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Geordie
“I suppose because when the original people settled there, they arrived by boat and possibly weren’t aware of the days or the different shitos in the rishonim. So they just kept Shabbos on Saturday like it is in most places of the settled world.”
Actually according to Rav tzvi PEsach Frank and Rav Isser Zalman MEltzer this is the halacha. They hold Shabbos is when that locale considers Saturday.
Joseph
Thanks, got it.
Though you dont consider what you describe as contradicting the very definition of “vote”
as in “The Electors shall meet in their respective states, and vote by ballot…”
If an Elector gets unappointed if he chooses the “wrong” candidate, I dont really see how that fits with “The Electors shall… vote…”
Akuperma
“The right to bear arms always referred to arms..”
Ah so you are interpreting the intent and not what it says. Fair enough. SO i interpret their intent as limiting to arms that were present in their day or that could only kill x number of people a minute.
Seondly, grenades and bazookas are carried yourself
Third do you have a source that cannons arent considered “Arms”
“Since the 2nd amendment refers to the state militia,”
that should read REFFERED. IT was historically interpreted that way but in Heller the court ruled it refers to individual right.
Though I agree with the minority in the court and you as well.
Joseph
Put another way. The constitution doesnt say who we have to vote for. I’m sure Scalia (and probably yourself as well) would agree the State cant pass a law saying we all have to vote for candidate X. Although the constitution doesn’t explicitly say otherwise, it is obvious that it is not “voting” if you are forced to choose someone specific. ditto for the electors if a state forces them to vote for a candidate it is hard to see how that can be called voting
akuperma
“nd no in the US argues that the right to bear arms refers to anything larger than hand held personal weapons “
I beleive Reb yi’ds question is why not?
Here is the text:
“A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
I think what rebyid means is that, if the right to bear arms is as absolute as many claim, why is it limited to guns? IT doesnt say guns. I have a right to own swords, grenades, anti aircraft weapons and nuclear weapons all of which are “Arms” (and bazookas, and grenades are both carried so even with your limited definition of “arms” I should ahve a right to those) Especially when you consider that many argue the reason for the individual right is to protect agaisnt a tyranical government ( i.e for the “security of a FREE state”) Well, we cant due that with just guns .
Because most people dont want other weapons.
People selectively read what they want into the constitution.
So if you want guns but dont want them regulated you skip the part that says “well regulated”
but I have always wondered exactly as you have, If the NRA was being consistent why dont I have a right to own nuclear weapons? They are “arms” after all
joseph
I grant you that Scalia was not super consistent in his aplication of his principle (bush V Gore comes to mind) wouldnt what uopu suggest get rid of half the purpose of electors. The constituion goes into detai labout how the electoras vote both in the original and then in the 12th amendment. If states can decide as they see fit and limit the electors, none of that is neccesary. Say the poular vote in NY goes to Hillary so hillary gets 33 “points” why the need for electors to meet at vote if their vote can be controlled by state
Joseph
And there I was thinking you were a chasid of Scalia’s. He would be ashamed at you interpreting the constitution’s intent. The constitution simply does not say what you are saying.
Agin though this has never been determined in court.
Thanks Joseph
I couldnt find anything about NC but apparently in MI and MN that is the case.
Interestingly in Ray v Blair the court wrote regarding states requiring a PLEDGE from electors as to whom they would vote for
(from wikipedia)
It would seem that under the constitution electors can vote for whomever they want as akuperma says. In spite of the states that have laws against it. Though is has never been challenged in court
My guess is Trump and supporters will suddenly abandon their love of the Electoral college and demand that the will of the people be upheld (though not the majority obviously only the will of the majority in swing states)
joseph
“At least some states have a law that they can replace an unfaithful elector immediately if he doesn’t vote as he pledged, with another elector who will”
Is that true? Would you mind citing a source? I was under the impression that (some) states had laws requiring electors to vote for their pledged candidate, but their was nothing they can do to stop them. And even those regarding those laws (which are mostly small fines) it is unclear how constitutional they are
ED
Whoa hold up I believe you made up soem halachos there:
“the TORAH says wife is not allowed to even ask for a get. “
whereon Earth does the Torah put prohibitions on what the wife can ask for?
“And husband is not allowed to give a get if there are children involved.”
Where did you get that from?
