Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Rav Mattisyahu Salomon, Shlita, is recorded on tape saying that since the main mitzvah of a woman is tznius, her entry into adulthood should be marked with tznius. A big bash is in direct contrast.
Everything should be done with Tznius. It already has a source, and is not new (but always helpful to be reminded).
Rashi Succah 49B, P’shat in the Gemorah there.
A different Yeshu, who was a follower/copycat of Tzaddok & Baiysus.
????? ????? ????? ?????
As well as other Rishonim (such as Rabbainu Tam, but I dont have that in front of me) (BH for Hebrewbooks.org).
It is on page 8 of the PDF
squeak:
You can redeem the bonds before 30 years. Look up the treasury bond website for more details.
Such as not only having a kiddush in shul for a Bas Mitzvah — but at the same time, she makes a siyum on a seder mishnayos
Wicked! Does it then become a Seudas Mitzva?
Clearheaded, yet again we agree. The problem is how the bracket has been pushed from a Heymish Siyum with family in shul or home to a fully catered event with Sushi, a full shmorg & Viennese table.
There you go 🙂
Bas Mitzva -> bonds -> pay for Kollel (if you want).
squeak –
But is it worth more then the pen?
squeak
How about a savings bond ~ 25$ face?
Or you can give a Waterman.
SJS:
Yes it is that person’s problem, but when we have it happening on a massive scale throughout our community, when it is the NORM to go into debt to pay for your child’s wedding or Bar Mitzva, we have to take a step back and examine what are we doing wrong here?
Is it the education, the lack of Mistapek B’muat, the “Magia Li” generation?
Or are we telling ourselves that paying back a Chov (let alone on time) is no longer a mitzva (C’V). How can one be willing to go into debt to make a Bar (or Bas) Mitzva or wedding, or to pay for your child to buy an apartment, but then tell the Grocery or your children’s school “I just can’t pay this month”.
Where are our priorities? And where have we gone wrong?
You think this cannot happen, well this is the daily reality for Jews on Har Habayit. A little food for thought.
It is called Galus.
IOW, buying goods and services in the community — even when “overspending” on “lavish” items *reduces* the need for tzedaka and makes us better off financially.
Wolf:
But when Tzedaka is required to PAY for the overspending of others, because people feel they can’t make anything less, that goes way beyond the line.
I have no problem with the G’vir who gives Chomesh, pays full tuition and wants to make a nice, even somewhat “lavish” but not ostentatious/showy simcha.
The bigger problem is when the guy who doesn’t pay full tuition, and is not a big Baal Tzedoka, feels he also “needs” to make a “nicer” simcha (or support his children, or buy them an apartment) and needs to collect Tzedaka to do so. He can and SHOULD do with much less, if anything.
aries2756:
You are right. Our focus on materialism has to be lessened. So many Yiddin out there need Tzedaka for things like treatments, tuition payments, and Job placement, when our dollars go towards “tzedaka” that ends up paying for others to have Lavish weddings and buy apartments for their newlyweds.
Rabboisai, WHERE ARE OUR PRIORITIES!
EDITED
But would I keep a loaded pistol in my home?
Would you have a pool in your backyard?
At work, IT has a full record of where you go and what you do on your computer. There is no Yichud.
SJS compared having a TV to having (unfiltered, unchecked)internet at home, and there is no question that having such internet is worse.
The question is where to draw the line.
Assuming so right is “talking to me”:
And are Vorts, large weddings, buying children apartments, etc. any different? They all stem from the same materialism (which we get from the Goyish culture around us) that all Torah Yidden should refrain from having.
The Gedolim have spoken against this ostentatious behavior. I don’t see how anyone who claims to “follow the Gedolim” can be for any of these items, including large Bas (or Bar) Mitzvos.
We have no idea of the background, perhaps he is coming home from speaking to a parent after treatment or surgery, Lo Alainu.
I would not say anything withoug knowing more.
Dan L’Kaf Zechus.
How we all wish we could abolish many of the waste is Klal Yisroel (not only public Bas Mitzvas, but other items as well such as Vorts, Large Weddings & Bar Mitzvas, Buying married children apartments, etc., which our Gedolim have talked against).
Alas, when one has the money to go ahead, everyone else feels the need to follow.
Max well:
Who is Ittisa?
Go learn some gemorah and get back to me 🙂
Ittisa asked me to mention her favorite flavor is Vanilla soft. Does not like chocolate.
A mock object (option 2 that I listed).
I’m just wondering if there is some svara behind it (unless he or she is a programmer, of course).
I wouldn’t even know how to pronounce it.
Moq:
See my note above regarding Orthopraxy.
