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DaMoshe, they wouldn’t release a statement for a minor factual innaccuracy.
The fact that they so desperately want to distance themselves from the rejection of Weiss’ geirus is disturbing, and should disturb you as well.
ZD, you should do some research before you post random facts. Your post is riddled with errors.
1) Offspring of a mamzer or mamzeres are mamzerim. The offspring of most other arayos are also mamzeirim. Although this is not relevant to the discussion, what you wrote is factually incorrect.
2) False geirus could lead to mamzeirus, or false mamzeirim.. It might not happen often, but if a woman married a false ger and left without a get, and remarried, her children from her new husband would be wrongly considered mamzeirim. If she then left him without a get, and her first husband died, she would be considered a widow, when in reality she’s an eshes ish, and any children from a third husband would be unknown mamzeirim.
3) The discussion wasn’t even about mamzeirus. Intermarriage is a tragedy even if the children are kosher.
4) You can’t extrapolate what Rav Moshe would have held about some of these conversions. The circumstances are completely different. He dealt with Orthodox rabbis. Weiss considers himself Orthodox, but he’s not.
5) A kohen may not marry or stay married to a giyores. The kesuba is not valid because we want him to divorce her and not dissuaded by financial considerations. The children are indeed challalim. You got that part right.
Also, I don’t know what you mean “there are no standard conversions”. There is a Shulchan Aruch. There are some things which are a machlokes, but you want to throw the whole thing out!
You should take a poll of random people who don’t know your son (an internet chat room comes to mind) and do whatever the majority says.
Ronsr, the issue would be shutting the screen off or “turning the page” when the Shem Hashem is on it, not deleting the file.
I’d never heard of this before, but in a post wiped out by the Post’s attack on YWN, someone mentioned that these e-readers work differently than regular screens.
Midwesterner had said that he asked a shailah (about computer screens, I guess) and was told it’s muttar. Computer screens are constantly refreshing themselves, so one never really erases anything, he just prevents it from returning, which isn’t a problem.
E-readers, OTOH, have the image of the letters “etched” into the screen, and turning it off might be considered m’chikah.
The tzad to be meikil, of course, is that Syag bought one for her son.
From Disney, no?
Oh. (I googled it.)
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/bloombergs-last-act-as-mayor
I think most people use it wrong – they mean to say, “Al tiftach peh l’soton””.
TAOM, sure, as long as you don’t have to shovel.
ZD, so if some conversions are controversial, you think we should not object to ones we know are passul? Do you think geirus is a game, a joke, or merely politics?
Have you actually read the numerous responses to your terribly misguided viewpoint here?
How they reported it.
Oh, right you’re from that country called “Chicago”.
So if my wife’s brother married my sister, would that make him my brother-in-laws?
How did you know I live in Lakewood?
Notasheep, the premise of the book seems to be that kids are little annoying brats who need to be beaten into submission. I didn’t read the book, but a lot of people who submitted reviews on Amazon seem to think so.
Gefen, can you please explain?
It seems to be better now. Mods, what was wrong?
Sorry, top secret
Midwesterner, that’s a fair rejoinder to ZD, but the issue runs deeper than that. We should be concerned with improper geirus even if those converts and their offspring would never make it to our communities.
How does washing dishes make you lose your teeth?
Oh, is that how they rationalize it to themselves? If they want good, frum people who don’t know any better not to side with Avi Weiss, they should educate them so that they’ll know better. Revoke his membership, and do a good job explaining why they’ve done so, and why his geirus is no good.
Now, they come across as spineless and wishy washy.
DaMoshe, if they reject Weiss’ geirus, they should have inserted into their statement, “but had they asked us, we would have told them to reject his geirus”.
If there are people doing invalid geirus in the US, calling themselves Orthodox even though they’re apikirsom, and they’re RCA members, it would be irresponsible to not question the definition of “Orthodox” in the US.
ZD’s right about there being politics. The RCA is fearful of having all of their members’ geirus questioned, because they’re not selective enough about who they allow as members, so they’re getting all defensive. They should not be playing politics with geirus.
The book is called “To Train Up a Child”. Most of the reviews are 1 star (a lot of the five star reviews are sarcastic) and refer to the book as a manual for child abuse.
They’re kind of in a bad position. They should have kicked him out a long time ago, but since they didn’t, they don’t think it reflects well on them to have one of their members’ recommendations rejected.
It seems from the rest of the statement that they want all future geirus testimonies go through them, so that they can reject any that are suspect, and save themselves the embarrassment of having the Rabbanut reject it.
Only twice? Lucky you.
Tizki instead of Tizku.
Syag, when did you become chassidish?
Right. That’s why it would be so nice if we could all afford it. 🙂
Feif, Google “kosher filet mignon”.
Yes, NASI is the motzi in terms of action, I meant that the migration point is the motzi in terms of the theory.
You’re right about otd/bt. What I should have said is that the difference doesn’t seem to be nearly enough to fully explain the numbers, and in no way negates the demographic reality of age gap/population growth causes gender disparity, and that closing the age gap still helps solve the additional disparity that migration might cause.
I agree that for the most part, twenty year old litvish bochrim shouldn’t be getting married. But there’s not nearly enough downside in focusing shidduch efforts on the twenty-one plus girls to offset the tremendous benefit.
