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CBT?
I’m not sure we should be defining “achdus” according to Webster.
Comparing fans celebrating the Yankees winning to klal Yisroel davening for someone? Sorry, he lost me there.
I do agree that davening for those boys together didn’t suddenly solve our achdus issues, but I think he misses an important point, from which maybe we can build toward more achdus.
Klal Yisroel inherently is one – ????? ???????? ?????? ???? ??? ?? ???. Our unity in tefillah should be a reminder of this fact, that despite our differences, we are still on the same “team”.
His implied suggestion that all or at least some of us should concede our deeply held beliefs for the sake of achdus is not something I think is reasonable or correct.
What we can and should do the next time we encounter someone with whom we may disagree, even passionately, is realize that despite those differences, we would still stop to change a flat tire, and still offer heartfelt tefillos in an eis tzara, lo aleinu. Because despite different approaches, we are one, and despite disagreement, we love each other.
I’m certainly the only one on the CR who has ever conceded something.
Well, considering how often you’re wrong, that would make sense.
Here is where popa conceded the utility of CBT:
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/cbt/page/2#post-506762
Reading through this thread gave me “happy thoughts”, so I was able to skip today’s session.
It’s been a good day. Earlier, I called GEICO and saved 15% on my auto insurance.
Yes, and I think he is probably exaggerating the extent of any such license.
Maybe we should open a new thread??!!!
Cold Beer Therapy is even more effective.
I can’t comment on the C”S or Mahara”m Shick, which I haven’t seen inside, but some of the sources predate reform, plus those who follow their tradition have the right to take the sources literally.
I think if a clueless mother or father offers payment far exceeding the prevalent rate, the babysitter should tell them.
Are you calling the S’dei Chemed or his sources dishonest?
I hope this is not what Sam meant.
Agav, that context definitely exists today.
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/banning-bris-milah-in-the-united-states
We daven today from siddurim while they used to daven baal peh. So is it now okay to cut Shemonah Esrei to 15 brachos?
DaMoshe, I don’t know if that’s true or not, but how is that relevant to MBP, specifically its function in the realm of halacha and kabbalah, as opposed to only refuah?
(the context of the pro-MBP teshuvos)
In what way is the mareh makom I brought not relevant to MBP today? There are (at least) two arguments pro MBP; one is that it gets the ?? ??????? ???????. This is indeed irrelevant and out of context if another method is equally effective.
But the sources which say that metzitzah b’peh (davka) is part of the mitzvah, either for halachic or kabbalistic reasons are wholly relevant.
The arrogance and condescension of those who think that certain groups in klal Yisroel are either incapable of determining the level and balance of risk/reward or don’t care about their children is astounding and horrifying.
Waiting for popa to say CBT is naarishkeit…
Kind of welcome. 🙂
I don’t think that’s what I said.
Why do the numbers affect who is asked first?
I had assumed as Lior did, and that the numbers exacerbate the issue, because the boy is more likely to say no.
Why can’t they both be issues?
It’s not the issue I was addressing, and the “viciously pro MBP” side is defending its rights, not trampling on others’.
The lives of Jews trump even mitzvot from the Torah. MBP is not one of the three for which we give up our lives.
Ah, a halachic statement. So can we agree to leave the issue to halachic decisors?
I can assure you that the pro MBP side is aware of the fact that milah is not from the gimmel chamuros, and hold that MBP does not halachically constitute pikuach nefesh.
It violates the clear language in every Ashkenazic Ketubah
It is based on mechilah. If I lend you money with a shtar, and then forgive the loan, are either of or both of us violating that shtar?
The trade off Lior speaks of is not halachic, it’s the benefit of the talmud Torah vs. the cost in chinuch and in some cases tzniyus (which is often a trade off for men as well in their workplaces).
29, do you mean when a post is approved right after it’s posted?
Shopping, no thanks for debunking my claim of ruach hakodesh. 🙂
No, Sam, to me the issue is the vicious anti MBP movement, which seeks to stop people from practicing milah in a manner their ancestors have done for generations, and which they believe, with backing from numerous legitimate sources, to have religious significance, whether it be al pi nigleh or nistar.
I’m not arguing that everyone should follow the sources I quoted; the other opinion is also valid.
PAA, I didn’t think so, and I responded as I did because my intention of quoting the S’dei Chemed was as I just explained.
Agav, on the next page from the one I linked, he brings what seems to be a nice raya from the Gemara that MBP is not just medicinal (although I haven’t been m’ayen in it).
