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The 90s…
Patrick Ewing and his missed finger roll against the Pacers.
Reggie Miller scoring 9 points in less than 20 seconds.
John starks shooting bricks against the Rockets.
Charles Smith is still trying to lay it in from 2 feet away.
Mark Messier, Adam Graves, Mike Richter, Brian Leetch and co. finally get us a cup.
The Yankees become relevant again.
Monica Lewinsky
White Ford Bronco
Internet becomes popular. Seemed like anything new was called Esomething or another.
Novell buys Wordperfect Corporation and promptly ruins the product resulting in Word and the rest of the Windows suite to become the standard. IBM buys Lotus corporation and despite the fact that the Lotus Suite including Ami Pro, 123 and ccmail were much better than anything Microsoft has put out to date, IBM arrogance essentially killed off the product as well.
I think I have my 386 with DX co-processor (for faster mathematical calculations!) in the garage somewhere. Shouldnt be too difficult to find, its probably one of the larger things way back there. I still remember upgrading at J and R to 1 whole MB of RAM. The salesman thought I was crazy spending over $400 on so much memory, 128k is plenty he told me.
The 3.5″ “floppy”, what a revolutionary idea 🙂
14.87%.
“Because if guys just stop dealing with a particular shadchan the others will just stop in. Seems to me.”
Sure. There are only so many bridges someone can burn though.
Until the roshei yeshiva allow the boys to socialize with the girls, they need the shadchanim to set them up. As much as they won’t admit it, the boys need shadchanim. Shadchanim should start wielding this power.
“everyone should band together and refuse to deal with any shadchan who doesn’t adhere to basic decency and common sense.”
Shadchanim should band together and stop dealing with people who dont adhere to basic decency and common sense as well (read parents – after a certain age IMO if the parties are not mature enough or smart enough to speak with a shadchan, they should not be seeing anyone for the purposes of shidduchim and it is usually parents who say things that if their children knew about them, would embarrass them greatly).
“Yes, but you can’t do that. You know why? Because the boys won’t put up with it. And they control the market.”
The shadchanim should be the ones who have the control. But they dont. They allow the inmates to run the asylum. They should put their foot down.
“So girls should band together and refuse to date any guys who don’t accede to certain conditions.”
No, shadchanim should band together and not set up anyone, male or female, who doesn’t adhere to certain conditions. One of those conditions should be respond in a timely manner.
Issurim include:
Lo Sichonein= issur to compliment, flatter or to praise a non-jew. (this one is the toughest as a sports fan)
This applies equally to the bus driver, plumber and politician. It is not a problem inherent with sports.
Nival peh= using bad language
(words in this catagory creeps into our subconscious minds when hearing how our “heros” speak. happened to me many times, I’m ashamed to admit.)
One can (and unfortunately does) hear words that would make ball players blush in the supermarket, restaurant or on the street coming from the mouths of non jews employed by frum jews.
Negiya= this happens in crowded stadiums, and sports complexes, with people of the opposite gender sitting next to you, or when entering and leaving with the crowd.
This happens every thursday night in the kollel store (where I shop) as people try and navigate the store.
these are the MOST common one can be oiver. yes there are more but it’s my personal list.
Yes. these are very common every day problems, that one must be wary of in every day life.
Mods dont sleep. What is behind such a silly notion.
“A boy has no pressure”
So create some. Dale Carnegie once said, people are motivated by one of two things, fear or money. It seems apparent that that there is no fear of not getting the names of girls, however, if you made boys put money up front, and deduct a few dollars every time they delay, drag along and waste your (and everyone else’s) time it might put SOME pressure on them to stop comparing the 47 options on their heilige list and make a decision. Seems to me that it is reasonable, dont shadchanim feel the need to be compensated for their time? Why is the time only on the clock once the girls family is in the picture?
I’m surprised the 10 qt stock pot was not approved.
“to please redd a shidduch and wait till you get a yes from the boy,”
Modche. As a shadchan do you find this to be the norm? If yes, why do you think it is? Is it feasible to say to a boy I need an answer in a week or the shidduch is off the table for after all you want the girl to go out with someone, not wait for someone to say yes, hopefully, eventually. Would things be different if you mentioned the name to the girl first got her yes, and then went to the boy? Would it force an answer sooner if he knew that a girl (not just a shadchan) was waiting for an answer?
It is tough to say there is any unified message coming out of zucotti park. Anyone and everyone has something they don’t like and an agenda they wish to push. Occassionally the agendas overlap and those people hang out together for a bit. I don’t mean to be cynical, but if Citigroup, BoA, Chase or any other financial institution showed up and announced they were hiring most of the OWS protesters would line up resume in hand.
