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Loyal Jew -“Iced, both things, non-males driving and sitting in the front, are pirtzos of tznius whether your Chassidishe or not.”
I know some Litvishe Farfrumta guys and it’s not just a few – some even Chashuv that don’t drive, but have their wives drive for them. Don’t ask me why they hold like this, but it has to do with their Torah outlook/Tzinus Hashkafa.
Loyal Jew -“What heter can there be to do therapy with a person who you cannot say hello to in the street, who we should rather die than shake hands with?”
What Issur is there in talking to a woman for a purpose?
News flash – There is none. Time to start learning Halacha.
And the therapist doesn’t have to shake the client’s hand – it ain’t part of therapy.
Little that you know -“Let’s address halacha. Yichud is assur. That is halacha psukah. No one can challenge that”
The S’A says Yichud with a married woman is Mutter if her husband is in town.
torah613613torah -“Single women are the kal, married women are the chomer.”
Not when it comes to Yichud and Baalah B’ir. Did you ever learn Hilchos Ishos in S’A?
superstar -“Wait. I don’t understand the difference between a bathroom with a lock and a bedroom with a lock. Why the need for hiding under your blankets?”
That’s exactly my sentiments, without even locking any door. All the guys in Yeshiva think you must hide yourself under a robe or covers and they look at you like a Goy if you don’t. If people would bother looking up the Halacha it says you don’t have to cover yourself in a place where it is a customary to be undressed. It doesn’t say “bathroom”, Mikva, etc. I consider a bedroom the same way as the things I just mentioned. But unfortunately for you, I can only Pasken for myself – so good luck finding a Poisek that will Matter a bedroom for you.
more_2 -“So then what’s the reason?”
Tzinius -Hashem is everywhere.
They might not be able to see, but they sure can scream. They can scream that the whole world can hear when they are cut down.
Sounds like some women I know.
torah613613torah -“Health – I have both education and experience in the psychological field. I have observed many times how young single frum girls invariably end up attracted to their male therapists. I don’t know if it works the other way with young men and female therapists, but I’ve seen it often enough to be very wary.”
I never suggested a single girl should see a male therapist. I said a married woman can. There might be cases where a girl might need a man, but a Shaila should be asked first.
PBA -“torah613613torah is mostly correct.”
Since you said so – it must be.
Gimme a break.
uneeq -“Why is so difficult for some to understand that in general a woman therapist is far from the best option?”
Who doesn’t understand this? But sometimes it’s a necessary thing.
“I will be so brash to say that anyone who was successfully “treated” by a therapist, enjoyed a good relationship with the therapist.”
What’s brash about this?
“Is that part of the issur of Maran, yichud or not? IMO, yes.”
IMO, no – if she is married and so says the S’A. Ever hear of him?
Loyal Jew -“Also, with some kinds of therapy there is negiya.”
I never heard of such a type of therapy, but if there is then obviously you can’t do it.
“Health, the achronim assur all kinds of talking with the other gender even without yichud.”
Name One Shitta that Assurs talking to a woman for a good reason!
I guess when s/o goes out on a date they must communicate with the other party in sign language or by writing notes or nowadays by texting/email.
torah613613torah -“Therapy is usually an intimate experience. You don’t want that kind of bond with someone you’re not going to marry.”
I don’t think you know what “an intimate experience” is. Therapy might develop a bond, but not that kind of a bond.
Do you think each session is like a date and you get closer to the other person in an intimate way? Your post is absurd.
iced -“Shulchan Aruch does not differentiate between yichud with a unmarried woman than yichud with a married woman. And yichud with a married woman is significantly worse. It is forbidden to have yichud with a married woman even if the husband is in town.”
Do you know who the words “Shulchan Aruch” is refering too? It’s the Mechaber or the Rema, not other Achronim. And the Mechaber does differentiate between husband in town or not. While there are Achronim who say this doesn’t always apply – they aren’t the “Shulchan Aruch”.
Before you use an opposite gender therapist a Shaila should be asked. To outright say it’s Ossur is ludicrous.
2scents -“..and this is after you said that you are not a posek.”
I’m not a Poisek, but I can quote S’A.
HIE -“i have visited both yeshivos and spent time in each one and it was clear to me that brick had better guys. Steins is a little on the “flatbushy” side, it seems, while brick is a little more yeshivish and more into learning.”
What do you consider spent time that you decided that Yeshiva D’brick is better? Btw, they have a new name now. Like I said, you’re entitled to your opinion & I’m entitled to mine. Both are good places to learn.
