrocards. The amount of people who literally get a “free ride” if they are on an SBS bus, and did not pay is probably negligible. Regular users of the NYC subway system are also familiar with turnstile jumpers, and riders who wait at emergency exit gates, to enter the system without paying. There is a limited amount of oversight available to prevent or prosecute the scofflaws.

    I presume a cost/benefit analysis is done routinely, to determine how much money (employed policemen/enforcement officers) to invest, for curbing petty theft by non-paying riders. I hope you sleep better now!

    in reply to: Sudden Death #1508525
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    The Torah says to do Teshuva one day before you die. And since one does not know when he will die, it means he should do teshuva every day. If a person lives with that kind of cheshbon hanefesh, his death will be neither sudden or untimely. A life well lived, where each day is meaningful, ends at the exact time that the neshama has completed its tafkid on this Earth. Whether that is old or young. Suddenness can be a bracha: Happiness and joy up to the abrupt end. And very little suffering, if any. It is for the surviving family that shock is very painful.

    Than being said, living every day with a cheshbon hanefesh, includes utilizing the gift of life fully, which includes taking care of one’s health to the best of their ability.

    I am adding this note, just in case this thread was started as a reaction to the news of a “sudden, untimely” death:

    Please be careful to be sensitive to surviving family members. It is highly inappropriate to imply that a particular death could have been prevented.
    1. Only Hashem knows all the facts
    2. Even if you know facts, you don’t know all of them.
    3. One can not judge another’s degree of hishtadlus, and whether or not that had an impact on when they were niftar. Some reckless, unhealthy people have outlived some very conscientious, and health minded ones.
    4. It is ona’as devorim to question the health, or behavioral decisions of a niftar in front of his/her surviving relatives.

    May we all be blessed with long, healthy, and meaningful lives!

    in reply to: Will learning Mussar help a psychopath or Narcissist? Among others. #1508050
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    @Avi K:
    Just to clarify, You do realize that I said that reading a mussar sefer would backfirewhen professional is indicated, right? I gave some examples that apply to depressive, self hate issues. There are other examples, that would apply to grandiosity issues. Either way, I maintain that the problems would get worse, not better.

    in reply to: Will learning Mussar help a psychopath or Narcissist? Among others. #1508051
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    I would also like to add, a person with Narcissistic Personality Disorder will not likely go into treatment…. by choice. However, due to things they may do that hurt others, they may end up in mandated treatment. Apparently, there are ways to slowly have an impact, where the person can (with much difficulty) recognize that they do have a problem. What I said above, is that maybe getting to a place where they recognize that they have a problem at all, is the goal of treatment. There are approaches that have worked. There are many approaches that do not work at all. That much I know. But again, NPD is not a DX that I have personal experience with. I do have first-hand experience with a number of other diagnosed mental health conditions.

    in reply to: Will learning Mussar help a psychopath or Narcissist? Among others. #1507108
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Avi: I was referring to narcissistic personality disorder, not psychopathology. I don’t know anything about antisocial personality disorder, or whether it is in fact the universally accepted description of a psychopath (as Midwest2 posted), or whether the Rambam’s definition of a sheid does in fact refer to a psychopath.

    I was Thinking out loud about what might be a window of bechira for someone who has narcissistic personality disorder, which I acknowledged I know very little about!

    in reply to: Will learning Mussar help a psychopath or Narcissist? Among others. #1507057
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    I would like to qualify one of the above posts that refer collectively to personality disorders. I do not personally know anyone who has been diagnosed specifically with Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

    However, I DO know people who fit the criterion and/or have been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder. In a different thread, I assertively disagreed with a poster who stated as a fact that BPD can not be “cured”. I have since been in contact with one of the foremost professionals who specializes in BPD. She clarified, that often when people are describing a person with Borderline Personality Disorder, the person they are referring to ALSO has Narcissistic Personality Disorder. This detail may explain the difference of opinion and experience I have with Borderline Personality Disorder. People who fit the criterion can definitely recover, and overcome most if not all of the symptoms with a mixture of various approaches. It is very hard work, and every step is heroic. A person who is in the process of recovery deserves a lot of support, respect, and inclusion.

    If they have co-existing Narcissistic Personality Disorder, I do not claim to know the dynamics, or how one might recover from that. As a frum Jew, I find it difficult to believe that something that is truly a personality disorder can not be improved upon with the proper approach. But we are using terminology that does not clearly describe biological realities. We are using terminology that was created by humans, to describe a particular group of behavioral symptoms. Only Hashem knows where a person’s nekudas habechira lies at any given time. Maybe for some people, the nisayon is just to recognize that there is something to fix. That recognition may be a tremedous avoda in itself! (meaning it will take a considerable amount of time and effort to just acknowledge that there is a problem). And maybe that is what Hashem wants from them.

    Also, I would like to second the poster who explained that treating an emotional/mental health problem allows the person to get to a place where they can THEN learn mussar, and apply it. Ironically, the people that I have encountered who have worked very hard to overcome emotional dysregulation with therapy, are already practicing actual mussar concepts; they have challenged previous thoughts and behaviors, and systematically use particular skills to CHANGE their default responses.