LU
“we decide what the Torah says based on what the Rabbis tell us. If all the Rabbanim he went to were to tell him to give his wife a get,”
that isnt quite true. If ED has a source for his strange din, then Rabbis cant decide against the Shu”A. That being said I doubt there is a such a source. And if the Rabbonim involved view (and even the OP himself suspects) the marrige is un-salvageable, then I am not sure why this discussion has more than one view
Lenny
you asked
“Daas, why am i being cruel for not voluntarily & eagerly writing a Get? Can’t I just as easily ask why it’s not cruel for the wife to ask for a Get when there’s no compelling reason for one?”
you asked a similar question earlier.
Who said it isnt crule for your wife to aks for a get?
She isnt the one asking. You are.
And refusing a Get when their is no hope of the marriage continuing (for whatver reason) as you indicate in your OP is cruel.
“The same way you’re saying I’m a bad guy for wanting to keep the marriage intact; can’t it be said about her for wanting to divorce? Thanks.”
Of course its possible! but she isnt asking us.
and dont kid yourself. IF she gets a civil divorce. Not granting a get doesnt “keep the marriage intact”
“cast memmbers and I guess casting director are making one.”
Exactly.
Im not familiar with the musical so I cant speak first hand regarding the specifics of the content. Im not sure why you limit the casting to the casting director. IT isnt exactly an old musical. It was created specificly with a diverse cast in mind as far as I understand. ITs not like their is a shortage of white actors to play thse white historical characters
As for the content all the reviews IVe read interpret it as political statments of sorts. But I cant speak from first hand knowledge
“they were specifically were looking for non-whites, which is discriminatory”
you really dont think looking “specifically” for non-whites to play George Washington, Aaron Burr And of course Hamilton is a political statement?
” use the stage as a platform for a political statement,”
The entire show is a political statement.
BTW, Winnie just to answer some of your questions (though I dont expect to convince you or anybody)
“improved the view of US abroad- really? where?”
France, Germany, ITaly,Poland, Spain, UK, Turkey, ISrael (!!), Australia, China, Indonesia, Japan, South Korea, Argentina, Chile, MExico, PEru among others
Interestingly not Russia (46% favoribilty in 2008 -> 15% in 2015)
From PEw research center. Now you can quibble as to whether this is an acomplishment , who cares what the world thinks of us, but the data is pretty clear that the world has a more favorable view of the U.S. than it did in 2008.
“delayed Iran getting a nuclear weapon. now they have become legitimate and will for sure get one within the decade,”
Seems like a win. Netanyahui has repeatedly said they were “months away” from nuclear weapons. IT is now more than “months” since then and no nuclear weapons. Seems like a success to me (not saying ti is perfect)
“health care reform- some people are better off, most are worse off. “
I have never heard anybody say “most are worse off” Granted it isnt perfect. And nobody claims it brought the “country to bankruptcy”
“stock market is up- hasn’t it been going up since the 1980s, with exception of a few dips here and there? In the 1990s in jumped from 5000 to 15000.”
Yep Bill Clinton was a good president too, but this isnt about him. As Donald Trump said in 2004 ” The economy does better under the Democrats” (Luckily he has been a democrat for most of his life, so I am keeping my fingers crossed)
“boosted us auto industry- you mean bailed them out at huge tax-payer expense.”
Yes
Winnie of course people would argue with a lot on the list.
Im sure some would argue with all on the list.
We have a country of over 3oo million people. I doubt you can point to any accomplishment by any president and have all of them view it as positive.
Georgie in case you are really interested (I know the OP he isnt really interested) here are but a few in no particular order:
Health care reform
Wall street reform
unemployment cut in half
deficit cut by three quarters
Boosted US auto industry
stock market is up
doubled clean energy production
Killed bin Laden
signed largest aide package to ISrael
Iron Dome
Got rid of Bush’s torture policies
improved the view of US abroad
Delayed IRan getting a nuclear weapon
Further reduction in US and Russia’s nuclear arsenals
Expanded stem cell research
“You’re right. Every time an administration, republican or democrat, passed regulation on healthcare our policies were negatively affected.”
Im not sure who “our” refers to in that sentence.
“I know of at least 5 good doctors in different fields that stopped practicing, stopped taking insurance or closed their practice to new patients because of the obamacare environment.”
I know dozens (literally) who have been saying that for decades. Their have been a couple shifts that led to this. Obamcare is but minor component.
