rightwriter

Theres a difference between a broken pitom and one that fell off while still on the tree.

@common, you do that in someone’s house public doesn’t really need any courtesy. And again, not a minhag.

yaakov doe-“For those who want to know I suggest you read A Lost Art Handmade Silver Kiddush Cups of Eastern Europe by Jonathan Greenstein which you can buy on Amazon”

-And for those who dont want to buy it, any shorthand insights?

Avirah “Right, you weren’t asking who we pasken like. You were asking who was historically correct, and by extension, who was right and wrong. Beis shamai were “right”, and we will indeed pasken like them when moshiach comes, according to the arizal. Beis hill were also right, and we pasken like them now.”

-Correct but was focusing more on minhagim not on Halacha. Obviously many times they are interconnected but they are still 2 separate entities. I mean isnt wearing a Yarmulka just a minhag as well? So im more wondering to see peoples reasons and origins for the way they do things.

“Sephardi Torahs seem to be easier to handle and store upright”

-Well they are easier to store upright because they were made in a way to read upright. It wasnt just made this way to be convenient to store and therefore they decided to read it upright since Ashkenaz style reading would be pretty inconvenient with a Sephardi Torah. From what I understand Sephardi minhag is also to put up Mezuza Vertically and not tilted like the Ashkenaz way. Werent there opinions of putting up Mezuza horizontally before Rashi?

Syag I think you made your point already, that you are childish and needy for attention. Nobody asked you to join this thread. If you realized im trying to only reply and be in discussion with those who are staying on topic but you are relentlessly asking for attention.

Having said that , yes I think it is much more positive to understand beatiful minhagim of our people and its inspiring once you understand the meaning behind what our own people do from across the spectrum. You can keep being a wise-crack but dont be surprised if you will be ignored. Thanks for understanding 😉

commone saychel-” what is the minhag of eating pizza on Motza? or a half baked slice on Motza Peasch?
What is the minhag of having a sushi platter at a vort?
And you never answered the Kokosh cake minhag,”

Those arent minhagim moron.

Avirah “This list is full of arrogance. It’s not our place to decide which half of klal yisroel, which half of rishonim are “right” and which are “wrong”.”

-so I take it you follow Beis Shamay for menora lighting in order to stay in your place? I mean why be arrogant and follow a different opinion?

Wasn’t there one way of doing things before the churban? Just asking.

I heard the kiddush cup with stem is a more recent American minhag. Is there any source to that? That is if anyone actually wants to talk about this topic or just write random things which make you feel so smart and brave. Those who don’t want to participate in this discussion are welcome to leave and not comment. I’m only looking for productive comments that can contribute information not for your silly 5 year old jokes.

Yes, Moderator 29, a lot more neutral and positive than the sinas chinam topics you guys approve or post on the site. My topic, contrary to your taste is actually productive and thought provoking to find out the roots and sources for our Jewish customs. Should I have thrown some hate stirring attacks on others minhagim in order to get approved faster?

Ujm, yes how did you guess? Is that the most you can contribute to the topic? Its ok for you not to know everything so we forgive you in advance to not comment in future cases. : )

“But it’s my shofar, why is there a need to clean it?”

So its your shofar but how did you clean it to make sure its sanitized in the first place? Also even if its your saliva it still builds up bacteria and smell so wouldnt you want to keep it sanitized aside for the dust buildup?

Does cleaning it over and over ruin the shofar over time?

The list where you couldnt prove to us why Hebrew is a made up language.

Avirah Im sure any typical English speaker can definitely understand someone coming to talk to them in Biblical English or Shakespearian. Does that mean its a different language? Its olde English and also very formal high level which is typically not spoken. Hebrew exists and its a bit more modernized than Torah Hebrew naturally but any Hebrew speaker can understand almost everything the Torah says aside for a few difficult words. How would that be possible if Ivrit is a made up language? Yes they invented new slangs and a few different meanings to words but again languages mostly evolve with people and eras. Also what do you want people to do this is their language should they stop speaking it? Hebrew is the language of the Jews. You cant say any other language is. Whether it should be spoken day to day or only for Torah is a different story but its still the language of the Jews. Also Rashi says before the Migdal Bavel all communicated in one language Lashon Hakodesh. So do you even know what Lashon Hakodesh is?

CS”Well I am not a hypocrite, I dont care one way or the other WORLDWIDE”

-Congrats on not being a hypocrite, but the discussion was referring to Israel and not worldwide. Why do you keep kosher when worldwide most do not? What a hypocrite.

CS”the main langague spoken in New Square, Monroe, Vistnitz and Tosh is Yiddish, yes all street signs are in English or [in the case of tosh in French], does it offend me? no, if the signs were in Engish and Yiddish would it offend me? no, Do I it offensive that they call 8th Street in Little Havana in Miami Calle Ocho, no.”

-What about non chassidish places is Yiddish also the main language? I already mentioned Yiddish is prevalent in Chassidish communities thats obvious. Bottom line the Universal Jewish language is Hebrew whether you like it or not.