    However, had they gone directly to a mussar sefer, the effort would have likely backfired. The first thing they would experience is guilt, self-blame, hopelessness, and other non-productive emotions. Their issues would likely get worse, and the mussar would not be able to be internalized. Because the part of the person that can integrate mussar is not functioning properly! Professional intervention is indicated for healthy function to either resume, or possibly to begin for the first time.

    in reply to: How Careful Must We Be When Eating Out With A Hechsher #1491775
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    @yitzchokm

    You wrote “The standards are different. ” in response to my post.
    What do you mean? Who are your referring to, and what point are you making?
    How would you explain what yochy wrote as his experience:

    “I have both a national and heimish hechsher on my place. The national one comes every month- the hemish one hasn’t come in well over a year and he has no idea what is even in my products.”

    in reply to: How Careful Must We Be When Eating Out With A Hechsher #1491642
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    “The mashgiach is probably paid by both organizations, when he comes for one, he knows exactly whats going on, on behalf of the other as well”.

    Is it likely that yochy, who has a hechsher on his “place” doesn’t know that the mashgiach works for both hechsherim?
    If that is the case, does the mashgiach look for “extra” or “more” details than yochy is expecting from the national hechsher? If the standards are the same, the mashgiach is just getting paid double for doing nothing extra??
    Or, perhaps, the “heimishe” hechsher serves as a “clearing house” for products with the national hescher, for their constituency. Maybe they are stamping their approval on the national hechsher’s standards in this location, because their constituency has certain standards, and they are letting them know that those standards are being met by the national hechsher, in this particular case?

    For example, if they are makpid on bishul yisroel for tuna fish, and the national hechsher isn’t, but in this location, only tuna fish that is bishul yisroel is being used, and the rest of their standards are in sync for this type of place, they will put their stamp on it too.

    Or it’s a bunch of nonsense, in which case, the problem with the heimishe hechsher is even bigger. If they are playing games, than they are not trustworthy altogether, no matter what chumras they hold from! I hope not.

    in reply to: Keeping Mental Illness A Secret In Shidduchim🤕 🤒🤐👰🤵 #1489022
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    To TLIW:
    Thank you for reading what I wrote.

    Firstly, I don’t recall saying anything to

    imply that poor midos might be a characterological situation that will not be affected much by regular reading or studying of sifrei mussar.

    I can’t find a definition for the word characterological. If you are referring to the last line I added to my comment, it was written in the spirit of irony – mixed with some cynicism. But if you are going to lend implications to my words, let me clarify what I really believe! If the problem is really just poor midos, than in fact it should be affected very much by studying sifrei mussar, and adjusting one’s behaviors in sync with what was studied! I was referring to people who do not have emotional dysregulation, but behave poorly, and either do not read sifrei mussar at all, or who do not bother to implement what they have learned. If they did, they would improve their midos, (at their own achievable pace) despite, or apart from their spouse’s _______________ (fill in the blank) problem. They wouldn’t excuse their own negative behavior by comparing it to or blaming it on someone else’s. As far as I’m concerned “sifrei mussar” includes any and all resources that focus on self-improvement.

    Part of your response, though, is the reason I choose to share less of what I know on a forum. Because people disseminate information that seems so solid, with terminology, personal experience, and “facts”. The problem is you don’t have all the facts. You have the facts that you have been exposed to. I did not mention any specific form of therapy, nor any particular therapist, other than an author of a book.

    Just like you felt that some of what I wrote needed to be qualified, I would like to qualify some of what you wrote, in fairness to a significant group of vulnerable people, as well as to the readers on this forum. My objective here is not to encourage anyone to marry someone who behaves irrationally most of the time, or is abusive. I just want to balance out statements that can be taken as absolutes, and cause undue pain – and damage. Especially for the benefit of people who seem to think that a YWN forum is a good source for factual, statistical information!!

    I do not believe that the treatment du jour, DBT is the full answer to ANY diagnosis. (actually, the new treatment du jour may be EMDR, but it’s hard to keep up with these things!)
    Dialectical Behavioral Therapy is used today for many different issues. As you said, it is a [good] set of skills. Actually, it’s probably good for anyone, but particularly someone with intense emotions.

    The position you have taken, (and chosen to share on this public forum) dismisses out of hand all people who for various reasons exhibit 4 or 5 (or more) out of 9 symptoms that describe BPD. (or fit the conditions in the way it is currently described in the DSM5 manual for psychiatric diagnoses, which I may add CHANGES, every few years. Is it the people who change, or the information, or the medical editorship, or ?…..)

    There is a very broad spectrum of people who fit the criteria for BPD. There is conventional, and non-conventional BPD. There are people who are narcissistic, and people who are not. There are people in supportive families, and people who live(d) in a severely judgmental home. It is simply not true that recovery is not possible for all people with this diagnosis. Underlying trauma can be treated, and it isn’t treated only with DBT. There is no set amount of time for recovery from trauma. But recovery is possible. It is not up to you to determine whether a particular experience or family dynamic was traumatic! Recovery has steps, and those steps may be different for different people. I grant you this: a person who exhibits most of the destructive behaviors consistent with Borderline Personality Disorder, is probably not in recovery! That doesn’t mean they CAN’T be. While a person is in recovery, depending on where they are holding, they may be ripe for a relationship, or they may not be. And depending who you are as a person, you may have the disposition to see strengths outweighing weaknesses, or you may be someone who has a keen eye for weaknesses, and low tolerance for them.

