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Mammele: Chas Veshalom to force anyone to have their picture taken/publicized if they don’t want it. Then again, sometimes society forces them (I didn’t want to have pictures taken at my Bar Mitzvah but I had to so all of my relatives could see). This is nothing about forcing women to appear in pictures. This is about allowing pictures of them to be shown if they so wish it.
MDG: At the Rema’s time, an Ashkenazi community in E”Y (had such a thing existed) also would not have Duchaned daily. Any Chiluk between CHU”L and E”Y is post facto explanation for something that obviously has a much simpler one.
Mammele: Honestly, I don’t think it’s appropriate to even have engagement pictures, but that’s an issue for another time.
There are dividing concerns. There is a lack of Tznius to tell the world that you got engaged. And there is a Maaleh in being able to inform your friends and well-wishers that something good happened. Lema’aseh, the world holds that you tell everyone. Whether I feel uncomfortable about that doesn’t change that it would be very rude to hide it.
Joseph: I disagree. The point is there are things that are normal to be visible. A pinky is normal and not a violation of Tznius. Nevertheless, it’s an Issur Chamur for someone to look at it with inappropriate intent. I would say that a Tznius picture should be the exact same. It’s normal, it can exist, but it’s Assur for a man to use improperly.
DY: What’s fascinating is that we don’t hold Kol Yirael Bnei Melachim.
charlie: One does not need to be a Navi to see a very likely outcome.
RIETS is unhappy at some of what goes on in those YC classes. And everyone in YU stays away from “higher criticism”. I would venture a guess that a Rov of YCT students have at least dabbled in it.
Joseph: Because you’re misreading the Mechaber. It’s Assur to look in order to get Hana’ah. Nowhere does the Mechaber (who’s quoting a Gemara) say that the pinky being visible is inherently “looking in order to get Hana’ah”.
HaKatan: Really? Because I think a Gemara in Sotah says the same thing as #4.
DY: I hear that. Then again, it works both ways. If, Lema’aseh, there is continuity 50 years from now (which I am highly doubting), that lends an air of authenticity to it.
LF: See Yam Shel Shlomo Bava Kama 4:9. Several Achronim comment that we don’t hold like that, as evidenced by how we printed the Gemara.
B1g B0y: Not quite. That’s only in regards to Halachos of Devarim Shebikdusha. That doesn’t make people attracted to them which therefore means they don’t have an obligation to be Tzanua.
Oh, and you’re wrong. The Mishnah Brurah says three. The Chazon Ish gives a few extra years.
charlie: To quote several major Rabbonim, in two to three generations they won’t be following any Halachah at all. If that turns out not to be true, they’ll probably be more or less accepted-but-not-really-spoken-about in the rest of the Frum world. (Kinda like the average “Modern Orthodox” person’s relationship with the super-right-wing Yeshivish world. For all people like Joseph and others talk about how YU and MO is treif and whatnot, Yeshivish people still trust their Kashrus and count them for a minyan and stuff.) I don’t expect them to stay Frum, much like the conservative movement went. If they prove it’s possible, though, then maybe they will need to be accepted. (This is all assuming that things like academic Bible and Talmud like most OO are more into don’t lead to there being wholesale denial of Ikkarei Emunah. If that happens, it doesn’t matter how many Halachos they keep or how well they do them.)
DY: What do you think of the paragraph I just wrote?
Not sure who in particular. And the Rambam doesn’t use Lo Sochlu as an Asmachta. He calls it a Lav Shenitan L’azharas Misas Beis Din. The Ramban and other Rishonim ask major questions on this and why it’s not an Azhara Shebichlalos, among other things.
I believe the way the Achronim say it (quoting the Rambam) is that it’s Kim Lei because the Azhara is Lo Sochlu Al HaDam. So the Chiyuv to pay back money (until then he could just give back the food) comes at the same time as the Lav that brings with it a Chiyuv Misah.
akuperma: I don’t think that’s so true. Chareidim, other than the biggest Talmidei Chachamim, never really look at Seforim written by D”L Rabbonim.
To answer the original question, no one fights like brothers. The closer two things are, the wider rifts even small differences create.
No one really understands how the reasons are sufficient but we can’t change the Minhag.
I have met several Maharats. Some are Orthodox. Some aren’t. I would trust the Kashrus of all of the ones I’ve met, though. (Some of the ones who have published stuff online I definitely wouldn’t trust their Kashrus, though.)