Big deal
your first paragraph is in fact quite simple, I believe I said it in my first post on the subject.
“put a significant strain on healthcare as we knew it.”
Lol. Healthcare has been strained for years, thats why Obamacare came in.
“Why hasn’t that young man had continuous coverage? Everyone should be covered even the young and healthy”
hurray! you seem to accept one of the tennets of Obamcare. As to why our young friend didnt have continuos coverage, yo have to ask him are are some possibilities:
– He thought he was invincible and figured all I get is a well visit once a year
– He just turned 21 and didint realize he was no longer on his parents plan (pre Obama zul zein gezunt in shtark extended it to 26 when people are more mature. Luckily this is another aspect Trump “Likes very much”)
– He just turned 21 and couldnt afford it (pre Obama zul zein gezunt in shtark extended it to 26 when people might have larger income. Luckily this is another aspect Trump “Likes very much”)
“Do you believe that health insurance should be unaffordable for the majority of Americans because some immigrants might not be able to obtain coverage?”
no. Nobody says Obamacare made it unaffordable for majority of Americans. Again, as pointed out earlier 90% of Americans premiums werent affected by Obamcare. As for the 10% that have been, I have to wonder how many are actually in the unaffordable range?
bigdeal
“Point is that companies will find a reason to drop coverage or not pay a claim.”
That may be true but it is a brand new point that is only tangentialy related to the problem of denying those with preexisting conditions. Which under Obamacare can no longer occur. If it is as big a problem as you suggest, then I am all for solving it. however using that as an argument not to fix another problem, really doesnt make sense
“I don’t have time to elaborate now. Maybe later.”
No problem. all the best. I’l probably be here if you think of specific questions
“Point about cobra was to provide interim health insurance for people that are between jobs.”
I got that, and I replied with examples of people with pre-existing conditions who were not between jobs, thus Cobra wouldnt help them. And even those in between jobs, Cobra is expensive and not always affordable.
“He is well aware of most of his voting base desires”
Assuming that is true, do you think he cares?
Besides, doesnt that make it worse, IF he knows and disregards them?
Here are some of the things he (per members of his inside circle) has already walked back on:
– Obamacare wont be repealed
– MExico wont pay for the wall (which maybe a fence in some places)
– Not all illegal aliens are being deported
– The embassy isnt being moved to Yerushalyim
– He isnt getting rid of the Iran deal
dont worry there is more to follow.
Thats the one reassuring thing about Trump. He changes his mind so often nobody knows what he really thinks or how he will govern. hopefully his admiration for Putin and desire for torture was part of his shtick as well. ( though if that is the case, it remains concerning that that is the pandering he needed to perform to get elected)
“Suddenly doctor’s and hospital fees plus interest are covered.”
phew! sounds like it worked out. Look if you are advocating for a law that insurance companies need to pay sooner, Ok I might be able to get on board, though I dont think that problem is a pressing one
“I’m sure you are aware of similar scenarios happening all the time.”
I dotn really see the problem, so they drag theri feet sometimes. nu nu
“More regulation won’t help.”
Ok, i’ll bite. what will?
“Did you miss my post about cobra?”
I may have. though, I hope your realize that your argument that Obamacare is too expensive, just fall back on Cobra doesnt make sense right? Though it makes more sense than suggesting the guy who lost his job and now spends 64 days looking for a new job, with no income in the interim to sign up for COBRA
Besides there are other scenarios that I havent mentioned that Cobra isnt relevant. Immigrants, A Young person who assumed he would be healthy and suddenly gets into an accident, gets cancer and tries to sign up for insurance. Guess what he now has as he is signing up for his first insurance policy?
I am not suggesting Obamacare is perfect. My question for you is do you think insurance companies should be allowed to not cover based on preexisting conditions? (not you Health, youve made your viewon the subject pretty clear)
Or put another way do yo uview healthcare as a privelege or neccesit as ZD put it so well?
DY
“Donna Brazile.”
What you mean at a debate in FLInt the Candidates would be asked about Flint!? Yes that swung the election in hillary’s favor. OF course it shoudlnt have happened but My Kids are too young to have picked up on that one minor example of cheating which falls away compared to Trump’s Bully-persona which defines him to a certain extent
If you somehow think voting for a candidate is approving of their morals or tactics, we could rarely if ever vote.”