    I read your comment to somebody today, and she said something funny:
    Crawling isn’t curable either. Generally people learn to walk, so it becomes less of a problem.
    Maybe it’s true that you can’t cure BPD. But a person CAN grow out of it, and MOVE on, and no longer be “disordered”!

    There are some excellent therapists out there. There also are some pretty unskilled, under-educated, and non-emapthetic(!) ones, when it comes to this diagnosis, sadly. With a number of different successful interventions, support, skills, courage, will, and appropriate attention to the maladaptive traits that have developed, a person with BPD can REALLY evolve, grow, and change. They need not remain on the verge of reverting to old, desperate responses to stress. Their personality will likely always be a more sensitive one. That may make them capable of more empathy and deeper relationships than the average person!

    We do both agree that it’s a good idea to find out from people how a particular shidduch prospect responds currently in certain situations. You can also ask the person themselves. A person in recovery from BPD, knows quite well how they respond, and whether or not they stillneed extra doses of patience, understanding, and validation. Since it seems from statistics, that most of these people are quite intelligent, it would seem that they are best off with an intelligent spouse…. who would benefit from the book I referred to. I do not know if you have any sort of license to issue diagnoses. Perhaps you do. Perhaps you have not met anyone who recovered/is recovering from BPD. Or maybe you did, but you didn’t know! 🙂

    I will not continue to post about this, for the reason I presented in my post above
    HERE

    in reply to: Keeping Mental Illness A Secret In Shidduchim🤕 🤒🤐👰🤵 #1487862
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Moderators: Did most of my post get deleted?

    in reply to: Keeping Mental Illness A Secret In Shidduchim🤕 🤒🤐👰🤵 #1487438
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Wow. Just wow. I have just gone through 3 pages of comments, and I have a dilemma. (After the first page, admittedly I only skimmed through the rest of the comments) I have commented in the coffee room off an on over many years. I have much to say about this topic, and I want to. However, I have found that when people try to explain “mental Illness” or “emotional illness” or whatever the current description is, many people use the information to further hurt people. I have seen articles written in the popular Jewish/heimishe magazines, with the obvious intent to dispel the stigma. I have concluded that it doesn’t work. When people have already reached a conclusion, whatever it may be, more information becomes more fodder for making the stigma BIGGER. This thread is a perfect example of this. There is ignorance mixed up with linear information, individual unfortunate experiences mixed up with generalizations, opinions mixed up with facts, fear mixed up with self-righteousnous… I could go on. And so, as frustrating as it may be, I will remain silent. Here. In real life, I share what I know with people who already are open to listening. To those who do want to know, I want to address the diagnosis that seems to have been labeled “untreatable”, and more. There are resources far more authoritive than a thread on YWN. Try reading a book, if I recall it may be titled “Walking on eggshells [when someone you care about has borderline personality disorder]” The author(s) include a clinician named Paul Mason. There is a “method to the madness”, and there are ways of working with someone who is working on themself.

    And here’s an interesting thought: Occasionally, a person with a diagnosed emotional disorder unfortunately marries a nasty or abusive person with no diagnosis!!! They just have really bad midos, and no real “need” to work on themself when they can blame everything on their ‘damaged’ spouse.

    in reply to: Keeping Mental Illness A Secret In Shidduchim🤕 🤒🤐👰🤵 #1487441
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    To yitzymotcha: my heart goes out to you. The frum world is in a cocoon when it comes to this. In the outside world, most people meet and develop a relationship before it ever occurs to them to consider marriage. A strong relationship leads many to marry people with whom they know that life may be challenging. Whether it is Mental Illness, early onset Parkinson’s, Multiple Sclerosis, Type 1 diabetes, or a genetic problem in their family. Because they really want to be with that person. It’s WORTH it to them! In our world, the system, for understandable reasons doesn’t lend itself to that sort of situation. I am close enough to this topic to be quite well-informed. If I can give you some chizuk, this is what it would be:
    1. Hashem is really, really in charge. He has given different people different nisyonos. I’m sure that you have some very special qualities. My assumption, based on some of what you’ve written, is that you know yourself, perhaps better than many others know themselves. Which lends itself to a refreshing sort of honesty, and reality based approach to life, and perhaps also to your yiddishkeit. My hope for you, and one that YOU should daven for, is that at least one… (and you only need one!) young woman will meet you, and find your individual strengths so worthwhile, that their response to your revelation will be… things like “How does that work? How does it feel? How would it affect me? What would I/could I do to complement who you are, and what you struggle with?” This would be a person who has already seen that you have very special qualities that would benefit her life, and that she is attracted to. You will be “WORTH” it to her! If she is really listening, because she wants to understand you better, you may be surprised at how impressed she will be with the strengths you have developed. She may even say “You seem so “normal”, I didn’t know one day I would meet someone who could truly understand my own triumphs over adversity!”
    I have seen it, and I have spoken to Doctors who have seen it. I don’t know the “right” shadchan for you. I know ultimately Hashem orchestrates shidduchim.