Also (personal curiosity) what is “Moq” (other than “begin”, or a mock object)?
Max well: It was a while back, and only some flavors were CY (they were listed on a board on the back wall, to the far left of the flavor list).
This may have changed, and they may no longer have any CY flavors.
Max well:
squeak: I’m sure you are not comparing the Gedolim’s disdain of secular studies curriculum’s to the behavior of the church or mosque.
Who are we to question what the Gedolim decide are the best methods for Chinuch and additional Limud Torah in Klal Yisroel!
If that is their intent, so be it. We are not to question, but to follow.
EDITED
Interesting question:
Pistachio, but I can’t get it here (not Chalov Yisroel).
I was once in NYC (Queens) where they have a store called Max & Mina’s, which has many different flavors (some CY and some not), and picked up some strawberry cheesecake Ice Cream. It was very good, but not really an Ice Cream “flavor”.
tying your shoes is an exception! That goes left to right. (Due to Teffilin)
squeak: Starting from the right side, of course.
🙂
Moq:
The Menaheles received a number of phone from shadchanim, and one from a parent.
But were they calls that they wanted dates, because she was a model, just like having served time is good for shidduchim, or were they calls not to date?
I assume from the story that they were calls to date, but you are not clear.
Just as a correction to holtzichfest & Max well above:
Whomever says that bochrim go to work to “make it big” is living in the 60’s, when Kollel was really a struggle and society & parents had to be fought to remain in learning, even after high school.
The objective of almost all bochrim/marrieds who are in learning (note I don’t say boys) today who go to work is either (due) to:
1: Survive (they have been in Kollel for X years, and have Chovos, and just can’t do it anymore).
2: Pay tuition, and stop living off of other’s tzedaka, (after they realize they are not subject to the Kesef Mishna’s qualifications of “giving back”, or realizing they can’t live on tzedaka when they have and expect more then the givers).
I have found one bochur who wanted to “make it rich” out of 3-4 hundred. He grew up dirt poor with a single parent & didn’t want his children to grow up like that.
Otherwise it is much easier lifewise to stay in kollel.
And parents don’t usually force their children out (unless they have a family business). Telling them they wont see a dime, even from the Yerusha, is in most cases enough.
Al Shelosha D’Varim Haolam Omed: KESEF MAMMON GELT!
clearheaded:
I have learned time and time again that you can not force others to do the right thing, particularly with telling them how they should raise their children.
The only thing that can be done is to teach your own children what is right and wrong, and hope they internalize it.
We live in a time of extreme materialism (which is the source of many, if not all of the “crisises” that we claim to exist). If you are happy not having everything, and show your children that you can be happy with less, Bezras Hashem your children will escape the materialism that surrounds them.
I’m not saying there is anything wrong with having, but there must be priorities.
“Some parents have to know when to say NO. “
We call it Vitamin N.
Like!
Forced cannibalism of one’s children still sounds worse to me but who am I to argue with Rashi, right? I hereby stand corrected.
It is not the matter of being forced, it is that they chose to do so instead of retaining their humanity is what makes it horrific.
And I’m not the one who said they are in order (of bad, even within the groups), anyway. If you could find out who said it (I think I have heard it (as far as the groupings are concerned) as well, but have also heard it is just a timeline), or if anyone else could help, I would be happy to learn.
AinOhdMilvado:
The descent into inhumanity is one of the largest K’lallos of the Tochacha.
Wolf: ending up selling yourself on a flooded slave market is, as Rashi points out, saying that they will not even want you for work, so you will be killed right away.
As opposed to the Holocaust, where many who lived did so in “work” camps, as they wanted some of the Jews’ output.
clearheaded:
That is what 4&5 are for, to teach how small things add up.
I looked up this Silly Bandz toy on Wikipedia, it says
“The toys are sold in packs of 24 for about $4.95”
This does not sound unreasonable for a toy. Perhaps it can be used to teach responsibility, such as only giving one (out of the 24) out every two/three weeks and telling the child they have to take care of it (not lose or break it), or they will have none. Or giving one out for doing extra, and let the child think how she could help, and if she does so without asking, reward the child.
Everything can be a teaching moment, even something silly (intended:).
clearheaded:
Suggestions on the Kav HaYashar (take what you like, leave what you don’t, some may be contradictory)
1: Set an allowance, and except for special occasions, don’t buy anything else.
2: Take child to the store, and show them how much toys cost compared to food, etc. Many children (and adults) have no concept of Cost.
3: Take your child to a soup kitchen, Tomchei Shabbos, etc (assuming they are old enough to understand) to show them how the “other side” lives.