I dont and I never said his bullying is a reason not to vote for him.
I gave 6 OTHER reasons in this post
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/heartbroken-over-hillary#post-633537
Bullying is an answer to a seperate question, about children. I f I thought he was a better candidate and the 6 reasons outlined above werent factual I would vote for Trump the Bully, and deal with my kids.
This quote “We don’t look at politicians (or sports stars, or entertainers) as role models.” Shopws you arent understanding my question. Their is no question neither Hillary nor Trump are Role models. however even if not Role models, they both are examples of getting ahead in life. Trump did it by bullying. Role model or not, it shows bullying works
Flatbusher
“Trump’s win shows bullies get ahead?”
um yes, without question. OF course that is not why he won.
“Trump may be a bully but I don’t believe people elected him because of that.”
I never siad otherwise.
“And I know the difference between liberal and conservative.”
Ok, So you understand that miniority rights including that of religous workers came about as a result of liberals. Right?
Again you can say now they are taking it to far, and we deserve protection but not those engaged in “immorality” but the advances made with regards to minoritys came about as a result of liberals in the face of conservative resistance
“As for Hillary’s tactics? Lies, lies and more lies about anything and everything that would ingratiate her to the electorate.”
couldn’t agree more, and with the possible exception of Donald Trump, she is the biggest liar to have run for office.
Again though, I never said the tactics is a reason not to vote for him per se. I gave you six reasons, this wasn’t one of them. The issue of bullying was a separate issue in response to Winnie the Pooh.
Winnie
“I think the take-home message is … you can see the Yad Hashem orchestrating it. “
thats what I went with.
It is time for truth
Im confused, you know he is a lifelong Liberal, at least regarding “social issues” please please tell me you arent shocked now
( I’m sure he found the Shabbos case by now!- Nope 🙂
yehudoyna
the law was written after Kennedy (Possibly becasue of, though that was denied at the time)
see
” b) A public official may not appoint, employ, promote, advance, or advocate for appointment, employment, promotion, or advancement, in or to a civilian position in the agency in which he is serving or over which he exercises jurisdiction or control any individual who is a relative of the public official. …”
“You don’t need Obamacare to fix that, you just need to keep the insurance companies in check.”
Oh absolutely. OF course it becomes he said, she said because its not like the insurance company says oh we are cheating.
“In other words, only if there was continuous coverage. Nobody disputed that.”
I am disputing that (as is Health care law in place since 1997). Individual insurance can drop you if you had preexisting conditions. Say you were an empolyee with group insurance and diabetes/HTN etc you try to open your ow business and would like to buy individual insurance. No amount of continuous coverage protected you. For GROUP insurance policies, thats when if you had continuous coverage you couldnt be rejected for preexisting conditions. But even then continuous meant no less than 63 days. Which left too many out in the cold.
“They still find reasons to drop them or not to pay a claim. “
Can you elaborate? how do they do that?
bigdeal
Yes, but what was hapening was often when people became sick insurance companies found reasons to drop them.
furthermore what you state isnt quite true. Individual plans were always alowed to exclude preexisting conditions. and even group plans were only not allowed to restrict those peopl if they hadnt gone 63 days wihtout coverage. But if they had gone 63 days without coverage say, after switching employers, (perhaps waiting for new benefits to kick in, or if they spent time looking for new work) then the new group policy could exclude them for any “preexisting condition”
This was the law as in place since HIPPA 1997
DY
“Would you prefer a president who won by cheating?”
im not sure if that was adressed to me. nor am I aware of any cheating that took place
There are two different discussions taking place
1) Flatbushers question:”based on what did you vote for Hillary?”
2) Winnie the Pooh’s question
“It is interesting that the line of how do you explain to children how Trump could be president has come up over and over. Is this the first time an immoral/indecent person has become president?”
The fact that he is a bully is my answer to #2 not #1
so when you ask if I prefer a question who won by cheating, if adressing #2, a. Would my kids know s/he cheated? If so I guess it depends on the extent of the cheating an d bullying
Flattbusher
You need to look up the definitions of liberal vs conservative.
Regarding hillary I’m not sure what tactic you refer to. My point is the public persona trump gives us is that of a bully. Hillary is without question a sleazy politician but that was something that she tried to suppress.