Thanks. PAA had explained that, I had responded appropriately based on that, and I’m pretty sure I knew that the Maharshal’s last name was Luria. I have no idea why I said I wasn’t familiar with it, other than not having heard if it prior.
Right, and the opinion of those quoted by the S’dei Chemed argues on Rav Kook and the Binyan Tzion and Rav Moshe.
Popa can go out and eat herring while DaMoshe sings. He can pretend there’s a YCT guy saying a drasha.
http://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=14156&st=&pgnum=250
Key phrase: ???? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ??? ????
????? ????? ??? ????? ???? ??????? ??? ???
?????? ?????? ??? ???) ???? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?????)
?????? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ???? ?????
??? ??????? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ????? ?? ???? ???
????? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ??????
?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ????? ?? ?? ??? ??????? ??? ???
???????? ?????? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ??
??? ???? ???? ?? ?????
I’m not sure you know which one I’m referring to, which has been used by a couple of baalei tefillah I’ve heard.
Right, and the other opinion argues with the Chasam Sofer.
Some sing it to Menuchah V’simchah.
Google “ropshitz waltz”. There’s a sample on Mostly Music from Time to Dance Vol. 1.
I believe that the MBP advocates hold it’s not just medicinal.
Ropshitzer waltz.
Find out where DaMoshe is davening, and then let us know how it was.
OMG popa, that was you??!!
Here’s my post; a discussion about ping pong on Shabbos veered off into bicycles (and then how to treat the words of Chazak with the proper respect).
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/ping-pong-on-shabbos#post-496452
Actually, the accepted halacha is that using a bicycle is prohibited on Shabbos. The reason is a bit unclear; one source I found (I think I posted it here once) says it’s because one might come to fix it.
Despite being in favor of domestic seminary as the default (meaning that I acknowledge that EY is better for some, but think the majority should stay), I will mention some advantages I’ve heard given to sem in EY.
Independence.
Experiencing how people live in EY. Seeing people living an austere lifestyle yet being happy serving Hashem makes an impact.
More choices. This is circular, but is nevertheless the current reality.
The hashkafos are better absorbed in a totally new environment, and specifically in EY where the haskafos are more intense and more passionately held.
Better Fro-Yo.
Particularly *what facts and points* from your observation and discussion have led you to believe in this as a default “assumption” as opposed to waiting for a case by case evaluation rather than making an “assumption”?
Kids do best with both parents, but in the unfortunate situations where that’s not possible, they do better with the mother than with the father.
This wasn’t really my point, though, because I can definitely envision (and have seen) cases where they’re better off with the father. My point was the same as fny’s, that there’s practically no such thing as a tie.
I’d also be interested in hearing your guess as to what changed from previous generations.
You’ll have to use your imagination. Last time I hazarded a guess, you treated it as if I claimed it was Torah miSinai.
What the source is probably depends on one’s definition of the term.
Can’t listings be suspended temporarily?
Maharatotai nevareches
Lol, that has a nice ring to it.
(I’m getting a helmet for when writersoul gets back)
It gives girls the much needed break from their dysfunctional homes.
Observation and discussion.
There are times the father is more capable, it’s just not the majority.
“We” is referring to Torah society.
I do share that assumption.
I could guess what changed, but it’s not relevant.
It so happens that in our generation, we do assume that a child is better off in the mother’s care, but that wasn’t why I agreed with fny. I just think it’s unlikely that the situation is equal, and rather than decide it by flipping a coin, we’ll decide according to who was at greater fault in the divorce.
El Hanaar is indeed a nice song. The album as a whole is terrific. There’s a gap between tracks 19-23, but other than that, it’s great.
i still can’t believe seminaries lock girls in
Which is worse, that, or when they lock them out?
I know a girl who did sherut leumi by working in a seminary. I guess we could both agree that is bad?
I had missed this. Yes, I suppose.
The chilluk I am making, to be clear, is that the normal setup in seminary is supposed to be where the vast majority of interaction is among females, and interaction with males is pretty much limited to the very controlled environment of the classroom. Any more personal interaction should be an aberration, and unacceptable.
An office setup is much worse. Even an ordinary, non sheirut leumi mixed work environmenti is risky, and when combined with compulsion, according to my understanding, it becomes assur.
Lior, in theory, yes, but AFAIK, it doesn’t happen.
Rav Shimon Eider zt”l wrote one.
I’m against c-sections. If a kid is mature enough to be born, he is mature enough to do it on his own.
Sam, there could be haskafic problems when someone’s opinions diverge from reality.