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Because blind faith is not how humans were created to operate. We are supposed to think critically about things we are told. Because if that same authority figure tells you to do something wrong you should be using your free will as discernment so you don’t end up doing something you shouldn’t. I’m not saying rabbanim intend for that, and I can respect our respect for them. And honestly putting rabbanim aside because that’s a whole different topic. I think as sovereign individuals we shouldn’t be moving towards tyranny in any of our dealings with life as we are the sole bearer of our choices and also the sole bearer of the consequences of said choices, you can’t delegate your free will to someone else and then think we are exempt from the consenquences of your own choices. We can listen to sense and then decipher and do what is right.
I’m just curious do you follow anything anyone else says blindly in any other context? No, I don’t think so.We are all naturally connected to the Devine by existing and he’s not going to ask the same thing from each of us because each person has their own unique journey that’s why when a socioty conforms to the same ideal they are denying themselves the unique journey god chose for them.
You don’t need “intention” to serve the Devine. I sometimes think you don’t know who God is and your not connected to God at all but serving something else that’s trying to control your life force and make you lose your free will. These are not biblical morals.Self sacrifice is a still a sacrifice on an alter of “intention” or “service” “greater good” or “conformity” these are all alters. And these alters block you from an actual relationship with your true creator
Ashregg how do you know what each person’s individual purpous is. Are you a navi. Only the person themslevs can know that or someone with that ability to see.
Every person has a different purpous lol.
Look at Moshe then look at avraham avinu, then look at soloman, then look at rus.
How do you know what each person’s path is. You don’t.
Again intention comes from the heart and alignment you can’t force yourself to feel something you don’t feel
Saying “without that intention” your saying you need to create that intention which thus is being disingenuous people will connect when they feel called to it. Not because they have to or are supposed to or are told to. Otherwise it’s called self deception.
“The only way to serve hashem is with intention to serve him”
People serve God cuz they feel connected to God because of all the amazing things god calls them to do or does for them.
It’s not because they put themselves on the back burner and sell themselves to some higher diety. This is litterally starting to sound like self sacrifice which is called idolitryAlso ashregg Theres alot of interpetations of the Torah, by virtue of all the arguments in the talmud so people are very capable of giving over information that isn’t in alignment with the heart of the message. And therfore human error can very easily be part of the system, especially when the message can be more fear based then what the original content implied. But whatever you want to believe
Again that is true. But your using them as an authority on Torah. It’s all authority.
Again, there is intention, which comes from the heart then there is intention to gain spiritual access which is esoteric at it’s root, which has roots in sorcery. I understand your point but what I’m saying is that God cares about you. You are important to Him, so your life and your unique journey is the center, of His will, as is the will of the whole picture. They can both be true at the same time. Thats how ultimate God is that He can use little old us to serve His purposes while fulfilling our immediate needs which is litterly a huge part of our lives. Unless you believe you don’t exist at all and your needs don’t matter at all
Or it’s just a corrupted system and everybody plays into it. Kudos to all the leaders
The escooters is good sense everything else is opinion
Ok. So try and change the rich. I’ll be waiting. Second the fact that everyone fallows the leader is so imiture. Lol. Maybe people should grow a backbone. Third I see where you are coming from but why can’t _you_ set an example as well. The same way other people can set an example so can you
“Ritual Precision, magical spells required exact pronunciation of prayers and precise physical actions; even a minor error could invalidate the ritual”
Hmm wonder what this sounds like. Practicing ceremonial magic alters a person’s conscience and connects them to estoric forces that separate a person from God“Ceremonial magic is classified as occult”
“The occult is considered anti-biblical because it is viewed as a rebellion against the creators sovereignty, attempting to gain hidden knowledge or power through means explicitly forbidden in the Torah. Torah texts, such as Deuteronomy 18:10-12 and Leviticus 20:27, categorize practices like divination, sorcery, and spiritism as abominations or detestable acts that open individuals to demonic influence and deception”
(Which is true)Key reasons for this condemnation
Bypassing God’s Authority: Occult practices are seen as an attempt to circumvent God’s revealed will and manifested will. seeking control over the future or spiritual realms independently of God.
Spiritual Deception: Scripture warns that these practices are often fraudulent illusions or manifestations of demonic powers, leading believers away from the true God toward spiritual destruction
Ok so tread carefully when you talk about “intention” these are occult concepts.
“Ceremonial magic, often termed high magic, constitutes a structured esoteric tradition characterized by elaborate rituals, symbolic implements, and invocations designed to access higher spiritual realms and facilitate theurgic operations, which emphasize divine union and spiritual elevation, in contrast to goetia, which involves the compulsion of lower spirits for material ends.[8] This practice relies on precise ceremonial frameworks to “”””align the practitioner’s consciousness”””””” (intention) with transcendent forces, distinguishing it from more improvisational forms of magic through its emphasis on disciplined invocation and symbolic precision.