By winning trump showEd bullies get ahead. I’m not sure why this is a controversial position
Health
“As far as I know, that preexisting condition is not a disease!”
I’m not sure what you mean, acne is a disease.
“IDK if anyone was actually thrown off because of it.”
I do
“And if you prove that they were,”
I can’t prove it, this isn’t exactly a publicly available supreme Court case.
” then that should be an exclusion in the law!”
What law? Preobamacare insurance could be denied for a “preexisting condition” thanks to Obama Zul seine gezunt in shtark’s, this is no longer a thing. What exclusion to what law are you proposing?
“The law should be that you can keep your old policy, even with changing jobs!”
What? And who pays the old employer or the new one? I don’t think you know how insurance is (generally) structured in this country
flatbusher
” I don’t know where you got that from.”
history.
Party ideologies have switched multiple times. It was the Democrats who opposed the civil rights act in the 60’s. These where southern Democrats they all vote Republican today. The history of Party politics is long and mutifactorial. the easiest way to see it is to Have a look at the electoral map in the years leading up to Civil rights: 1952, 56, 60 and compare to post civil rights 64, 68. PAy particular attention to the South and watch the color change that remains to today
Crime is down, life expectancy is up, the way we treat minorities is better, the way we treat mentally ill and handicapped is better, reluctance to go to war, when we do go to war way civilans are treated si better and on and on.
Are we perfect? Far from it. And there are certainly many ways in which morality has deteriorated, some of which you have identified.
winnie the pooh
“that lying is a means that justifies the end.”
I dont and thats yet another reaosn why I opposed Trump. (though I oppose Hillary for the same reason, since although she lies less than Trump, it is too much for my taste
“Trump didn’t win because he bullied people into voting for him”
true but if people vote for the guy who came up with “Lyin Ted” “Crooked hillary” “Little Marco” clearly bullying is OK
“In any case, sadly, being president doesn’t mean you are automatically a role model, and every frum kid should be told that our morality and code of behavior is based on the Torah, and not on who is sitting in the White House.”
Oh that is certainly true. I remember as a kid one of my Rebein would say that children’s siddurim and coloring books had it wrong “shelo asani goy” doesnt refer to, as ilustarted in those pictures a drunk homeless etc goy. IT refers to the most prestigious Goy namely the President
but this isnt about being a role model. Of course Bill Clinton was a terrible Role model to say the least, as others have pointed out. Trump, aside from being an equally terrible (ok maybe worse maybe better, lets leave that aside) role model. It is the tactic he used to get ahead, that his supporters have shown works.
The message a sinificant number of people gave on Tuesday (moslty inadvertently, though some because of it, make no mistake) Is: Bully people, mock people, thorugh basic decency to the wind and you too can get ahead in life.
Health
“I agree that if you already have insurance, you should not be able to be thrown off!”
OK what about the person who develops cancer while on an insurance plan then the insurance company drops them from the policy becasue he hasa history of bunions/acne etc prior to joining the policy and they now realize he had a pre-existing condition and shouldnt have been approved?
pre Obamacare this was not an unheard of occurrence
“There’s nothing wrong with having Medicaid!”
Agreed. Though you said They should “go broke” It seems your plan is for those faced with a devastating illness to go broke. Im worried that I didint misunderstand ou. Please tell me that I have.
Furthermore, if a person switches employers he may very well be switching insuracne carriers and even if a condition was not “preexisting” when he started it now is. In the old days he too could have been denied.
note: Even trump doesnt agree with you on this and has said he plans to keep that part of ObamaCare.
“and kept stating how their predictions have been correct each & every single election since they have bee doing this since 1984,”
Lolololol
They may have been right this time. but Savage, Hannity and Limbaugh have all predicted Republican wins in 2012 and 2008
Even Trump didnt predict his victory. do you not recall his talk about the election being rigged?
“so relax.”
dont worry, Im relaxed
“I don’t think Trump’s rants are any worse than some of the things both Obama and Hillary have said, “
I’m curious what has Obama or Hillary said that is worse than say condoning torturing families
“But under Dems, society has been sinking in morality and maybe this will slow it.”