“wouldn’t even listen to their rabbeim if told to stop. They are ungovernable and out of control.”
Would anyone consider them OTD? 🙂
This comment is likely coming from ignorance on my part (I know NOTHING about Lakewood, its dynamics, local make up, local politics etc, I know perhaps a handful of people who live in the city and have been there no more than half a dozen times in my life)….are 20 boys (or girls) that difficult to place? How many schools are there, that dividing up 20 children among all the boys schools is cause for a potential “crisis”?
“People who don’t understand that there are so many different ways in Avodas Hashem are just stupid.”
It might be the reason they refer to certain people as “OTD”. Either way, since different people have different ideas when they talk about “the derech”, those same people have different ideas about what it means to be off. Which in turn leads to different answers to the question, why they go OTD.
To echo the sentiment of FeifUn (without taking this thread in the direction of whether one should or should use said eruvin). Have you ever seen the pamphlets for and against the eruvin in brooklyn?
Smartcookie. Halivay your sentiment was one shared by Jews everywhere.
Is the BB black friday sale also online or in store only?
The point about gashmius raised back when is silly. Good quality, is good quality. IMHO, gashmius is when one buys the Blooks Blothers or Achim Brooks knock offs.
So, we keep talking about the “derech” and those who leave it. Is there a consensus as to what defines the “derech” that when one deviates, they are now off? I am not a chassidishe yid (insert any chassidus here), do not dress in the levush, daven in the same nusach, follow the psakim of the beis din or rebbe of the chassidus, I am clearly on a different derech than this chassidishe yid; as far as he is concerned I am off the derech, but am I off THE derech? Where does one draw the line to label someone off the drerech? How much bandwidth does this derech have, a derech that clearly accommodates many different people and has numerous lanes for travel, and at what point has one finally gone off onto the shoulder or taken an exit?
Luckily we have Rashi to tell us what Gedola refers to.
She may have been 7’4 and quite pettite. Gedolah would still describe her.
The hunt for zaidy from shmuel kunda
go to torahanytime.com and look for a lecture from Rav Noach Isaac Oelbaum on the topic. He discusses limaase when one may (not only may, is obligated) go to the authorities.
Hefker socializing? Where is that said, except in your response?
Why don’t we ask her what she advocated instead of assuming.
Are you DYs alter ego?
“DY’s point is that even if every single Jewish boy in the world would get married, there will still be Jewish girls left over for no one to marry.”
I think you meant to say there will still be jewish girls left over with no one to marry, but I don’t want to put words in your mouth.
Is their a consensus in a defined derech?
“Not through single events, and not through hefker socializing.”
Nobody advocated this. Classical immature arguments. Nothing to respond? Lets distort what the person wants to say and make them sound idiotic.
“but NASI is addressing the communal problem of more available girls than boys”
Not to beat a dead horse. Until all boys are invited to this party, there will always be a shortage of boys. Nothing NASI does, no matter how large a financial carrot they dangle in front of shadchanim, if we eliminate those we have written off as “modern”, we will always have a “shortage”.
I dont know you Mr. or Ms. OP. I dont know your parents. From the limited information shared, it would seem that your parents are not overly concerned with you and your shidduch prospects, but their image in the community as parents of a college student and how it may affect them and their social standing.
If it bothers you that the street is dirty, call 311 to send a truck through again.
This is more of a demand and supply problem.
What percentage of boys demand X level of support. What percentage of girls (or their families) are able to meet this level of demand.
What percentage of girls demand the next Rosh Yeshiva. What percentage of boys are available to meet this demand.
Insert your own demand and then see what percentage of the opposite gender is available to meet that demand. Now compile a list of all your demands. The percentage gets even smaller.
Perhaps people should stop demanding so many things and they would find an adequate available supply.
Perhaps you don’t see anyone buy it because you get to the news stand to late and all copies are already sold out. Perhaps they have home delivery. What does your teacher discuss from AMI?
She has a crush on him. He doesn’t know she exists. Doesn’t sound like much of a relationship.
DY. So, please explain why the girl cant get the name first?
BSD. I disagree. Since boys know they can take their sweet time and always have another name replace one that falls off his list, they do in fact drag their feet, holding up girls of any age, from dating in the process. If there is a “yes” from a girl, and he still drags his feet, he loses this chance and the shadchan will take the girl elsewhere. The point is to get girls dating and married.
“Likewise, learning about the obligations in Kesubos will make for better husbands.”
hmmm….better not, I’m not going to say it.
