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common, I don’t think litvishe T’Ch in Israel are into car status, nor were they in Lita. Vilna Gaon was not spending much on gas (or barley), would make GH happy.
spot on> There are many avenues Hashem may take for the Geulah. It need not come about through the state.
I totally agree, and I am also not comfortable with people publicly davening with words asserting certain status. How do they know?! On the other hand, the hope and aspiration are entirely understandable and it is not natural to ignore such a tremendous change in Jewish life as a whole country populated by Jews in EY. Just go stand near (not under) Arc of Titus in Rome to see IVDAEA CAPTA written there and laugh at dead Romans (like R Shapiro z’L did in 1967 on the way back from 6-day war).
Orange > agree that like-mindedness is more important than nusach, money, or ivy status
but how does one find this out in “shiduch resume”, or does this approach requires a different search model? If I may compare this to an academic job search. When in grad school, I saw a position that matched my research interest. I got no response. A year later, I am eating lunch with a Jewish professor from that department and we are doing a good hevrusa on that research topic. So, I ask him – were you on the search committee? He says – yes. So, I ask – why did you then reject me? He says – I never saw your resume, secretary rejected it because you are not from an Ivy. I am so thankful to this guy for the useful information that steered me in a better direction.
Avira > for a man to marry a wan from a less well-to-do background.
oi vei. To the intended point: girls would exchange dresses by Tu B’Av, but to a degree – king’s daughter with Kohen Gadol’s … same here – “less well to do” … So, a guy with 10 shoe stores should marry someone with 2 shoe stores.
Now, you can ask – if every man marries “less well to do”, what is gonna happen with smartest/richest girls and poorest boys?! A possible answer is – this advise is addressed to the top layer of Talmidei Chachamim (who learn this Gemora). Now, it is a biological fact that male species have more variability than female. Ie. there are more super-smart men and super-stupid men, super-angry and super-calm … [you may find this observation to explain a lot of things in life …] So, the top level of T’Ch need to go a little lower, but a below-average men will probably get wives that are smarter than them. May be a punishment to both.
moishe, in simpler words: ingratitude is bad trait. Non-Jewish. If someone did something for you, you need to be thankful (even if the person did it in his interest). Let me know if this is self-evident or you need a source sheet.
I think this meets definition of a monopoly. Not all industries are easy for competition, but less and less so. We used to have phone monopoly. At&t produced wonderful phones that attached beautifully to the wall and always worked. Nobody wants them anymore somehow/ Do you think if AT&T stayed a monopoly we would have phones in the pockets, sending pictures and messages around, for better or worse? Similar problems are in defense. In all cases, if you focus on market solutions, you can always find some ideas to try, and from experience, there is “nothing to lose”. For example, there is an idea of having insurance work across state lines. Who can be against it? (except the monopolists).
I don’t know what would have happened with Jews in Arab countries in 1930-50s, I agree that their fate became worse by a connection with Israel. But look a little longer -transformation of Middle East over the century is not much related to Jews. Yes, all these countries talk about Jews and Israel all the time, but mostly to keep population entertained and angry at someone else.
So, think how Jews would feel under any of the regimes of last 50 years – socialist murderers on Syria, Iraq, Libya; Iranian islamists, Yemen civil war. How many Jews will be paraded in orange jumpsuits by ISIS? Maybe they would be OK in Egypt, Morocco, Tunis, Jordan.
Avria, Zushy, I am not questioning any stories, all I am saying that the pilot story is questioned because some of Teimeni Jews ended with a tragedy. This is like saying that Netziv was wrong protesting Russian infiltration of the Volozhin yeshiva because Russian revolution would soon sweep away both the Czar and the yeshivos. “Oh, you know Talmidei Chachamim who survived and went to other countries?! So, you don’t care about all those Jews who were killed in Russia” This is clearly a silly argument because you can point to all yeshivos that came out of Volozhin derech, but as you don’t know many Teimenims and they all one big news-story for you. They are way above just a reason for your pity and attack weapon against your enemy. Follow Menachem Begin who when visiting Sephardim refugees, instead of pitying them (affirmative action style), appealed to their higher side – you are the people who came from Rambam, etc.
This post seem to be annual at Rosh Hodesh Elul or something, both parents and teachers scared of starting the school year … hatzlaha
> Do you have any idea how insulting your statements are to the survivors of spiritual murder
the question is based on a premise that a Jew saved from Yemen had surely went to gehinom, effort wasted. I am saying this premise is wrong, I am not making fun of anyone. a de raba, he is treating people as abstract material for the political stories. Would you similarly say that it was not worth liberating Jews from Nazi camps or demonstrating for Soviet Jews because a sizeable number of those assimilated when freed?