    2. There is currently a program in Cornell for especially dedicated to treatment of pregnant women who have emotional dysregulation in their history. This is a program dedicated to successful, productive outcomes in building a family, for individuals who are on medication, in therapy, and are high risk for mental health problems during and after pregnancy. I am mentioning this, despite your being a male, as an example of what some educated people out there believe, and what they are doing about it. It is possible, and it is doable, and it is reasonable for adults with challenges to have and raise healthy children, given the proper approaches, support, and reality checking that is necessary. If these medical doctors and therapists didn’t truly believe that, they would not have such a program. They would be referring people to “family planning” resources, as well as clinics to simply “get rid” of the “problem” as early as possible. (It would be inappropriate to use explicit terminology on this board).

    3. I know a woman who is currently in that program. She has very mild asperger’s, bipolar disorder, AND borderline personality disorder! Really! She takes medication, and has done a lot of therapy, and continues to do more. She is constantly growing. Her husband loves her for everything she is: A deeply caring friend, an incredibly dedicated partner, a smart, capable and proactive, solution oriented person, and so much more. Why did he marry her? Because they dated for many months, over which time he got to know her well – and can’t imagine life without her. But what about him? Well they were introduced because they have common interests in the area of emergency medicine! Guess what: like most people, he has plenty of “issues”. Ironically, his have never been diagnosed, because apparently they never got in the way of his functioning as a bachelor! But he is a very devoted, responsible, loving person, and she is very attracted to him, and appreciative of how he treats her. Often, she has more insight into his “mishugasin” than he does. But she sees him as a whole person, who comes with strengths and weaknesses. As we all do. He has learned how to keep things real during her times of distress, and she has learned to tolerate and/or redirect the focus, when it is necessary for sholom bayis. And they keep learning!

    As a friend, I am amazed at their relationship: How they go about their life together, the ups and downs, and the incredible commitment they each have to the other – and to their marriage. They are constantly doing things – small things – specifically to make each other happy.
    They don’t sacrifice – they invest!

    4. Many years ago, a young man was a guest for Shabbos in my parents’ home. He had come from a distant country for the simcha of a close friend. His wife and 4 children stayed behind. Due to a bunch of circumstances I ended up driving him to JFK airport after Shabbos. Somehow during that trip, this gentleman revealed to me that his wife suffers from major depression. She takes medication, and sees a therapist. To paraphrase HIS words, “this is a nisayon that Hashem has given US. I am glad that I did NOT know before, because I shudder to think that in my ignorance I may have turned away my zivug, the love of my life. I didn’t know because She didn’t know.” Apparently she had not yet had a major episode before they got married. Being that I do know more than the average frum Brooklyn Jew about mental dysregulation, I asked him how it has affected him. His answer: “I am much closer to my children than most fathers. At times that she was unable to be there for the children, I stepped in as father AND mother. I have explained to them that Mommy loves you very much. but that part of her is not working correctly right now. She will get better. Let’s daaven that it is soon. And the rest of the time, we raise our children together. I just wish she suffered less”.

    He did not sigh. He in no way presented as carrying a heavy burden. He was far from pitiful. I must add that due to his geographical location, he is not “handicapped” by the limited vision that seems to be common in the frum community in and around New York, where I live. He said a lot more, (In his delightful accent), but as I mentioned in my first paragraph above, I hesitate to share more information on this forum.

    I believe that Hashem orchestrated that this man stayed in my parents’ home, and needed a ride at the last minute, at least in part so that I could see what is possible. So that further down the road, I would be able to give chizuk to those whose mental health challenges are known to me.

    (In no way do I mean to insinuate that anyone should hide a serious detail in their life from a potential shidduch. Deceipt destroys trust, without which a marriage is not viable. One should look for signs that the potential mate has the backbone and skills to deal with his/her personal problem, and then share the challenge intelligently, paying careful attention to the response. Rejection hurts, but it also protects you from someone who is not right for you.)

    Where there is capacity for deep pain, there is also capacity for deep simcha, deep compassion, deep connection, and deep love. Some people really value that.

    May your tefillos: spoken and unspoken, be answered for good very soon. Forget about statistics; Hashem works with each of us in a personal, individual way.

    in reply to: Were you scared of your basement? #1446095
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Yes! I was scared down there, if I was alone. And it was also a finished basement! We actually kept our games and toys down there, and part of it was set up as a cheerful playroom. I used to insist (as did my siblings who were close in age to me) that somebody come down there with me, even if it was just to fetch a game, or bring up extra paper towels. And to my parents’ chagrin, we wouldn’t play down there alone, which sometimes resulted in bored kvetchy kids in the house, despite a playroom full of toys and games! But I never told them I was scared, and they never really asked why I didn’t want to go there alone.

    When I got older, I realized that the scary stuff was household noise from plumbing and heating systems. Sometimes the boiler went on, or off. Sometimes water swished through pipes that were visible, or that were inside a dropped ceiling. The lighting fixtures in most of the basement held 2 8 ft. fluorescent bulbs. Sometimes they made buzzing noises. (bulbs or ballasts going bad). There was also a spare freezer down there, that turned on and off throughout the day. It was probably quieter in the basement than in the apartment we lived in upstairs, so those noises were even more noticeable.