In some ways, but as I have explained there are other ways morality has increased under dems. For example minority rights including our rights. If you are able to take off Shabbos without fear of being fired that is thanks to liberals. Granted you may not like all liberal positions, I dont either. But to lump together all “sinking in morality” as occuring under dems isnt quite accurate
“There’s no way it would change overnight from always legal to illegal even when threatening the mother’s life.”
a. I think we should hold off on “no way…” predictions for a while
b. It doesnt have to happen overnight
c. Who do you want to define “even when threatening the mother’s life.” A (super-competent ORthodox) Rav, or anybody else
flatbusher
“but if the government works the way it is supposed to with checks and balances,”
It doesnt as you yourself point out regarding executive orders. Given that Trump has announced his admiration for Saddam I doubt he is opposed to misusing Executive actions.
The one silver lining is that more than likely, it was mostly talk. His circle has already started walking back some of his promises including: dismantling Obamacare, getting rid of IRan deal, moving the embassy and MExico paying for the all to cite a few. (Im not saying Im happy with all thse walk-backs)
However what remains worrisome, is how low has the country fallen that this is the act he needed to pull to get elected. Saying well of course he didn’t actually mean to support torturing children of terrorists, he was just trying to fire u the masses and win support. Is hardly reassuring
“She represented more of Obama: did you want more of that?”
What is the “that” in your sentence
If by that you mean not (openly) condoning torture. Yes please, much more.
IF by that you mean not downplaying chemical weapons, Yes please, much more.
If by that you mean not being impulsive, and rather thinking through the consequences of decisions, Yes please much more
and so on
Health
“And why should Cancer be different?”
It shouldnt, that was my point. I dont believe people who get sick should be bankrupted and go on medicaid. You do. I dont see how you can claim to be a rachaman or gomel chesed and beleive that on top of being sick all thse people should be poor too.
and your right it isnt just cancer the bills from any unexpected medical emergency would be enough to bankrupt most familes, even relatively comfortable ones. That you would condemn all these people to bankruptcy and medicaid is appalling.
Don’t complain about the insult. Please tell me how you square your position with being a “rachaman” or “Gomel chesed” perhaps IVe misunderstood (I sincerely hope so) i would love to apologize for what I hope was a horrible misstatement on your part or misunderstanding on mine
Zahavasdad
Then you cant get rid of forcing everyone to buy health insurance either as explained above
“Why should e/o else pay because you got AIDS?!?”
Uch you are the most offensive poster on this forum.
So if a person gets a life altering illness like Cancer your response is “Let them become broke and then they will get Medicaid!”
and you claim to be a Ben Avraham of which the Gemara says we are “Rachmanim, Bayshanim, and Gomlei chasadim” I think your one post above single handedly proved you lack all three of those qualities
Health
“My point was – I probably posted it – but it was deleted!”
sorry I cant reply to deleted posts ;-).
At any rate yoou asked for proof, and i deleivered (Free of charge)
“The point I was making to him was that after an election coming to post against the President -elect, your post can only be why he isn’t eligible to be President!
If there is any other reason, then you don’t believe in democracy!””
Take it Easy. I know Trump has openly said he hopes to limit the 1st amendment. However he isnt president yet, Huju can still say whatever he wants
dbrim
“Let’s imagine that some of the liberal doublespeak “allegations” (i.e., name-calling) applied to Clinton, as well. For example…”
no need to imagine. both I and Huju said those allegations (Im not sure wy they are in quotes when I backed them up with facts) do in fact apply to Clinton as well
Flatbusher
“I do question though based on what did you vote for Hillary?”
that wasnt addresed to me but as a frum person, I’ll reply. Most of the following are sufficent reason to vote for her in my book.
1) He condoned war crimes
2) He downplayed use of chemical weapons
3) He is an impulsive person, not able or willing to think through the consequences of his actions
4) He doesnt have an elementary understanding of how government works
5) He admires leaders like Saddam and Putin
6) He partly built a campaign on racism and fear of the other
note: Not included in the list are the facts that he is “fake, phony and fraud” Since I readily grant that hillary is all those things as well.
Winnie the Pooh
I dont understand the question
I dont really teach my children not be corrupt politicians. Politicians are corrupt that isnt surprisng, granted the Clintons took it to a new level. However Trump has had many shady buisness dealings, he was not a politician so we dont make as big a deal for some reason.
I do teach my kids not to bully, dont call other people names, dont mock people with disablities. These are harder to deliver to my kids now becasue they see bullying does get you to the top
“Ubiquitin, have you (and the patient) ever benefitted from these “unnecessary” tests?”