This is really nice to hear. Maybe soon you’ll share your favorite recipes for porterhouse steak and filet mignon with us! 🙂
I say let the yeshiva community and MO community keep on debating who’s right and who’s wrong, who’s more frum and who’s less frum, who learns more and who does more chessed, etc. It’ll keep us all sharp and we’ll hopefully all raise our level.
Kinas sofrim tarbeh chochmoh.
Sam, ok, we need a calendar, but do we need to celebrate when the numbers change?
WIY, your comment was probably chukas hagoyim. 😉
Truthsharer, of course they would be in favor of kollel (I’m not sure what you mean by lifestyle).
Nothing about “times changing” is mattir arayos or indicates compromising on separation to prevent issues if arayos where it’s unnecessary to.
Squeak, thank you for your response.
Why would you say it gets much narrower?
Based on data from The World Factbook (yes, I originally found it on Wikipedia).
You’ve agreed to the basic equation, you’re just saying that migration could mitigate or eliminate the disparity. Hamotzi meichaveiroi alav haraya.
It’s also against an almost universally observed phenomenon, and every possible migration you mention is counterintuitive.
If anything, more boys seem to go otd or migrate to
non shidduch communities, and more girls seem to become bt.
You’ve mentioned litvish girls marrying chassidish boys before. The notion if that having any serious affect on the demographics is so far fetched to me that I literally thought it was another one of your faked moon landing bubbe maisas.
B’kitzur, the notion of these migrations is highly unlikely to have any significant effect on the disparity which it seems you agree would exist without migration, so even though it’s not 100% muchrach, it’s worth working with the fairly safe assumption that the observed disparity isn’t merely an illusion IF there would be no negative side effects.
That’s a big IF, though, but I’ve not really commented much on that aspect of it. We might agree on that issue.
Charlie, be honest. Do you think R’ Soliveitchik’s father and grandfather would have sent their children to coed schools?
I’m very skeptical that even he held it was at all l’chatchilah
And precisely because of his secular education, and the impact it had on his hashkafah, he was far from universally accepted as a gadol hador.
Sam, then yes, I agree to the ex post facto benefit. In case I was choshed b’ksherim, I give you a birchas hedyot that you should continue to grow in your learning and avodas Hashem.
He didn’t complain about the school, but does say it’s MO, and he wants to leave the MO environment, which he sees as hypocritical.
I’m not mistaking his school to be coed, he clearly said it’s all boys, but between the lines, I’m seeing him having schoolmates involved in things which be doesn’t feel are appropriate for a Ben Torah.
Either way, that wasn’t really my point. He obviously feels that moving to CC, for whatever reason, even if it’s just communal affiliation, is a step up for him, and I don’t think his role as a mashpia where he currently is should have a part in his decision.
Sam, he’s in an all boys yeshiva, but MO, which he doesn’t feel is conducive to his ruchniyus.
DaMoshe, I think this is legit.
I will disagree with a number of posters on this thread. It is not a 15 (or so) year old boy’s job to choose his environment to be mashpia on others. Of course, wherever he finds himself, he should be as positive an influence as he can be, but he first has to worry about his own growth in ruchniyus, and this impressive young man sees his growth outside of the MO environment he finds himself in.
For those worried about academics (and although I think they’re important, I think at this age the focus should be on a yeshiva which will help him grow in learning). Chofetz Chaim is reputed to have an excellent secular studies department, which they take seriously (as they should).
It’s also probably one of the least “extreme” yeshivos around from the more “yeshivish” type of yeshivos.
One crucial aspect of all this that I can’t believe is being forgotten or ignored, is that every person has a Zivug and a set time for when they will marry.
I’ve heard that said before, but I don’t think it’s true. Do you have a source?
The commonly quoted source is the Gemara in Sotah, but it doesn’t actually say there’s a bas kol for everyone. In fact, it can’t mean everyone; we see, l”a, children who pass on too young to have gotten married, and people with various conditions which would make it impossible to ever get married. Obviously, there was no bas kol for them.
the male to female ratio in the USA is 105:100
That number is the birth ratio. The gap gets much narrower as we approach typical marriage age.
AZOI, the second item is easily explained as a direct result of the gender disparity.
The second item would ring truer if we observed that there are lots of guys left over, and primarily the less bright ones.
It seems to me that while we’ve observed way too many bright girls who remain unmarried, we haven’t seen nearly as many less bright guys.
DaMoshe, I would guess that some of your rebbeim, whom you would never dare address as anything other than “Rabbi”, never got semicha.
Welcome back, nice to see you again!
AZOI.IS, I assume you realize that the reference to multiple rolls was playing off of popa’s previously mentioning that he has several wives. It was a joke (although he hasn’t told any dating stories recently, so my best guess is that he really did get married).
They cannot have twigs in their mouths, and must be made from less than 16oz. of snow.
No, that would just cause a redefinition of who is a baguette and who is a challa roll.
I’m assuming there are enough baguettes for everyone, plus some extra challah rolls, and that everyone just buys one roll (if more people would be solution oriented as you are, and buy multiple rolls, there wouldn’t be as many left over).
You can call off the APB, he’s around.