Avira > Daas baaleibatim – marry the same socio-economic class
This is a generic advice I heard from several Rabonim from different nusachim. As one of them put it: men and women are different enough by itself, don’t need other problems.
I am not sure I 100% agree with that, but would not call this balabatish. Where I do differ is that maybe middos and types of thinking are more important than nusach, money, or ivy status.
No wonder Mordecai lost his Sanhedrin rank after getting involved in politics. Making sholom between Israel and several of it’s enemies is not enough zechut to allow for some other disagreements?! This is not good enough even if double standard is your only one
Refuah shleima to Mrs. CTL.
But it seems most large urban areas are more predictable and to the worse side…
And then you have patients who complain for the lack of salt. You should know if you overuse salt, then you stop tasting normal amounts. And also know this is one of the first questions a (good) cardiologist will ask – do you have a salt-shaker on your table.
This discussion raises a question. It is considered a mitzvah in this country to minimize taxes paid, take all possible deductions, hopefully stopping before gray area… This is not same as using services for poor, hope you are, but let me know.
These items are comingling more and more, and on purpose. Clinton initiated “credits” that exceed taxes paid which others called disguised welfare, while proponents counted against payroll taxes paid elsewhere… By now, you get so many transfer payments that it is hard to track. For example, what is taking a loan to get a degree and then enrolling into Obama’s low payment program that was just enhanced and get loans cancelled. Is this kosher, or only because everyone is doing it. As little girl retorted to r Yehoshua regarding a shortcut through a field, gazlanim like you made it
I’ve seen Teimeni Jews with peyos. And they are pronouncing Ayn, so they were not raised by chasidim. So, maybe those terrible stories had some Guzma ..
For those who lament Sephardim coming to Israel, think what would happen with them under Asad, Qaddafi, Saddam, Yemen civil war, ISIS… You want to see Jewish girls sold into slavery and boys learning to slit throats?
There were different nonJews, some would be motivated by proselytizing, others for saving lives … There are hard cases,.. one of my relatives left her blonde son with a neighbor, telling her that if something happens with the boy she’ll report the neighbors Jewish husband …. The boy survived
I brought sources not as ultimate answer but for a discussion and to highlight the issue. Please bring modern teshuvos and let’s see how we got from one to another. Stop complaining about me quoting S A, there are worse crimes here!!
Rw, I think there are way more obscure expressions in nach, not even counting Aramaic.. maybe some native speakers of modern Hebrew can tell us which one is closer?
Avram, I mentioned local Rav not r Moshe because you want to be sure you get unbiased advice. If you read r Moshe and then read someone else paskening differently, how do you know you didn’t select the cheapest option? Unless you always go by IM.
I see what you are saying about taxes. This is an argument that welfare is not my community charity. Otherwise you could claim you fulfill tzedoka through IRS… I see welfare as nonJewish collective charity. Note that they let you to sometimes subtract your charity from taxes, do they see the kesher. Politically, people definitely see difference between types of spending. Most people are okay going getting unemployment and social security, but many wouldn’t sign up for subsidies for the poor and look down at people who use those without a need. This may be old fashioned and outdated, but I think it still exists.
I agree that the fact this is not coming from a king may changes that SA refusal to use the funds. But it could cut both ways. As stealing from a tzibur is hard to atone for. So, if you inappropriately spent NJ funds, you got to go to all towns and build water fountains there!? It maybe sakanah
When discussing geula, you may be mislead by history: we know when and how we left mitzraim, how many years in bavel, why beis hamikdash was destroyed.. note that all of that is post factum, even when there was direct communication with Hashem before that. So, all heshbonos we have for geula might appear in a different light in reality. Say, in 1967, maybe tzahal would have gone to har habait, a red cow would be walking around, a stray cannon or a worm collapse the mosque, or mosque leaders come out with their own karbonot in hand. … So it doesn’t have to require a lot of time ..
Moishe, try using this approach when saying morning brochos: shoes hurt today, so skipping kol tzarki, back hurts, so much work feel like an even. Ingratitude is a bigger problem than even TDS
RebE, in some sort of engineering. Math and machine learning work the same for bridges and airplanes.. ctlawyer, right how do you know someone went to Harvard? It’s the first thing they tell you. Most research shows the value of ivy etc is in signaling to the employer that this person probably had high sat score. Instead of direct test that would often be illegal.