Generally no.
The only exception is
I have gained by saving time in explaining why test wasnt indicated at a certain point it is easier to just to order it. As for the patient the only thing they may have gained is piece of mind. But most of those cases the patient doesnt even know if the test was being considered and if it is neccesary it just gets ordered pt gets wheeled of for CT scan without being told in that case Data shows ultrasound is just as effective but safer as no radiation and no contrast.
Health
In sorry, I dont follow
Huju said “”And just to be clear, I think he is a fake, phony fraud, and ignorant beyond belief”
You replied with “Any proof?”
I provided proof
Nowhere did Huju say (nor did you indicate that he said ) that Trump isnt eligible to be President. If people want to elect a “fake phony fraud and ignorant beyond belief” candidate president that is their right. In fact I too voted for a fake phony fraud candidate as president though one that I believe is less of those things than the candidate who won.
“Just by allowing insurance to be purchased across state lines will drop the cost of insurance. COMPETITION IS GOOD”
completly agree!
Though what I think is more critical is some form of Tort reform. The sheer number of tests ordered ” just in case” is playing a large part in crippling the system. I see it first hand. I am personally guilty of ordering hundreds of medically unnecessary tests ( that occasional y have lead to harm) all to both placate patients (customers?) and to “protect myself”
“Any proof?”
Lots and lots, and its concerning that you still dont know it. I understand those who in spite of Trump’s being “fake, phony fraud, and ignorant beyond belief” still view him as better than Hillary, I disagree wholeheartedly but I do understand. What I dont get are the people who still dont get it
Here is proof. I want to keep it short so I will post one example for each.
FAKE – Nobody knows his actual worth, all estimates indicate he is worth a lot less than he says he is
FRAUD – Trump University
IGNORANT BEYOND BELIEF – Here is but one example he said regarding Khzir Khan “has no right to stand in front of millions of people and claim I have never read the Constitution” IT is worrying that he will swear to uphold the constitution yet he never made it as far as the first amendment.
Im sure you wont like all of these example, yet they are all factual. And there are others.
Again yo ucan say that although he is a fraud, phony so is she and he is less of a fraud. But just know who you elected
DY
Is there anything that would be beyond the pale?
Whoa Mamale
I was way off, thanks for the correction. However while misstated, my point is till true since the 90% getting through their employer and public health insurance arent the ones whose premiums have been going up.
kfb
“how you voted for someone who has a picture with Arafat’s wife …”
I can use the same absolutely absurd excuse you gave for Trump
“I’m sure if she knew she’d be running for president 20 years ago, she wouldn’t have done those things”.
Seriously your answer is what confuses me about Trump supporters, you think it was one comment “20 years ago” wrong. IT is who he is throughout the campaign he continued to insult women, minorities, handicapped. IF you like DY believe that what ” should be foremost on our minds when choosing a politician is who will do a better job, furthering our interests.” Fine I get that you acknowledge his very serious flaws but believe his he will do a better job. I dotn think so, but now that he is elected, I sincerely hope I am wrong about that. But to dismiss his flaws as 20 years ago Trump, is simply denying reality and is what astounds me.
DY
You said
“The question which should be foremost on our minds when choosing a politician is who will do a better job, furthering our interests.”
Is there anything else that in your mind would disqualify him even if he would do a better job?
Say if he was caught making anti-semitic comments? If the allegations raised by the women were confirmed? If he admitted to the allegations? If he (as he put it) shot someone in Time square?
I mean this is a guy who admires Putin and Saddam Hussein, condones torture, downplayyed the iuse of chmeical weapons. IS there anything he could say/do to make you beleive that although he might “do a better job” you simply cannot vote for him
“obama did this so his name should always be remembered forever in the USA. the first thing trump should do immediately is at least change the name of obamacare so the worst USA president can be erased & forgotten ASAP.”
Lol! best comment ever.
OBamacare was coined by Republicans todenigrate Obamacare. I dont think Obama ever used the term (though it is possible he may have recently come to embrae it)
Unless you were kidding and I didnt get it
“SO TELL ME, WHAT’S GOOD ABOUT OBAMACARE.”
Im sorry that you are having a problem. however the vast majority of the country arent small buisness owners. I beleive 90% or so get insuracne through their employers. These people have been largely unaffected and have been able to keep their doctor.