As s/o from out of town -I chuckled at your “on the “flatbushy” side” line. The whole Lakewood is made up of NY’ers.
Btw, I spend much more time in Yeshiva D’Brick than you ever have.
I’m there almost every week and I got to know a lot of the Bochurim, as opposed to s/o like “Lakewood Yungerman” who just learns/t with one or two guys.
MR – When you send the kid to a babysitter out of the home -it doesn’t take a big chunk out of your paycheck.
Chulent -“Hilchos Yichud are still in force when seeing a therapist.”
I don’t know if they are or not -I’m not a Poisek. And I doubt you are either.
But this would only be a problem if the client (woman) wasn’t married.
If the client or the therapist are women & are married and the husband is in the town – then there is no problem of Yichud.
iced -“99+% of the times you’ll never hear about the problem that occured. That is the nature of this beast.”
This post IMHO has to be Denounced. Your insinuations are beyond the pale. Most forbidden relationships never make the 8 O’clock news but to insinuate that this is a common problem amongst therapists is ludicrous. It’s not even a common problem in general amongst Frum people. Let alone s/o who’s license would be on the line. Stop looking for the few cases to say that it’s Ossur to see a therapist from the opposite gender. As a matter of fact, there are cases of bad things occuring with therapists from the same gender. There is this one guy who fled to Israel and has been fighting extradition the last 20 years.
You sound like s/o who doesn’t even believe in therapy in the first place.
AbeF -“i totaly agree with the point of “Health” thats what poped into my head right away…. why cry about someone not giving you????”
It’s actually understandable if she lives in Lakewood like I do.
Most “Men of the House” who live here are supported by “Others”.
And many other Jewish communities the women don’t work out of the house, if at all. In certain communities this has become the “Norm”!
What happenned to the work ethic that we saw from the previous generations? I saw both my parents & both my grandparents working.
twisted -“Farkert, Health, she should go for the gorilla suit. It makes a statement, is definitely style, and think how easy the conversation will flow.”
I hear your point, but would YOU go out a second time if your date showed up in a gorilla suit?
WIY -“Wear something with color. Black is soooooo boring, and you will come off as boring and yeshivish like all those boring yeshivish girls that always wear black.”
Now I was always under the impression that the reason they wear black is because it’s slenderizing. In other words they look thinner than they are. We all know that in our day and age -obesity is a big problem in both genders.
pink vaultz -“I am a 35 year old married female who has tried 4 different female therapists and could not connect to any of them. I am thinking I should try a male therapist now.”
Let me tell you something. Therapy is like a Shidduch – you need a good Shadchan. An org. called Relief does a great job of matching people to therapy. They will ask you about your illness and/or problems and they will try to match you to an appropiate therapist. The therapist can be either male or female.
2scents –
“Health,
I do not think that you can compare therapy to a doctors visit. A Doctors exam is objective, its not in any way similar to a therapy session.
With therapy, the therapist will discuss the clients emotions and feelings, there is a lot of room for personal relationship.”
I understand your point. (This may be a first.)
Anyways I’ve had to do with a lot of therapists – Medicine & mental health get intertwined a lot. I’ll explain what I meant about specializing. I know this female therapist who deals with certain types of Taavos, not going to mention what they are in a public forum. Anyways she’s Frum & she gets a lot of referrals from Rabbonim for Frum males. Why? Because in the NY area there are no Frum males, at least that people know about, that deal with these issues. In other words, these people need to have a Frum therapist who understands the Halacha as opposed to a Goyishe therapist. So she gets stuck with these males, but she is able to help them. The same with many Frum therapists I know – they deal with certain types of illness that opposite genders need help in and they can’t find elsewhere.
Q: What do i wear on first date?
A: Clothes, not a gorilla suit.
Seriously, it really depends on the guy. The MO crowd – the couple dresses casual, but nice. The Yeshivishe crowd – the couple dresses like on Shabbos.
frumnotyeshivish -“Health – you are getting defensive but missing the point. The question was about a client – not a professional. When a client is choosing a therapist, should the gender of the therapist be a factor in the decision?”
No, I didn’t “Miss the point”. I don’t think anyone has to start a post saying – should I go to an opposite gender professional instead of a same gender one. This is commonsense. If all things are equal -why wouldn’t the person stay with their own gender? The answer is, at least I think people here have commonsense, that the OP and others have an agenda. They want to look down on others – so they come here supposedly asking innocent questions like -“What do the users of the CR think about a girl seeing a male therapist or vice versa?”