Is it worth going there? I would say either if you are poor enough to qualify for aid; plan to be a workaholic so that all these connections matter; and you live at home or with a group of observant students, and have enough of political maturity not to be swept by ideology that is strongest at best places. Everyone else should be at YU, Touro, strong local college or strong online college. In no particular order. Clep mills are other extreme to avoid, you are trying to get an education not just a line on the resume
So, Yidden with medical degrees should go work in areas where Yidden live, and Yidden in areas where there are not enough doctors, should go get medical degrees.
Rebbi should not have taught the lesson when he was personally offended. He should have noted a problem, then find a time when the kid offends someone else and teach him then.
RW > why nach and Mishna are written in a much simpler tongue than Torah.
Where are holding in Nach to say this?! Mishna is cliff notes of scholarly discussions, not necessarily full spoken language, even if it brings examples of common speech.
Look carefully at teshuvot that discuss in-person communication, such as Igros Moshe: is he mentioning an alternative of answering teshuvos in writing? As most of warning is regarding voice, talking, looking, it is obvious that writing is preferred. If there are some restrictions on writing, the poskim should be mentioning those. But this is for necessary discussion. The biggest question on CR would be for silly discussions…
There is also a halakhic consideration of derech eretz that overrides extreme precautions. If you are in a society where people talk, then you should say shabbat shalom and mazal tov; if you live in a shtetl where this is not done, then don’t (most poskim, check with your own). So, ignoring a reasonable post by a lady may qualify as an offense against derech eretz.
common, you are talking different centuries. People looked way closer at your time. Nowadays, there are now 2-3 times more people attending college. Observant people from Jewish schools work in many places already and either are a testimony or a facilitator for the younger ones.
My experience is similar to yours: I was a butt of (friendly) jokes in my first post-grad workplace – I was the first hire whose PhD was not from top three schools in the industry. Now, that firm routinely hires PhDs from my school, not sure whether I started the trend or, more likely, they lowered the standards. As for me, that was the only time when the school was looked at.
Gadol,
there is a real problem here – uneducated masses would improve their life by better education and they may or may not achieve that by going to college and then having debt (after also getting grants).Let’s see what would be a reasonable “investment”:
– identify productive majors and schools based on school previous track record.
– before someone goes to school, provide him low-cost subsidized insurance: if someone goes into an approved school/major and then does not succeed, then his loans are partially forgiven.
This would let people take (reasonable) personal risk, benefit if they succeed and not be total losers if they don’t.There is also a private market solution, that there are some limited experiments on:
– investors pay for school (partially or fully) in return for a percentage of future earnings. These could be school themselves or separate investors.
Not sure how easy to push this further given all the giveaways.Gadol > social welfare transfer programs
Social welfare? I thought it is inflation reduction 🙂 If I can speak for all (200 mln) of us, this is very grating for some many reasons:
it is a transparent giveaway of common funds to interest groups, timed to elections, attempted to look like benign: President before said that he will consider “up to 10K” – so the headline is 10K, then another 10K for many, then another several perks, some with special preferences for government workers, so that nobody really knows the price and details, without Congress, with insane moral hazard and unfairness, and zero positive effect on improving future policies.
It is beyond anything King George was accused of, more like late Roman Emperors who were increasing Legions’ pay to keep them happy.
Iamhappy> I do know people who got into Ivy League schools with these degrees
Me too. Based on what common is saying, maybe they had some additional leg up? Super high LSAT? Internships that their parents helped to find? Sympathetic professors aware of those yeshivos?
> I also know people who gotten into the B schools and in a way they got better offers cuz they were top in those law or graduate schools as opposed to being in the middle or bottom of Harvard or Yale.
This is confusing, could you explain? Are you saying, a good rank at the yeshiva helped (do yeshiva even give ranks to grad schools?!) Or do you mean job offers after being top in grad school? Agree on this, your undergrad does not matter after your grad school.
Would it be then yichud for mods to read, and sometimes rely, to posters? Oi vei.
RebE > However, for Rebbi Akiva, who hated originally talmidei chachamim, it was not so obvious.
Thanks for this explanation, I never heard it. So, from now, MRRE (Moreini Rabeini Reb E)
> “it’s a tircha, as AAQ said.”
here is a good illustration. Give someone a kulah to hang on, and it is gladly accepted 🙂
Capitalization started somewhere in late Rome, before that everything was UPPERCASE like Hebrew. Then, almost every noun was (Germans still do that), first words, Divine names, etc. Overall, there seem to be two rules:
1) capitalization correlates w/ kavod. So, the weightier your Subject is, the more Capitals… Maybe you should be saying Hashem as The G-d, as, l’havdil, you are supposed to say The Queen (two Capitals)
2) Still, There are no exact Rules, They do change over time.Syag > Did anyone else catch the irony in that response
Thanks, I did now. Maybe people are more careful about kavod those they interact with. Even anonymous beats someone from a different generation. We do call Hillel Hillel; Rav is Rav, combining a title and a nickname closer to our times we get longer titles. R Natan Kamenetsky simply uses R and suggest the reader to choose themselves which R is Reb, Rav, Raban, Rebbe, or Morah Moreinu Horav Reb.
fascinating discussion surely honoring Satmar Rav and his sense of humour. Need more Yiddish puns though.