    My imagination must have run rampant about all those mysterious sounds!

    In response to Lightbrite: How would you know if your child today is scared of being in the basement alone? What can you do about making it a friendlier place?

    For the first time in almost 50 years, there are currently no family members living in the house I grew up in. There are two tenants. One of them has use of the finished basement. Before that tenant moved in, the mom brought her kids to see their new home. I happened to be there, helping to pack up the belongings of my relative who was moving out. I went along as the kids got a tour of the apartment, and the finished basement. I suddenly had a great idea. I remembered how scared I used to be.

    Much to the surprise of my vacating relative, I showed the kids the pipes, and I told them that sometimes they make noises. I explained that it’s just running water, not a boogeyman! I showed them the boiler room, and pointed out that it makes a noise when it goes on and off. I told them that any noise they hear comes from a physical component of the house, or an appliance. There are no ghosts, or any other creatures! I think that my relative, who only lived there as an adult was quite surprised that I was saying all those things. She apparently had no idea how scared us younger kids were down there. And that it could have been addressed so easily.

    By giving explanations in advance, the noises could be expected, and have rational explanations. I hope that tour prevented the development of imaginary ideas, the likes of which made the basement such a scary place to be alone when I was a kid! If my idea worked, the kids are enjoying the additional space, with no strings attached!

    in reply to: Tznius Problem? #1364145
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Perhaps this is worthy of a new thread, but for now I’m posting it here. Maybe it’s not a bad thing to go off topic for a bit…. in order to help people more intelligently communicate their opinions or thoughts!
    This is a pet peeve of mine, based not in perfectionism, but in intelligent communication:

    Tznius is a noun!
    It is not an adjective.

    To use it in a sentence:
    a. Tznius is a good trait. b. One can have a discussion on proper dress, and proper behavior. That would be a discussion about Tznius. c. The topic in which we review, or teach, the Torah’s approach for proper presentation of ourselves in a way that does not attract attention is called Tznius.

    A noun is a word used as the name of a person, place, thing, state, quality, activity, action etc… The word Tznius is an abstract noun. (the name given to a quality or action or state which we can understand but we can not touch and see.) Other abstract nouns are hunger, and altruism.
    A person can not be Tznius, just like a person can not be hunger or altruism.

    An adjective is a word that describes or modifies another word; usually a noun or another adjective. If we want to describe a person in any way, we need to use an adjective. In this thread, posters are trying to describe themselves or others, as having the trait of tznius.

    In Yiddish an adjective was made out of the noun, using Yiddish grammar: That word is “TZNIUSDIK“. Tzniusdik is a word that DESCRIBES either a person, or a behavior, or a type of clothing.
    A person can</can> be Tzniusdik Just like a person can be hungry or altruistic. (adjectives)

    For decades, in the United States, religious Jews who speak English have maintained yiddish terms for certain Jewish objects, practices, or ideas. We daven. We wash negel vasser. We fargin others. And we hopefully are Tzniusdik.

    In Hebrew one would say that a person dresses or acts “Bitznius” (with tznius). There IS a descriptive noun in Hebrew for one who dresses or acts in this way. That person is a Tzanua צנוע (male), or a Tzinuah צנועה (female). The person would not be called a “tznius”.

    It seems like the current generation has an aversion to using the Yiddish term, but they have not replaced it with an English one! I suppose it would be reasonable to say “I act or dress tsniusly” (an adverb describing the verb act or the verb dress). However, that term hasn’t taken off as of yet! I haven’t yet found anyone who has properly “Englishized” (my own made up term) the word tniusdik. Instead the Hebrew noun tznius is being used incorrectly as an adjective,

    For those of us who typically use proper Grammar, hearing a noun used incorrectly, or as an adjective distracts from the subject just as much as this post distracts from the topic of the thread!

    You may think you are not particular about grammar, but If someone said to you “I am Science”, instead of saying “I am a Scientist”, I’m pretty sure you would correct them! They are both nouns, but only the second one can be properly used in that sentence, with the word “a” before it. The sentence “She is tznius” makes no sense. Grammatically, you could say “She is a tniusist”, but that word hasn’t taken off either.

    Furthermore, If someone said “He is hunger” instead of “He is hungry” you would likely correct their use of a noun (hunger) in place of an adjective (hungry). Otherwise, you would lose track of the rest of their thought, as your mind gets dsitracted by that incongruous statement. (How can he be hunger?)

    I have not come up with an Englishized word for the Yiddish term tniusdik. which means “has the characteristics of tznius”, and is an adjective according to Yiddish Grammar.

    hunger is to hungry as
    tnius is to tsniusdik. But that is Yiddish.

    Modest, modesty, and modestly, are used by some, but they do not quite translate the Jewish concept of tznius satisfactorily! Can someone come up with a grammatically correct English ADJECTIVE derived from the Hebew noun tznius?

    Until then, your language will be more intelligible if you just use the Yiddish adjective, instead of incorrectly using the Hebrew noun as a description!

    in reply to: anyone here has aphantasia? #1338083
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Can somebody explain this better? I’m not sure if I can visualize things or not. do you mean that if I close my eyes I should be able to picture things as if I’m looking at a color photograph? I can picture the scene I saw during a traumatic incident when I was a kid. I don’t have to close my eyes. But if I close my eyes, and try to visualize… let’s say my sister’s living room…. the image slips away. I am not sure if I’m seeing anything or I’m thinking it!