Aka sorcery. Not everything you do with intention is good
God can litterally interconnect all things including using your life for the bigger picture without you having to focus on. That’s how great God is that He can move all moving parts and every single creation can get what they need while also playing into the bigger design of things lol. It’s not your responsibility to play that part
Ashregg, first of all I thought nevuah is obselete so how can you say daas Torah is Devine knowledge, second those people are still human and can err. Only God doesn’t err. So are you placing them as the Same level as God.
Also how Is daas Torah different then authority, they are autheoritivly telling you their psak and you use them as an authority figure. Not sure how you mean it’s different their inherinitly the same thing.
Nobody has monopoly on the truth.
If someone’s human they can err. If they look like you they can err just like you. Cuz they are you just with different beliefs?You are the center and the goal your life is gods responsibility and his love for you means he cares about all your woes, pain and suffering and he’s looking out for you. You can be the goal and everybody can be the goal and that all at the same time can play into the bigger picture as well. That’s how amazing God is that he can do all things and everything can play into each other with all its moving parts exactly as is. Do you believe God can do that cuz he can
Ashregg “we believe in spirituality and the essence of spirituality is intention”
Your sure you don’t believe in sorcery cuz that’s what sorcery is. If your not familiarFlaming otd. It sounds nice on paper what your saying
But there are times where emotion, which is feminine needs to be balanced by logic which is masculine and boundaries
Not everything can be about feeling sometimes things need to be about doing what is neccisary even if it hurts.
These people aren’t running away from a war or the holocaust they are actually being payed by special interests with fake promises, to flood America, on purpous. Lol to take over to affect the national elections.
This is not people fleeing a difficult situation this is a deliberate takeover by special intrets for whatever political agenda they have. America first.Honestly I see both sides, they both have merit, on one hand this world has gotten so extreme in the teenage scene I think there’s merit to say that it’s become unacceptable,
On the other hand we preach lashon hara all day, so publicly bashing a store is technically hypocritical and the whole thing sounds like a cliquey us versus them, secret board room meeting where 2 people decided, with bad faith to get back at someone.
The intent feels cliquey and self serving.
I’ve been in plenty of situations where people would put their heads together and ignore me, even tho they barely knew me which, was extremely cruel and immature, so that’s what this feels like.*Abraham ( spell check)
Chaim everything is faith based. Lol. It doesn’t matter what your doing you need faith. Especially when your in a situation of extreme conformity and control you need superhuman straighth to _be yourself_ despite the naysayers. That takes tremendous faith. If you want to call it faith in yourself. faith in your conviction. Or just faith in God. You can call it that. But you need faith to do what is right.
The collective has alot of control.
Imagine you lived in a collective society of idolitry, like Abraham avinu, and you decided its bs, you think Abraham wasn’t scared when he broke the idols….his father’s anger I’m sure made him afraid but he was driven by conviction and understood what is right. He also stood in opposition to everything those times stood for.
What about noach who built the tevah for 300 years. He was fighting against a degenerate socioty that laughed at him but he had faith in his conviction and faith in the truth.
Doing what is right is never going to be easy. Especially when the collective asks us to drive ourselves insane to conform.
It’s like a very domineering employer who has absolute control….now imagine multitudes and multides of those domineering people. There is fear there. Tremendous fear. But the opposite of fear is faith. That is the anecdoteKoifer bikur so? Doesn’t make it correct sorry
Chaim. Honestly I get where you are coming from again, but your digging your own grave and waiting for others to change. That’s never going to happen ever.
I actually feel like I’m butchering the whole intention thing because in many scenarios like tefillah for example if I change my intent to fit someone else’s objective I’m inherinitly not praying with my true intentions.
So there are many scenarios where you are correct and many scanarios where I am correct. I guess the circumstances matterAlso, the intent of something is true, your right about that.
But when you come into a scanario already deciding what intent your supposed to have, then your not being truthful. Your forcing yourself to align to a belief system
Intent and true intent is already within the framework of circumstances and also, giving tzedakah, whether you give with a specific intent or you don’t the action is still the exact same.
I think tho that intent matters to God yes. But not because your forcing yourself but because God take into account, let’s say if you did something stupid, God takes into account the heart of man, which means for the right intentions there is more mercy.
But the actions, and the consequences of actions are the same
If I drove off a cliff, and I had good intentions I still drove off a cliff and now I need to live with those choicesYour confusing alot of what I’m saying. The self is used to serve God. You are a conduit and through your feelings consciounce wellbeing, wisdom understanding and discernment, you can decipher what needs to be done at any given moment. In all your circumstances. You cannot detract the self from reality. Both play into the other. having the Torah as a guide, especially when all it’s arigorical stories teach us many lessons of life it helps guide the self through reality as is.
Everyone keeps saying “i serve myself”
No I use myself as a conduit because I was created to do so. That means if I don’t agree with something I don’t have to agree with it. Most times thats because we were designed for discernment.
We are also saying the exact same thing about prayer.
I’m not sure intention changes the essence of an action,
I see your point to a degree, but if I feel something, changing my feelings about it thus becomes disingenuous lol.
So if I go into prayer feeling a certain way but I change it for an outside belief system because I need to have better “intentions” that’s borderline sorcery.