Joseph: Maybe you should look up the Chazon Ish before you say that.
Avram: Baruch Hashem there are very few communities (really nowhere else) that have had OO try to take over like in the Silver Spring/DC area. And the big Shul went with a YU Rabbi B”H and OO is probably slowly losing the fight there.
Joseph: I don’t need to say anything. Look at the Chazon Ish on the beginning of Chullin.
yytz: Only because we couldn’t afford it. The Gemara implies that it’s best to eat meat as much as possible.
Joseph: Before the Kusim worshiped a dove, they rejected Torah Sheba’al Peh. And yet their Shechitah was still Kosher and they did not make win Assur by touching it (until they worshiped the dove).
Joseph: The Kusim also denied basic tenets of our faith. The Chazon Ish goes to great lengths to explain why they weren’t treated like Apikorsim.
Joseph: There is a far gap between being Orthodox and being heretics. They can be not-Orthodox and still count for a Minyan, not make win Assur, etc. You have to explain how they’re worse than the Kusim in the time of Chazal (see the beginning of Chullin, for example).
Shailah: If a woman sings a song to get RCA Rabbis to like Maharat, are they allowed to listen to it?
Tshuvah: Kol Isha is Muttar nowadays because we are used to hearing women sing.
Health: I try to stay informed. 🙂
zogt: If I was told correctly, over 700 Yeshivah students signed a petition to shut down the newspaper because of that (and similar issues). It has always been a representation of the most liberal wing and not accurately represented the student body. (True story, in the 1940s or whenever it was, the Commentator wrote an article attacking Rav Soloveitchik for being a shill of the Agudah who would destroy YU.)
Why would R’ Schachter have to say anything? He’s been saying Open Orthodoxy is Conservative for years. This won’t cause a problem within YU. The RCA statement last week about female Smichah caused a bit of a controversy (and by “a bit of a controversy” I mean that some on YU’s left-most wing were upset by it for technical reasons and only a very small few disagreed with the substance), but this won’t cause anything there. Every YU Rosh Yeshivah agrees with it and probably at least 80% of the Talmidim (maybe even over 90%) do. And that rate is close to 100% within Smichah.
Is Health insinuating that “Yeshiva” people are, by definition, not Sefardi? You might want to clarify that, Health.
As DY pointed out, it would have been nothing about them. Anyway, I’m done with this thread.
…the very best, like no one ever was.
I’m not gonna comment because it would get deleted anyway, but trust me, I have a good response to these things.
Of course R’ Moshe was against all prenups. The only prenups that existed in his time told you to go to Conservative Batei Din.
I’ve always wondered about this. I have always thought that there should be a Chiluk between a latecomer saying Borchu (in essense, being Pores Al Shma according to some Shittos) and randomly saying Borchu at the end of Davening whether or not there were any latecomers, which is the Minhag in EY.
old man: I was told it’s not borrowed from the Sephardim. It’s the Shittah of the Gra. Many Minhagim in E”Y are against what was standardly practiced in Ashkenaz because the Talmidim of the Gra were the first to come there.
Excellence: Are you looking for Gedolim who openly claim to be able to tell both the veracity of someone else’s dream and the definitive meaning of that purported dream? Because I really don’t think any of those exist.
I dunno. But I’m pretty sure YUTorah has recordings of all of the traditional Nuschaos for different Davenings.
My personal favorite (I made up myself): The Gematria of Challah (43) is equal to the number of times the Kohen Gadol sprinkles blood on Yom Kippur.
Cute Drashos from the Gematria of “Challah” bother me, though. What we take off isn’t called “Challah” in Chumash. That’s a Rabbinic term, presumably just borrowed from colloquial usage (though that is a Machlokes Achronim, I believe between the Nodah Bihudah and Abudraham, among others). So I’d find it strange for the “meaning” of the Mitzvah to come from something that the Mitzvah would later me called.
None of this should apply to Challas Chutz La’aretz anyway (certainly nowadays), which is just so we remember that the concept of Challah exists.
It is a minority opinion in the Gemara that non-Jews do not impart Tumas Ohel. It’s a pretty even split in Rishonim. People have different readings as to how exactly the Shulchan Aruch Paskens. All in all, it’s as much of an even split as you’ll find in any Sugya. But it’s pretty clear that at least Lechatchilah Kohanim should be Machmir on this.