    I know her couch is brown…. I don’t know if I’m seeing the color brown as if I’m looking at a picture! Now that I tried it, I think I can visualize only if my eyes are open! Does that make any sense?

    in reply to: Update for 5ish – Soncino Shas! #1291039
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    The deed is done! It was left at the security desk today. Hopefully it got to you, 5ish!
    I hear what you are saying re: maintaining the degree of effort that you put into your learning.
    Thank you for sharing that!
    May you have much siyata d’Shmaya, and
    may it be an aliya for the neshama of R’ Yisroel ben R’ Yechiel, Z”L.

    in reply to: Update for 5ish – Soncino Shas! #1289777
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    OK, let’s try this again!! I still have the last volume of the Shas.
    I may be able to drop it off on Tuesday at the same location. However, since I am not part of a college, I don’t know: Are we in middle of a semester? Will the person who needs to get the gemara from the guard be there during regular hours this week?
    Thanks!

    in reply to: can anyone tell me how to change my password? #1289773
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Can someone tell me how to access my profile and change my password?!

    in reply to: Ten Yad Chasunah “Package” – info? 🏈🏟️📏 #1281150
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    They are a little vague unless you fill out an application for assistance.

    in reply to: Seeking a Chuppah to help a fellow Jew get married (renamed) #1280215
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Thank you.
    That was helpful. I am using one of them, IYH

    Now I just found out there are no Flowers either!

    in reply to: Seeking a Chuppah to help a fellow Jew get married (renamed) #1277493
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Bump
    Update, apparently the music is taken care of, BH.
    I still need to find a portable Chuppah and any resources for $ to help buy what they don’t have yet. Like tablecloths, potato peelers, sink dish racks, cleaning supplies, and a whole bunch of stuff in between.

    in reply to: Seeking a Chuppah to help a fellow Jew get married (renamed) #1277270
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    New York City & Brooklyn

    in reply to: YWN website security issues? #1275816
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Thank you dovidBT.
    Are there any ramifications for me as a poster?

    Do you know what can be compromised?
    Thanks.

    in reply to: גהנום #1275784
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Yes, Lilmos Ulelamaid, you are correct.
    Thank you.
    Yiras Shamayim should be done with Joy.

    I think I mixed up the two, because the “movement” to serve Hashem with Joy these days, often mixes the two concepts.
    Love sounds more joyful than Awe or fear, or trepidation. There are songs that seem to mix the two together. Perhaps it is more accurate to say, that often those who are singing and dancing (sometimes in the streets) that it is a mitzvah to always be happy, also seem to be focused on Loving HaShem (whatever that means to them). It just sounds “lighter”.
    I was addressing that.

    Still you are 100% correct. They are NOT automatically linked. Yiras Shamayim needs to be lived with Joy. That takes a deeper understanding.

    in reply to: גהנום #1273874
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    One thing is for certain: the non-Jewish understanding of the “bad” place, is completely wrong, and has no place in Yiddishkeit. Being raised in Golus, we are exposed to the beliefs of other religions, sometimes without realizing it. Especially because they sometimes use the same words as we do, when we are translating these concepts from Lashon Hakodesh, into whatever language we use. I don’t know what Gehinnom is for blatant Resha-im. I’m referring to Jewish people who were imperfect, and sometimes very, very far from perfect. They may have been completely secular; only Hashem can judge what opportunities they may have had that they missed. According to our Mesorah, Gehinnom is a temporary place, that serves a purpose.

    Col Yisrael Yesh Lahem Chelek L’olam Habah.
    One CAN lose their chelek, for example by embarrasing someone. But besides for asking mechila, and doing as much Teshuva as possible, the person then starts building up their chelek again.
    There are things for which one can not do Teshuva, but very very few. Even things that are VERY bad, Yom Kippur can be mechaper in addition to teshuva; Yessurim can be mechaper in addition to teshuva; Misa can be mechaper in addition to teshuva.

    in reply to: גהנום #1273836
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Fascinating fact:
    If a person did proper Teshuva in this world – from Yirah – the negative act literally disappears. And if the person did proper Teshuva in this world – from Ahava – the negative act actually is transformed into a Mitzvah. This is not “logical”. But it is part of Creation. Teshuva had to be created separately, because it defies all of nature. (How can you change the past? You Can!!)

    in reply to: גהנום #1273793
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    That’s not exactly accurate, Lilmod.
    Reishis Chochma Yiras Hashem…. is supposed to come first.
    I forget who I’m quoting (R’ Y. Salanter??)
    Yirah without Ahava is a chisaron
    Ahava without yirah is “gornisht”

    But it is true that true Yiras Shamayim should take a logical path of leading to Ahavas Hashem.
    Perhaps one way to explain this (this may not be exact), is imagine a strong, powerful, influential, kind and caring Boss. You recognize that he can fire you at any point… Yirah. But the way he interacts with you/cares for you is so, so positive, that you just want to make him happy. You know he is the Boss, but you love him, and are doing your work for him for that reason.