I am the walrus koo koo kachu
If the current system is so lopsided and advantageous to boys, why does the process start with the boys, why don’t shadchanim start the process with the girls, give them names of boys, let them give the first yes and so on?
Clearly you are living on fantasy island.
I would imagine it depends on the policy of each store.
BTGUY. I’m not sure if you are agreeing, disagreeing or adding something to my comment. Either way, I can count on one hand the number of times I have been in Lakewood, NJ. I have no clue what local politics is like, who its players are and the issues that make people tick. I was simply commenting on whether or not BMG should have a say in Lakewood politics. The short answer, if it affects them, they better.
BMG is not allowed to endorse anyone due to its tax exempt status. However, they can and do, make their opinions known on many issues in a variety of ways. As a local “resident” BMG has no more or no less “right” to have a say then any other resident in the township, county or state. As to whether you are obligated to believe in every cause they do, or vote for their candidate or issue of choice, that is for you to ask your Rav.
“But there have never been more learners and Kollel men since the Bais HaMikdash.”
Part of the problem might be everyone is looking to make a shidduch with a “kollel man” and not a “learner”. We have a shortage of boys because they are not “kollel men” rather they are “learners” and have been relegated to the trash heap of the shidduch world, some people call them “the modern guys”. Yes, we created a problem, we have eliminated many eligible bachurim from the available shidduch pool simply because they go to college, hold a 9-5 job or think about doing so. Yes, it is wonderful for your husband to learn 3 full sedarim a day. It is also wonderful to have a husband altogether, and if he learns for 2 hours in the morning before he goes to work and learns another 2 at night, did you also not marry a ben torah? Invite these bachurim to the shidduch island as well. Every single older (older than 28) girl that I know of who has gotten married in the last 2 years has married someone who holds a job. Are they being accused of settling? Do they feel that they settled? Ask them, dont take my word for it.
I heard that one prominent yeshiva (I wont repeat the name because I heard it from several people I believe to be reliable, but did not verify it so do not know for certain it is true) sits down with bachurim who are 25 or so and ask them point blank, ok, now what, and many are encouraged to get their degrees and perhaps even go to work depending on the direction of the conversation.
The more I read about NASI and its suggestions, the more I think the guys at endthemadness are on to something.
Think the subject might have clued in the MOD? 🙂
A sentiment I heard expressed by older singles (male and female, the youngest ~27) as well as parents of older singles since the proposal was publicised last week, is that a large part of the problem are the shadchanim themselves. “Flattering” terms such as heartless, ruthless and brusque were used. This new program and its huge financial carrot will not stop such behavior, and will perhaps exacerbate it.
On the flip side, we keep hearing how shadchanim feel abused, overworked, under appreciated and underpaid.
With such a disconnect between shadchanim and those they are supposed to be working with, is it any wonder we have problems?
Perhaps YWN would like to offer its website to “older singles” by setting up a shidduch database somewhere onsite. YWN can act as a sort of clearinghouse where people can post information about themselves, or people they know, and its users can be the shadchanim. To ensure anonymity, only basic information with no names, need be posted and designated folks can be points of contact and facilitators for those who have suggestions and would like to take it to the next level. Perhaps YWN readers can get in on the act by donating 2 or 3 dollars a month (I have no idea how many but am willing to bet a thousand people will gladly donate this amount) which can be used to compensate these deignated folks for their time and effort in facilitating this exchange of information. Perhaps some professional shadchanim reading this might consider joining as facilitators. We all believe that 40 days before “yetziras havlad” a bas kol called out bas ploni liploni, hashem already made the shidduch, he needs us to act as his shluchim in getting them together. Perhaps ploni and bas ploni are 6000 miles apart and need people who are connected through a medium such as the internet to help them get together?
Just a thought.
There is a video going around the web of a (non jewish) bride, texting at her wedding ceremony. The galach is standing their saying his thing, she pulls out her phone sends a couple of texts and puts away the phone. The look on her fathers face (he is standing right next to her) is priceless.
The analogy to Eliyahu Hanavi is flawed on several levels. Not the least of which is, sending money only assures you a spot on a list, nothing more, nothing less, it does not even assure a phone call from a shadchan, much less a date. However, if someone has the money to send and wishes to try, go for it. It is surely better than doing nothing.
I think a large part of the problem is that guys get redt many girls at a time, from many different shadchanim, sometimes 3-4 girls at a time from the same shadchan. This leaves many girls “hanging” while a few guys are “looking into things”. Perhaps the girls should get the names of the guys first, and once a girl says yes, the onus on the guy to say either yes or no, is concrete, not just “i’m looking into it”.