I agree with Wolf. That’s why the Gemara says (implies?) that it’s Assur for Kohanim to leave Eretz Yisrael. (Only slightly tongue-in-cheek here.)
R’ Willig has an excellent Sefer (and provides tons of Mekoros) on Bishul and warming food on Shabbos. It’s pretty comprehensive and more in-depth than R’ Cohen’s, whose Sefer is also excellent.
feivel: The Rambam (I think in Hilchos Kiddush HaChodesh but in might be in the Peirush HaMishnayos) explicitly defines “Klal Yisrael” as those Jews living in Eretz Yisrael. He thinks that being in E”Y defines us more as a nation than being descendants of the Avos does. But I’ll let you tell the Rambam that his Shittos are “scholarly irrelevant nonsense”. I’m sure he’ll be happy to hear it from you.
Health: You can’t call a few weeks constant. If it’s daily for a few weeks but then goes away, that qualifies as “sporadic”. Just like every other spike of violence in history.
Some claim the story of Acher, but I think Pashtus is that that’s a mistranslation of Zimra Yevanis.
ca: So?
feivel: It’s not horrendously mistaken. In fact, it’s a fair reading that the Rambam said that.
Health: You can keep on repeating it, but that doesn’t make it true. Arabs and Muslims were killing us for 1000 years. Sure, there were times of relative peacefulness. Just like we had times of relative peacefulness with Christian neighbors throughout the centuries. That doesn’t mean that we still weren’t slaughtered and attacked often. We were. Just because one of those short periods of relative peace was Israel in the early 1900s doesn’t mean that it would have lasted, at all. Just like every other time of relative “peacefulness” in history.
There is a fascinating Tshuvah in the Tshuvos V’Hanhagos (R’ Shternbuch) where he says that women smoking is an Issur of Begged Ish. I was curious why or how this could be so, so I did research. It was illegal for women to smoke in public in South Africa until the 1990s (maybe 1980s). So he never saw a woman smoking. Hence, he considered it Begged Ish.
To answer the OP, I reject his assumption that it’s acceptable for guys to smoke.
LF: There is a Chiyuv on the Beis Din to try to avoid getting to the point where you actually have all of the requirements for execution.
rob: Kippah can (in theory) be for anything, according to the Gemara, though some Rishonim try and limit it.
Health: The truth is that in 1678 Yemenite Jews remembered the cordial relations they had with their neighbors and rulers for the previous century or so. And then a ruler who didn’t like them got up and most of them were killed. That’s what our relationship under Muslim rule was like for a millennium. Cordial and happy, until they decide to kill us.
Joseph: That’s not fair. You’re talking sheer numbers. We can find 65-year periods where more Jews died per capita. In fact, probably in every single 65-year period in history more Jews per capita were killed than there have been in Israel in the last 65 years.
Also, learn some Gemara. It’s very hard to actually give the death penalty. You need Hasra’ah and for the person to acknowledge that he received the Hasra’ah then do it anyway. The most people Beis Din would end up executing would be once every few years. At absolute most.
DY: (Thanks for pointing out the typo.) I agreed it was close enough. Just corrected that it’s only 3 decimal places, not 4.
Health: Your timeline is right, your cause and effect are wrong. Jews got along “okay” with Arabs before the 19th century (and by “okay” we mean living at the whims of dictators as second-class citizens with the potential to lose all of their possessions, their homes, or even their lives any day). But Zionism was not the cause of the change of that. Arab nationalism changed things much more than Zionism did. It came about earlier and there was a significant uptick in attacks against Jews and outright massacres long before 19th century Zionism existed.
Health: I have no idea. Per capita, I’d guess the answer was under the Ottomans but I don’t have numbers and can’t prove it.
Health: Yeah. For many years and large chunks of time, Jews lived as more or less happy second-class citizens under the Ottoman Empire. Except for, you know, when every 50 years or so hundreds to thousands of Jews would be kicked out of their homes or massacred or raped or happy things like that.
This would be great! How many Jews were killed during the time of the Ottoman empire and how many Jews were killed since the beginning of the Medina?!?
So now we know the real source for Health’s Shittah. He just doesn’t know any history.
Joseph: You added an unnecessary word in that sentence.
HaKatan: I never said R’ Schachter was my Rebbe. I just quote him a lot. And I don’t defend everything YU does. Just lots of misconceptions about it.