    On the other hand, if you just do your work because you love him, when it comes to times that he does things that you don’t understand, the love may not carry you through. And you may act like a disgruntled employee.

    in reply to: גהנום #1273815
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    The following are things I learned, which at the time were well sourced. I did not make up any of this! I do not remember the sources, but perhaps some of the more learned people here can identify those sources:

    Another approach is that Gehinom is an experience of intolerable deep shame and regret.

    In this world, we are subject to time, as well as other parts of creation that mask the perpetual reality of Hashem, His Light, and our only purpose for being here – to do things that will make us closer to Him (read: s’char – reward). We have opportunities here. Once our time is up, we separate from the limitations of our bodies, creation in this world, and all other “things” that only exist in the world as we know it when we are alive. Those things may have served as a mask to the full Glory of Hashem, and His Omnipotence, causing us to at times choose things that did not bring us closer to Him. All at once, (there is no time outside the creation that we live in), we are faced with where we ARE, compared to where we COULD have been. It is crystal clear to us. And we can no longer do anything about it. The shame and regret is beyond what a living human being can fathom.

    note: those of us in this world, who were in ANY way affected by the Neshama that has departed, CAN do things HERE that can affect that Neshama. The mitzvos, Torah learning, Kiddush Shem Shamayim, etc. that we do has a direct impact on “compensating” for the lost opportunities. That is why we say Kaddish for the first 11 months, and why children, students, or acquaintances deliberately do things for the Neshama to have an “Aliya”. After the first year, the yahrtzeit serves as a time where the persons’ life is again under “review” of some sort, and is a date on which we can, and should do things that give the Neshama an Aliya.

    in reply to: Update for 5ish – Soncino Shas! #1272809
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Oops. Forgot to take it with me. Sorry. A different day…

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1272777
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    To 5ish
    I would like to drop off the last volume today.
    Same location? Same instructions?

    Best
    Thinking out Loud

    in reply to: Smiley faces #1239885
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    I am really confused.
    How did you post the emojis, Lightbrite? Is it a feature on YWN now, or did you post from a smartphone, and now we can all copy and paste from your post?

    Can someone remind me how to use code for colors. I haven’t used HTML markup up in a really long time.

    And lastly, how did Joseph insert a picture on a different thread? Where is it permissible to link to? Or are the mods just playing with our heads??

    I once knew how to do this stuff….!

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1239079
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Bump!

    My last post on this thread has information about Another shas I found!
    I’m looking for suggestions again…

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228488
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    I really don’t have a clue what to do with these. As I stated previously, there is a market for translations of the Talmud. However, the market includes many “scholars”, both Jewish, and non-Jewish, who misuse it by learning it without proper mesorah. They misinterpret it, sometimes deliberately, and use it to discredit Torah MiSinai Judaism. It would be devastating if Sefarim that belonged to my father, Z”L ended up in the hands of people who do not have Yiras Shamayim. Therefore, offering it up for sale to the highest bidder is not an option.

    There seems to be one specific factor that makes this set uniquely valuable. According to a comment on a review I found online, the original Soncino translation included a comprehensive index. This edition includes that index, as well as some sort of Hebrew index for the entire Gemara, and indexes for each individual mesechta.

    The familiar, popular Soncino edition (which I gave to 5ish) was formatted to present the translation directly opposite the original text of a Vilna Shas, page by page. The original Soncino index was compromised in the process (since the pagination was completely redone, among other factors). There is now an additional index volume that was done for the page by page translation, but apparently it does not have all the features that exist in the indexes that are included in the small set I am discussing.

    Maybe somebody who has lots of shelf space, would want this set just to be able to use these indexes, which are more comprehensive, or more clearly organized than the page by page translation. According to that reviewer, Artscroll and other well known translations do not have indexes at all.

    It does seem this would be valuable as a supplemental reference tool in a Beis Medrash library. It would have to be in one where this translation is well-received.

    Again, ideas are welcome!!

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228487
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Perhaps I should start another thread!

    I just found something else on a very high shelf on top of my father’s seforim:

    It’s a small size set of Shas (yup, another one). Each volume measures about 5.5″ X 8.5″. It seems to be similar, or perhaps identical to the Soncino, as it says it is translated “under the editorship” of the same Rabbi Dr. Epstein. The only publisher I found inside the volume I looked at was “Rebecca Bennett Publications”.

    Upon doing some research, I believe the translation and commentary may actually be an unauthorized copy of the Soncino. The tzuras hadaf is apparently a copy of the Lemberg Edition (not Vilna) Shas, in a reduced size to fit the smaller pages. If I understand correctly, that means that each daf is divided into 2 pages, and possibly some of the classic commentaries are not printed on the daf. This makes sense, because if they had used the Vilna Edition, and reduced it to fit the small pages, the print would be too tiny to learn from.

    Each volume has some or all of a mesechta in the first half, starting from the front when opening a sefer written in Lashon Hakodesh (Hebrew). The other half is the English translation and commentary, starting from the front, when opening a book written in English.