A practical solution for phone users to look more menchlich: does your keyboard has auto-complete? when you typed “Rebbe” once and it lists that and 3 more words, click on the word and it should be added to the dictionary. So, next time, you’d quickly get to the right word and form. At least, I made sure that my phone “knows ‘Hashem’ “. This should also tie into speech-to-text. I think I am using gboard, not sure about other keyboards. Alternatively, don’t drive-and-post, come home and use your computers after kids finish their homework.
Avira> He called Rembrandt, .. a tzadik! Because he had one portrait of the tosfos yom tov
first, this is not the reason R Kook might have used, at least in the only source I found. Could you please elaborate?
Rembrand’s student van Hoogstraten painted Tosfos Yomtov and called him ‘Old Man in a Window.’
Rembrandt etched his neighbor Chacham Menashe B’ Israel – and seemingly did several illustrations to Menashe’s sefer. There are also interesting hidden parallels: Menashe brings only one of several ways how “mane tekel fares” might have looked on the wall – and that is how Rembrandt painted them a couple of years ago.
Zuchy, when they travelled on shmita – what was their message? Is this before various technical solutions were proposed to make it easier, and solutions were different?
RebE, As I mentioned, Rambam keeps others and himself out of line of fire with the caveat that math should be judged based on proofs. And as long as those computations are correct, I don’t see how Einstein changes anything. But then I am an applied mathematician, care more about results than inner beauty.
I did find the chapter surprisingly easy written. I usually find math written between Babylon and Leibnitz totally impossible to read.
It is a pretty simple algorithm, going first through simple rules and then requiring going further only in some cases. Really a well-written code, separating computations into multiple simple operations and logical statements on how to proceed. I don’t know whether this is Rambam’s personal maala, or Arabs or Greeks before him.
PS For interesting connections between Gemora and math/economics look up lectures by Yisrael / Robert Aumann (Frankfurt, RJJ, CUNY, MIT). One is about widows in Ketubot 93, daf yomi people have a month to figure out how this relates to Reb/Prof Aumann’s Nobel prize.
jackk> Republican’s love to keep people in debt.
Until they gamble and lose and then Bankruptcy.Jackk, you are right, the American system is corrupt and we should all move to USSR where government kindly cancelled all the debts, together with bankers and gamblers. Oh, wait, no, it is not better there – how do you explain THAT!?
Jackk,
there is no national debt, USA Inc is an LLC, passing through the income and less to each of us.Passing money back to the original taxpayers in the form of reduced taxes is not a problem, it is simply decreasing the LLC overhead and letting people invest where they want themselves.
Obama went from 68% debt-to-GDP to 105% during supposed recovery. Trump went from 105% to 107% first 3 years and then jumped to 129% in the covid year. everyone supported his spending that year. Biden continued a lot of those decisions even into times when they are arguably are not needed any more, such as eviction moratorium and student debt postponement.
common, nachon, hu adam gadol, ani choshev, using lashon harambam
I heard that a stroke survivor in PA had hutzpah to make fun of a doctor eating obscure vegies and got back a retort that he would not need to be a stroke survivor were he to know of veggies … apparently, this worked and the stroke survivor is doing teshuva, going down to 200 lbs.
Avira > We’re not elevated by using lashon kodesh for mundane things
It certainly feels this way for us, but we got to admit that Jews used loshen hakodesh for all mundane things for centuries, both talmidei chachamim and amei haaretz. Also tzdukim and gibonim. And Avodim. And silly ketanim, such as naarim ketanim running after Elisha. The bear was probably also Hebrew-speaking.
AAQ> “I THINK I FULLY APPRECIATE SUCCESSES OF YESHIVA/HAREIDI MOVEMENT IN GETTING US TO THE CURRENT MOMENT.”