Common Seychel

“Most Jews arent Israeli and speak primarily the language of the land or Yiddish if they come from Ashkenaz roots.”

-In America

Alwaysask- Nach is not written in simpler more modern Hebrew than Torah?

Ujm how is ivrit a different language? You still didn’t answer why nach and Mishna are written in a much simpler tongue than Torah.

And Israelis speak Hebrew whats your point? Hebrew was revived on Israel but it doesn’t mean it was made up it came from the Hebrew that was around all the generations.

Ujm “Example: “Chashmal”, which means electricity in MH, comes from the Loshon HaKodesh word found at the beginning of Yechizkel which is the name of the Angel of Fire. The idea of taking the name of the Malach of AIsh and using it to mean “electricity” was the implication that whereas in the olden days we believed in angels as explanations for things, today we believe in technology.”

-What do you want them to call electricity then? What was the Torah word for it back when it wasnt invented/used yet? Also how does it imply that we thought angels were explanations for things and now technology is? Where did you get that from?

Also isnt electricity likened to fire thats why its assur on Shabbos in the category of Aish?

Actually Avira it’s “Lashon Hakodesh”. You are giving it a different translation. How does one speak Rambam?

Commonseychel Kurdish is spoken by kurds, Hebrew is spoken by Jews outside of Israel as well and most non Hebrew speaking Jews know Hebrew more than Yiddish. Again what is the language of the Jews if not Hebrew I’m missing your argument here. what language did Jews speak in the times of Ancient Israel? And after they were dispersed they picked up the local languages, what did they speak before inventing Yiddish? Is every Jew speaking Hebrew doing an aveirah?

Answer what is the language of the Jews? I never heard someone speak in Rambam or the ketsos. Do Jews not have a languages? They only speak in foreign tongue? Again even Lashon Hakodesh seems to have evolved for the fact that it became much more “modern” and simpler in the times of Nach and definitely times of Mishna. Of course I don’t side with the bad intentions of early Zionists who wished to further the religion away, but I’m trying to understand why modern ivrit is the devil when it is derived from the language of the Jewish Heritage? Were Jews just meant to speak Aramaic, Yiddish, English or any other foreign language but Hebrew? How do you even know what Lashon Hakodesh is didn’t Rashi write that before the migdal bavel all spoke the same language; lashon hakodesh. That was before the Torah was given. And if the Torah is lashon Hakodesh then why the simpler language style change in Nach onward?
Lehavdil was English invented as a way to destroy old English? Would anyone still talk that way today? Or do languages just become more modern on their own over time as we see with most languages.

ok so you are saying hebrew is not the language of the people its a language of a country. So whats the official language of Jews, Yiddish? Even before it was invented?

What do you mean by the masses? How many countries are Jews the majority in? Israelis speak Hebrew. Americans speak English. Chassidish speak Yiddish. Russians speak Russian. Im not understanding what you are getting at.

Name me on place in the world where Kurdish is spoken by the masses, or Cherokee, or Scottish Gaelic, or Sardinia or Corsican, should I go on? Hebrew is a language of a minority so why would it be globally spoken?

Ok ujm old and newer seforim and letters from tzadikkim are written in ivrit are they not? How could that be if it’s an invented language?

“Lashon kodesh isn’t ivrit, and even if they were the same, leshitas ha, Jews didn’t speak lashon kodesh either, as ujm cited”

So they spoke Aramaic? Ok then why Tzaddikim books and teshuvos on questions all in modern ivrit then?

I mean you can always give scary examples of what words to use or not. Even the English language changed because peoples dialect changes over time. Even the Nach has a simpler lashon than Torah doesnt it?

“The Radak (Sefer HaMichlol, introduction) writes that Loshon HaKodesh is all but forgotten to us, and all we have left is what is in Tanach.”

-If he said its forgotten to us then how did anyone change it to modern hebrew? What does modern hebrew come from if not ancient hebrew since you say its a made up language? Also if its a made up language then whats the problem using it its mundane right? How did people invent a lanaguage only 70 years ago?
Was English also reinvented from Old English? Also you still didnt answer why basically all Tzaddikim books are in what you call modern ivrit? On one hand you say they destroyed the lashon and created a modern version, on the other hand you said its a completely made up language -from thin air?Other posters are bringing up Rambam, if Rambam spoke about modern ivrit then its not that modern is it? What language did the Rambam write in?

I understand that modern hebrew isnt the same as Torah hebrew, but its pretty close, i mean a native hebrew speaker can read and understand Torah much more than someone who doesnt know hebrew. How can the accent not change? Even Yiddish speakers have different accents based on the country they came from. And words are basically the same as in Torah but of course you will have some slangs in modern hebrew or a few different meanings for words that were changed around.

Im basically just trying to understand how you can say hebrew is an entirely different language if its 90% the same as in Torah. Also if the zionists wanted to create a new language why did they base it on Torah and not just create a totally new language or base it on latin or something? Isnt Yiddish also based on lashon hakodesh so how is that considered a mundane language thats allowed to be spoken? And you mention lo shinu es leshonam, Yiddish sure sounds like it was Shinu from lashon hakodesh.