The answer that I gave was that in the real world most therapists or other professionals specialize in different areas -this is why you see Many Frum professionals seeing opposite genders. No people – they are not Goyim.
To illustrate -they have had topics here whether women will only see female OB’s or male ones. A lot of Frum women said they prefer the male ones and obviously they feel not e/o who practices medicine are always equal and that’s why they go to the male OB’s. This is what happens in mental health too. This is why Frum people go to opposite gender therapists and this is why Frum therapists will take opposite gender clients.
Pro Israel and Orthodox –
I believe they had no choice. They need the US and their money. If they say -ok we’ll have a cease fire and the arabs (Not Palestinians) in Gaza break it -they can finally go in and when the Antisemitic world – Russia, Iran, Turkey, Egypt start screaming the EU & US can shut them up and say they tried.
I’d only agree with you if they do the same thing as last time and allow some attacks until it escalates to where it is now.
No attacks period -No excuses!
MR -“Health: interesting. I never really thought about it. My husband says that they refuse to believe that the other children are not religious though. They can literally whip out a cell phone on shabbos and his parents will pretend not to see. They are modern they keep shabbos, I wouldn’t necessarily think that is why they treat us differently. Maybe because we have a child and the other kids don’t? Who knows its just hard! Thank you all for your advice.”
I meant everything I posted with a full heart. Take my advice to heart. I was married to s/o who didn’t come from a religious background. I learnt the hard way how they perceive Frum Yeshivishe people. Not all are like this, but there are plenty.
Forewarned is forearmed.
It’s commonplace that even Frum therapists see opposite gender clients and I’m sure they do this with Rabbonim’s okay.
Many therapists specialize and the help that individuals need is sometimes special. So it ends up that most therapists have opposite gender clients.
I sometimes wonder about some posters here -Do you just sit in front of your computers all day on your thrones and decide e/o out there is doing something wrong? How about going out once in awhile and seeing the world? Yes, Professionals deal with e/o even if they are Not the same gender.
MR -The fact that they won’t help out is because they think a religious life is stupid.
Two suggestions that might sound harsh:
1. Go back to work and leave the kid by a babysitter, not a nanny (which is expensive), even if not ideal.
2. Minimize your Shaychus with them. You can get together for Yom Tovim and such, but avoid things like social visits and holidays that you might be invited for, eg. Thanksgiving.
They really don’t respect you or your way of life. You don’t have to seek revenge, but you don’t have to go out of your way to give them Kovod either.
2scents -“You can call me what ever you want. I am no con artist and do not play with words. I have written more than once that each and every organization should be open for criticism.
The fact that i have asked why you would bash hatzoloh, does not mean that hatzoloh should not be criticized when they do something wrong.
What i have written was not pointed directly at you, rather to people in general who bash and talk negative about hatzoloh without even knowing what really goes on.”
I’m sorry -I agree with BPM. If s/o comes here and makes a statement that noone should bash Hatzolah when noone here went on a diatribe about them, it means basicaly you don’t have that right to criticize them. The fact that you’re now singing a different tune -doesn’t change the original meaning of your post.
To post that and now say you were talking about those who don’t know what’s really going on – what made you think that the posters here didn’t know what’s going on? This was your projection.
The same thing to project that s/o is complaining because they didn’t get on the VAS is also wrong.
To illustrate -let’s say I decide a poster is a killer and I surmount this in a post -this would be wrong because I have no reason to assume this and if I’d be attacked by posters here, it would be rightfully so.
So BPM has every right to call them whatever he chooses because they had no right to express such an opinion because they didn’t like his posts. There was no logical reason for them to come to such a conclusion.
Your Neigous to why you’re always right is astounding. It’s funny how you can’t even begin to see the other side!
2scents -“You are right, this is a very common, so common that you do so on a continues basis.
You always make sure to take a shot at the poster, be it this thread or other threads without posting anything with real substance.”
What you just did is Mischapad B’klon Chaveiro -if you know what this means. Second of all, almost all the times I do it is in a defense of a personal attack on me. Have I ever started an attack? Probably, but it’s much rarer nowadays. So, I’ll Dan you L’caf Zecus -that you just see my negative posts without realizing almost always it’s a defense from a personal attack on me. So your opinion on me is wrong.
Yeshivishsocrates1 – My advice to you is to be honest, not overly dramatic. Present the truth.
I did some research on the net for you from reputable sites.
The amount of caffiene varies greatly amongst these drinks. Red Bull (8oz) has less caffiene than a cup of Joe -about 80mg. An 8 oz cup of coffee can have about 130mg.