Avram> I don’t, or at least if it is so, you are not communicating it here.I just did above. I can expand on what seems to be common between most of us, so it is boring to recap. Here is my view of modern history, standing on one leg: most of Jewish world was unprepared to modernity; Jews who learned the old-fashioned way – between mincha and maariv – has their children swept up in socialist and capitalist lifestyles; first positive responses to modernity, see Mendelhson, were intellectually honest, but did not protect their communities and children. Eastern Europe got the virus later and had time to develop some protective measures, going insular and increasing institutional learning w/ yeshiva movement. As Chofetz Chaim says: oilam thinks one should be frum, frum, and then klug. while he suggests: klug, klug, and then frum. DEfinite plug for improving education! Sometimes isolation had to the level of “midbar” as Hazon Ish describes his Israeli system of separating from society. R Salanter and R Hirsh developed more integrated approaches that allowed people to interact with the world with less trepidation (R Salanter specifically mentions r Hirsh).
This is even further true in America – before Eastern Europe arrivals, there was no learning, almost complete assimilation. Furthermore, “frum” behavior would not transfer from European parents to American kids as you don’t look up to parents who are not respected in the new society (source: R Nosson Sherman), so education was the key. In most cases, successful mass education was possible only within communities that isolated themselves upon arrival. Those who did not were assimilating way faster than educating. All of these ensured survival of a strong dedicated community that can sometimes even help the rest of American Yidden (Chabad and occasional others) that, upon survival, should say hallel and start addressing how to maintain strong ehrliher Jewish community. A lot of what was achieved was done by efforts of dedicated survivors of Nazi and Soviet prosecutions, who are not with us anymore, so even continuing on the same path may be a challenge that needs to be addressed.
Avram > We can’t just “not trace it further to our times”
I agree, I was just explaining that you start w/ early sources and then see what qualifiers later sources add to that. I am absolutely open to hearing those to discuss.
Avram > do you calculate maaser on your income before or after taxes?
after, psak from a local chareidi Rav. A good question – does this decision affect how you see taxes and getting them back? This is what I mentioned as a possible window of actions due to a sofek how to see taxes. Go ahead, what is your approach?
Avira > it’s extremely rare for terror attacks to happen in England, Antwerp,
Taking a longer view, mainland Europe’s safety track record for Jews is limited to the last 70 years, after 2,000 years of being prime targets of prosecution. True, some locations as you mention have a couple of hundreds of years. Hope it continues, but, historically speaking, Europe is not yet a “safe place”. 1913 Europe was viewed by humanity as safe, and with current events we see how unstable things might be. Anyway, we should cherish any place where we, and other people, can have shalom, and not advocating Hashem’s tzitzum to just 2-3 cities. The more, the better.
1, right. I am not against BTLs, just wondering what is the use, other than law school?
I am also interested in applying yeshiva/seminary credits to other colleges for those who are not in commuting distance from heilicke Brooklyn. Many people ponder sending to a local college v. YU or Touro. this does sound more like a question for ani-ima site, although halakha makes fathers responsible for teaching kids Torah and professions, not mothers.
RW > I understand that the Hebrew we speak today is more modern, but how can you say its a new invented language?
Modern Hebrew was revived by early Zionists as a way to forge an identity separate from both religious Jews on one side and from those who wanted to build socialism for everyone, rather than just for Jews, on the other.
Current Israeli Jews are 4 generations from those halutzim, and most of that ideology is dead. So, the question now should be – is there anything inherently wrong with using modern Hebrew? some of the arguments against it are reasonable, others sound like a way to fight those last-generation battles.
RebE> Rambam Hilchas Kiddush Hachodesh (17, 24)
T his seems to be in a wrong thread ..thanks, he says astronomy and geometry. He also says that Chochmei Israel bnei Yassahar knew this also but we lost their writings and that it is not so much that we trust “scientists” but that we judge their argument by the merit of their proofs, not their identities.
And this may be a good reason for people to study math and other hard sciences before they get to philosophy and any serious Jewish studies. It is a simple kal vehomer that one’s ability to see true argument in hard sciences is higher as there is usually an answer in the back of the book. Without it, and with “positive learning” popular today, everyone becomes convinced of his own thinking abilities because he always comes to the right conclusion (according to his own judgment or the judgment of his teachers). If you once struggle to prove a geometry theorem that a Greek guy using two instruments in the sand near Athens could, you’ll be humbler claiming that you understand hidden ways of Hashem.
The story I heard was of a guy walking into the Satmar Rebbe’s office while the secretary was out for lunch. He told Rebbe about his sick wife and children, lost parnosa, Rebbe gae him money. The secretary saw him on the street coming out and ran to the Rebbe – hope you didn’t give him anything, he is a known swindler. Or, so his wife is not sick his kids are OK? He did not lose parnosah?! Boruch Hashem …