4: Work on delayed gratification. Tell you child “you can have it, but then when you want a bigger present (birthday, etc.) you will not be able to get one. AND FOLLOW THROUGH!
5: Start a savings account for the child, and show how small amounts add up when saved over long periods.
Good luck, and feel free to add or argue.
oomis1105:
Which was the point about Teffilin of Rabbanu Tam. It is easy to forget what it means to be a Chassid, and to just define it by one who wears the garb.
Isn’t that a marvelous middos machine joke?
“You will be our guests for dinner tonight” IIRC
This is separate in case it doesn’t go through:
The reason for 1 above is orthopraxy, and the reason for 2 is not teaching our girls the deep rooted basis of Tznius and Das Moshe V’Yehudis in Halacha (vs. being a “modern idea”).
Clearheaded:
As you pointed out, Yiras Shomayim & Yiras Chet go hand in hand. The problem with Tznius is either:
1: The women in question are lacking in Yiras Shomayim in general (which begs the question why are they lax in Tznius over other Mitzvos).
2: The women in question have Yiras Shomayim, but don’t believe they are doing a Chet.
Both are possible, and both probably account for many of the problems we see.
“Lacking Yiras Shomayim in a certain area” does not make sense (to me). Either they fear G-d or they don’t, but not that they only fear G-d for certain things. Punishment maybe, but not Hashem.
bbyg: You are only allowed if you call yourself Tichon Meir Moshe Girl 🙂
“how can you compare girls having a conversation, in a tznius way, to eating pig?”
I’m not.
The Netziv was not opposed to some secular education (supposedly), but was worried that the Russians would impose unbearable restrictions, as they ended up doing before he was able to decide (such as no learning from 9-3).
The Chafetz Chaim said the Yeshiva closed for the reason PY stated.
(Of course none of this is first hand, but it can be searched).
Helpful:
Insulting someone is UN’Helpful’ to your cause.
Lets try again:
HLM: You mentioned the street belongs to everyone. Even though that is true (if they made a bracha on it :), they are still not allowed to do things that are Assur on that street. For example, you would never say one can eat pig on the street just because they can walk on it. So too, assuming “hanging out” on the street is not Tzanua (as “hanging out” is not “Kol Kavod Bas Melech”, and is not acting in the general quiet manner that a Bas Yisroel should act, as I have pointed out before in the thread), the fact that they can walk on the street does not excuse their behavior.
I know, my paragraph is longer, and less emotional. But I believe it will be more effective.
Dr. Hall:
I believe the issue was teaching it together with Torah (same place, religious teachers, etc), not in a University setting.
I could be mistaken.
says who:
I know this sounds cruel, but perhaps he is collecting and thinks he can make more money the frummer he looks?
He probably is correct.
Clearheaded:
Yiras shomayim of Hashem is the only yiras shomayim that exists.
You may be refering to Yiras Chet.
“mainly it is lack of acknowledgment of the vital importance of tznius and the terrible consequences when we are not betznius”
Still sounds like Yiras Chet. Perhaps to solve the problem, sources should be provided where it is explained what is required?
I don’t see anyone eating Pork because of “lack of acknowledgment of the vital importance of not eating pork and the terrible consequences when we eat pork”
It is almost as if you are saying the girls don’t believe that “Tznius” really exists.
Depends if you are in Charaidi EY or other.
If you are in Charaidi EY, you may (if the male is Sephardi) have to take on your wife’s last name! 🙂
I am aware of many “mixed” marriages in the Dati Leumi community (and it is very common), as well as the American Communities in EY and Chutz. They seem to work.
Helpful:
“Austritt” just means the community is separated from the reform and conservative. (as opposed to a joint community with the Reform).
Not sure why current “Frum Working” Yidden don’t comply with this requirement? Almost all Yerayim agree (with very few exceptions) that they are separate from the other non Yerayim communities.
Please help me understand.
Clearheaded:
That is why the Rov has to have his own Rebbe/Rov, who can guide him from the pitfalls.
“But when talking about yirah shomayim, it is completely up to us. As Chazal (I think it think the source for this posuk is Chazal) say everything is in the hands of shomayim with the exception of yiras shomayim.”
Of course. Are you saying that the problems we see with non compliance with Halachic Tznius are due to a lack in Yiras Shomayim?
Akiva:
The Litvish Olam does not Pasken based on the Zohar, when Halacha says it is Mutar.
That is more Chassidish (some! Chassidim, clearheaded)
But the point is valid.
“MO started by followers of The Rav”
I would say anyone who is a talmid of the Rav is MO.
“no, the headgear is an indication of your beliefs and actions”
or what others expect them to be.