Caffeine overdose for some people can start as little as 200-300 mg per day. In other words upto this amount is basically a safe amount you can consume.
Some “energy” drinks have 350 mg/can.
Caffiene, like any drug, you can develop a tolerance to. These people can handle upto 600mg/day. Therefore one can of these high caffiene drinks don’t send them to the hospital. Even if you can handle 600mg a day because your body got used to such a high amt., it’s not recommended to ingest this amt. on a daily basis.
BPM -Well said.
There is a common phenomenon in the world of when s/o wants to disagree and they don’t have any or anymore proof then they attack the other side personally. We in the Frum and Yeshivishe world also succumb to this. I’m sure I’ve fallen into this also at times, but at least I know it’s wrong. A lot of posters don’t even realize what they are doing is wrong. Like I said, this is so common in discussions even in the Frum world that people have no clue that you must stick to the actual subject(s) and personal attacks don’t make you right or anymore right.
Yeshivishsocrates1 -First of all -it’s a misnomer -there are No ingredients in these drinks that give energy. It’s just the drug caffeine -a lot more than a cup of Joe.
Question of the day: Why are these drinks worse than smoking cigs -which is the norm by lots of guys in certain Yeshivos?
dmez – Unfortunately the Zionists like to claim any Jew living in EY is an Israeli citizen, even if born in Palestine. I knew Yerushalmies that were upset with this -they weren’t born in Israel and they didn’t want to become Israeli citizens, but the Zionist Gov. considered them citizens anyway.
iced -“Morals are solely defined by the Torah. Non-Jewish “morals” have no role to play in a Jews life.
And if a legal monetary benefit assists in Limud HaTorah, there can be nothing more moral than engaging in that.”
You’re wrong. Many Gedolim disagree with the Lakewood way of life. I’m not saying the Lakewood way of life is wrong, but it’s not the only Shitta.
shlishi -“Will H really do anything if a member of the public documents abuse and presents it to them? And how can it be submitted to H?”
I’m sorry to inform you – they won’t do anything. Don’t waste your time. My suggestion is document it and post it in this topic (or start a new topic) -this will get their attention. The first thing they’ll do is try to pressure YWN to shut the topic down. If this doesn’t work they might actually do something to avoid public embarassment.
“Also, if the abuse is driving illegally (as opposed to parking) while not on call, it is almost impossible to document it with photographs.”
I posted this before -this is the way to document it. You don’t need photos. You do need a scanner, though. If you see a guy using L & S and going through traffic and/or a red light, note his vehicle -make/model/color and take down his plate -along with date & time. Also note what org. he’s a member of – it will be somewhere visible in or around the car, at least it should be. You’ll have to be listening to the scanner the whole time – so if there are no calls recently (at least 15 -20 min) being put out in this area from that org. – you can be fairly sure that this guy is doing abuse. Without the scanner, they’ll just say – he was on a call and it got cancelled.
shnitzy -“health-y?!”
As long as it’s once in awhile. You mentioned ice cream pie -If it’s the pareve kind -there ain’t nothing healthy in it, at least meat has some nutrition.
barbequed steak that was grilled to perfection.
nishtdayngesheft -“There is a small measure of satisfaction”
I’m glad that you’re satisfied, but I hope that this doesn’t play into any Ch’vs Gaivah that you might have.
Kinda makes me wonder why s/o would even pick such a SN – basically you’re telling e/o – Nothing is your Business – Don’t shake the boat and do what you’re told.
You see – I can psychoanalyze you too – just like you did to me.
I try to do what I’m told also, but from what Hashem writes in his Torah, not because it’s PC.
RB -Whatever life I have it includes an English vocabulary.
How about getting a vocab also? This way you can communicate with others.
more_2 -“I dunno about seminaries, but the Yeshiva Bochurim should not leave. The more people learning – the more Zecusim for EY. Years ago, when there was a war -it was commonplace to cancel Bain Hazmanim -in order to have more learning going on.
This is what happens when you don’t make Histadlus. There was a reason why Hashem gave them Gaza and the West Bank in the first place. Hashem gave them this to be a buffer against the Arabs. I doubt you can even find one Shitta that says you can just pull out without even a promise of something in Return. They are Kofey Tova against Hashem.
Mr. Doniel -“I am not hurting anymore, did what a posek told me to do, and put it in HaShem’s hands. If someone decides to do something to ruin their lives, it is not my problem, since I did what I was ethically and halakhically obligated to do.