    In other words, the English translation and commentary is not printed page by page opposite the Aramaic/Hebrew text of the Gemara. It’s in a totally separate section in each volume. There are A LOT of volumes. An online site called Bibliopolis is selling this set, with 63 volumes. I have to count, but I estimated around 70 volumes. (I need to spend some time on a ladder in my parents’ living room for a proper inspection).

    My father’s set is bound in a red color, and appears to be in excellent condition. You can see accurate photos, by going to ebay, and searching for this item:

    Hebrew English Talmud CHULLIN II Bennet Jewish

    A seller called bluebirds15 is selling individual volumes from what looks like an identical set. On the listing for this particular volume (Chullin II), the seller posted a picture of the outside of the Gemara, plus a few pictures of the inside also.

    I imagine my father Z”L bought these because of their size, for use on the subway during his commute to work. They were probably easier to maneuver on a crowded train, than a regular sized Gemara. The volumes are a bit thick in relation to the width and length dimensions; about 1 1/2 inches give or take some millimeters.

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228486
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    LOL Geordie.

    The final chapter in this thread will be when I have an opportunity to drop off the Mesechtos Ketanos volume, and 5ish confirms receiving it.

    Since it’s only one volume, I will not be bothering anyone to drive to Touro, so I’m not sure when that will be. But I’ll try to post the Finale for you Geordie!

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228473
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    bump

    Is 5ish still reading this??

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228472
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    bump

    in reply to: Inaccurate things we learned as kids #1222470
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    This thread has changed topic unfortunately, and I hope for everyone’s sake, that we find a way to get back to the more lighthearted spirit of the thread.

    That being said, I do have a comment that is both an innacurate thing we [may have] learned as kids, as well as my 2 cents regarding a person’s inherent value. It really deserves a thread all of its own:

    Many people, some of whom I am very close to, were taught as kids that they in fact do not have worth. It could have been through direct emotionally abusive statements, or indirectly, by implication, as their primary caregivers gave that message in their invalidating interactions.

    As disturbing and untrue that belief may be, it is sadly at the heart of emotional difficulties for many people. What we are taught as kids on this topic is critical to our development. We BELIEVE our primary caregivers, because they are the initial providers of our realities.

    It can take a lifetime of therapy to challenge such a destructive belief successfully. Logic, or proofs from the Torah are usually not enough to override such a deeply ingrained handicap. It is incredibly powerful. Even sadder, this belief, when expressed to, or perceived by others, often results in rejection. It’s not pleasant to be around someone who constantly puts themselves down. And so the negative belief develops into a life in which it is routinely reinforced as the truth!

    If your early life experience gave you a message that you have worth just because you exist, do not take that lightly. It is something to be very grateful for. Not everyone received that message.

    Only Hashem knows why some people are given this nisayon, which impacts almost every interaction they experience.

    There is help out there. It takes a lot for a person to even recognize that what they consider a fact, is really an unfortunate learned belief, and it may be helped with therapy.

    .

    .

    .

    <attempt at topic redirection>

    “reprinted” from another thread,

    Inaccurate thing:

    a bungalow colony is called a country!

    There are currently a number of community based telephone directories that are distributed in certain areas of Brooklyn. They are for-profit publications supported by commercial listings. There is usually an attempt to include a reference section, with random useful information. In one of these directories, a section for the Catskills is included. One of the lists in this section is titled – I couldn’t make this up – Camps, Mikvas, and Countries!!!

    </attempt at topic redirection>

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228470
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Just when I thought this thread was closed, I found another volume from Soncino, in a different set of bookshelves!

    It is called “Mesechtos Ketanos”, and looks like it is part of the set. On the spine is listed:

    Avos D’Rabbi Nassan

    Soferim

    Semachos

    Kallah

    Kallah Rabbo

    Derech Eretz Rabbah

    Perek Hashalom

    Gerim

    Kutim

    Avadim

    Sefer Torah

    Tefillin

    Tzitzis

    Mezuzah

    5ish-

    Should I drop off this volume in the same place I dropped off the 4 boxes?

    in reply to: 5 Days To Save This Jewish Captive in Arab Prison #1219376
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    bump

    It is my understanding that pidyon shevuyim trumps all other causes. (Is that true?). I donated to this campaign. The trial was supposedly postponed for 2 weeks.

    Does anybody know what happened since then?

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228467
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    Thank you for the confirmation, 5ish. I’m confident that I did the right thing!

    I wonder if my last post(s) were the trigger for the 1000 word per post limit being instituted.

    <kidding> I hope I didn’t exchange a Shas for an addiction to the coffee room! :/ </kidding>

    in reply to: Anyone use Soncino Gemara? #1228463
    Thinking out loud
    Participant

    One more note:

    This entire time, it never occured to me to simply Google “Soncino Shas”. I just did. Entire sets are available for sale on both Amazon and Ebay for hundreds of dollars. Individual volumes are also listed. It can also be purchased in digital form for Kindle or other electronic media. Apparently there is a market for it.

    I followed some of the other results of my google search. It is obvious that as I suspected, some of those interested in a translated Shas, do not believe that Torah Sheb’al Peh was given together with Torah Shebichtav. Therefore, a concise translation can create an “open season” for understanding the gemara in any way a person is so inclined. I suppose that is why I hesitated before deciding to give away the Shas in the way that I did.

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