You don’t really know what sorcery is but it’s the use of intention to change realityAshregg
If I told you something you disagree with and you fallow it because i have some “authority” erm that will lead to resentment honestly because I feel I have no choice even tho I possibly disagree with it.
Even tho I understand why we must fallow without questioning, obviously cuz clearly that’s the ultimate virtue disagreeing with authority doesn’t mean you disrespect them just means you don’t see eye to eye.
I think people constantly take difference of oppinon as an “affront” or disrespect but that’s not the base intention. It’s just….I see your viewpoint, but I think, my viewpoint makes more sense.
I don’t want to get in going against “daas Torah” but in any other scenario, if someone gave us a final verdict and we see things from a much different perspective, would you call that disrespecting authority or would you call that….simply having a different opinion and doing what you feel makes the most sense.
I think anytime you give up your free will to an authority figure and especially if you don’t see eye to eye with that authority figure. your chaining your life to something that isn’t in alignment with your own virtue.
Whoa responsibility is it to choose? Yours or someone’s else’s. Yours.
In the same breadth I think, are you saying humans do not err?
And what if that human errs will you still follow them?I’m not sure why you believe that worshiping God means disconnecting from yourself and authenticity…lol your prayers come from your voice and your voice comes from within and your emotions is what drives the need to reach out to God. Lol
Do you ask people for help when you don’t need it?
Or do you speak when you need to speak and reach out when you need to reach out, do you appreciate what someone does for you when they haven’t done anything for you or do you have a deep feeling of appreciation and respect when they do something good for you.
Relationship is inherint in our way of life. If you can have a relationship with yourself, a relationship with others not sure why the rules suddenly changes when it comes to your creator.
I’m just wondering what connection really means if there is no real connection and it’s based off dogma and what your sapoosed to do.
Let’s translate that belief to how a friend treats you, they don’t want to connect but they do so out of obligation,
Isn’t that somewhat foolish.
They ask for things they don’t need and you give it to them
Um what?
A real relationship, one that is authentic can only happen when your friend listens to themslevs and asks and speaks when they need to not when they don’t.
That’s true connection otherwise it’s _control_
See?Ahregg the thing about Harvard is elite. That means their a bunch of snobs and everybody that goes there are snobs. Our yeshivos are not supposed to be Harvard.
Lets look at what elitists mentality really is:“An elitist mentality is widely criticized for fostering arrogance, social division, and a lack of empathy toward those outside the privileged group. By believing they are inherently superior, elitists often engage in condescension and exclusion, which creates hostile environments and marginalizes others. This mindset can also stifle innovation by resisting new ideas that challenge the status quo and lead to groupthink among like-minded individuals.
Furthermore, elitism is associated with immaturity and entitlement, where individuals seek validation through superiority rather than genuine human connection. This attitude can damage personal and professional relationships, as elitists are perceived as insensitive and dismissive of diverse perspectives and struggles. In broader societal contexts, it undermines trust in institutions and leadership, as the focus on maintaining high status often comes at the expense of the common good”
This is biblical?
Is this how our forbears expected us to act. Is this how they acted? I don’t think soThe little I know
Honestly I’m disgusted…lol everything is image. There’s no humanity left. Humanity is dead. What in the elite is thisAlso doing bad things in the name of good causes comes with alot of suffering. We reap what we sow and it translates to a lot of internal suffering, missed opportunities etc etc.
The system is as difficult as we have made it. We, chose this. By lack of faith. And by lack of humanity. SorryYour standing in a river and you need to grow, that means having faith and jumping into the river. Across the river is your freedom but your so scared of what everybody will think your stuck.
Stop. Put your faith in God not people. God gives everyone the streinghth to do what needs to be done despite what the naysayers say. Your like frozen in fear.
Who is your God? People? Socioty? Social norms? These are idols. they are blinding you from reaching out to your Devine creator and relying on Him for your courage and relying on him for your self concept, and self esteem.Chaim _you_ choose your life.
Your letting socioty dictate what you choose.
I know countless of people that choose to live outside the box and their incredible happy and oh their wedding have much much more joy because it’s authentic. So stay stuck. And miserable. Noone cares at this pointI also think when you say intention matters? Focus matters?
So what about yourself. You don’t need anything anything at all. And are those intentions authentic or are they forced. Lol cuz if your intentions are forced their fake. And fake prayers aren’t in alignment with true needs and therefore don’t get answered or simply aren’t exactly what is neccisary truly for the moment.
And I don’t know if I agree that intention matters. Life isn’t witchcraft or something where everything is about control and “intent” those are esoteric sorcery. Which biblically disconnect a person from the DevineYes telling people to have more faith will translate into action. Hello. And I mean have more faith in people, have more faith in the process. Stop making everything up to how much you control the situation. This leads to abject cruelty and dehumnizition of others for political, selfish gains. It’s wrong full stop. Where else in life is it ok to dehumanize people for personal gain. I think we think oh its ok now cuz I’m getting my own ends. It’s still not ok