The negative comments directed towards me assume that Judaism makes no obligation of arevus upon its adherents. In the words of Kayin, I am my brother’s keeper. Halakha takes the back seat to secular ideas about proper conduct and psychobabble.”
I guess you didn’t read my comments before -here they are again:
“One last point to prove my theory -why did your friends/Rabbis even tell you about this guy in the first place? There was absolutely No Toieles to tell you. If for some reason they had a good intention, they would have contacted her family directly. If they didn’t know how to, they could have just asked you how to contact them without giving you the reason why they had to!”
So yes Doniel -you didn’t do what the Torah said. All our “secular ideas about proper conduct and psychobabble” is actually the Torah way. Too bad that this is beyond you.
You didn’t have the right to listen to LH about this guy in the first place. Yes Arvous exists, and it was the job of your friends/Rabbis to pass it on directly. This had nothing to do with you. Your Negious prevents you from seeing what the Torah actually required over here.
nishtdayngesheft -“It seems someone is broigus that he was not considered by hatzola even though he is a self described expert. Shows me that hatzola certainly has standards. And probably qualifications in addition to just passing an emt course.”
Do you read minds? How do you know why I’m Broigus? You also don’t know the definition of standards and qualifications – perhaps look it up in a dictionary?
“All I know is that I see dedicated volunteers that give up of themselves continually and they have saved thousands of lives, all for no pay.”
Exactly and that’s what most people “know”. Sorry to disturb your little dream world! You can go back to sleep now.
“That’s what I have seen with my eyes. What I have also seen are bitter illogical comments by posters who are the same.”
And your eyes are correct – because why? Do you also proclaim to be a “self described expert”? You should look up the word illogical also because you don’t know the meaning. Nothing I posted was illogical. You might not agree with my opinion, but it doesn’t make it illogical.
“There may be things that are not perfect, but in my eyes they are a lot more perfect than you.”
Oh, I’m not perfect and I never thought I was, but tell me, since you’re the expert on Hatzolah (perhaps even a member, cooridnator), what are the “things that are not perfect” about them?
mewho – “I still see the same bullying coming from one specific poster.”
What?? Only you’re allowed to bully others?
“No matter the subject this one person feels to know it all and no one else can come close.”
Now, you’re starting to speak the truth!
“Perhaps that attitude is what kept this poster off of Hatzolah.”
I would tell you the real reason, but I’m not the least bit interested in your opinion of me!
“A little bit of humble pie is a good thing.”
So about practicing what you preach?
gefen -“Health – I came here CURSING others????????? I’m dissing organizations??????? Chas V’Shalom! Are you for real?????? Obviously you really don’t understand my posts or read them all the way through.”
Maybe You don’t read your Own posts?!?!
You call this a compliment?!? –
“What a let down! Yes, we are happy to donate to our local chesed fund – no question about that. But that we do anyway. Here we really wanted to help our fellow Jews in NY. I’m from NY. It just felt like a slap in the face!”
When s/o accuses others of wrongdoing that never occurred – this is called putting down others – whether you’ll admit it or not.
Syag Lchochma -“You seem to have left out a line”
I left it out on purpose.
gefen -“Health – I’m so glad ur in a position to judge that I am WRONG.”
I’m in that position because I can see the orgs. POV. I was hoping that you would too, but I guess Not. I definitely tried to explain it numerous times.
“Just a word of advice (I know, I know – you don’t need my advice)-calm down- ur getting all heated up and getting nasty. Be careful so you can continue to use the name health because you can chas v’shalom compromise ur health if ur blood pressure goes up. CHILL!”
Just a word of advice from me (I know, I know – you don’t need my advice), before you start coming on a public forum to Diss orgs. who are trying their best -how about Danning these Orgs. L’caf Zecus? Perhaps there is a good reason why they didn’t accept used goods?
“btw – I don’t care where you grew up. You do need an attitude adjustment.”
I don’t think I’m the one who came to YWN and started a topic cursing out others, even if you were subtle. So perhaps this “attitude adjustment” is really Kol Hapoisel B’momo Poisel?
“In times like this, we should be working on ben adam l’chaveiro.”
I agree. So about looking in the mirror first?
R-B – I’m not going to repeat all your quotes, because it’s redundant. (Another word you could look up.)
Let me explain the obvious -since you didn’t comprehend it.
When I posted -“Why are you answering for him?” -I didn’t mean he isn’t allowed to, just that he didn’t have the right answer/reason why you posted. It’s called a rhetorical question.
(You can look up this word also.)