Ash

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  • in reply to: YWN News Standards #2154403
    Ash
    Participant

    they don’t have standards at all. just clickbait, copy and paste, and little moderation of awful comments that incite eiva or are mevaze talmidei chachom

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2044072
    Ash
    Participant

    HaLeivi, I didn’t intend to get you so worked up but you are constantly misreading me and appear to take this too personally so I apologise if I offended you. I’m not comfortable debating further, but suffice to say I didn’t say Tosofos has no Yerushalmi, only that Yerushalmi (in a different mesechta) which the Ritva clearly also had, and agreed with its text.

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2043784
    Ash
    Participant

    @Haleivi

    the Ritva was merely quoting the Yerushalmi

    … and saying how correct it is

    Second, it is very odd that you consider the Yerushalmi more reliable than Bavli. It is a known … (cut out blah)

    To repeat, the Yerushalmi agageta regarding Chrsitainity wasn’t censored as the Bavli was.

    He invoked Yeshu ben Pandira, because that was how they already referred to him.

    Your conjectures are cute, but if I was to imagine everything in the Gmeorah is paraphrasing mistakes then working out contradictory agagetas would be much simpler.

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2043557
    Ash
    Participant

    @HaLeivi

    1. The Yerusalmi mentions JC’s full name only masiach lefi tumoi in this story which gives even more credence (if any is needed, when reading a clear Gemorah!)
    2. Talmud Yerushalmi is (a) uncensored and (b) probably 200 years older than Bavli whereas these sort of agedetas in Bavli were heavily censored and are more likely to be wrong textually or contextually than the Yerushalmi until you look at the defusei yoshoni
    3. We clearly are given the name of ben sitta – the Gemorah in Shabbos 104b says that it’s ben pandira, and the Yerushalmi says this is JC
    4. The Ritva is unequivocal that JC’s full name is יש״ו בן פנדירא and I believe the Ritva knew how to understand a Gemorah 🙂

    Your theories about there being misnamed legends about early xtians and that a Gemorah would repeat errors in these “legends” are just that – internet forum theories and don’t stack up next to a Ritva. (Although of course, Tosafos does disagree but clearly not because of your “legends theory” but simply because they were missing some of the Yerushalmi!)

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2043556
    Ash
    Participant

    @HaLeivi

    1. The Yerusalmi mentions JC’s full name only masiach lefi tumoi in this story which gives even more credence (if any is needed, when reading a clear Gemorah!)
    2. Talmud Yerushalmi is (a) uncensored and (b) probably 200 years older than Bavli whereas these sort of agedetas in Bavli were heavily censored and are more likely to be wrong textually or contextually than the Yerushalmi until you look at the defusei yoshoni
    3. We clearly are given the name of ben sitta – the Gemorah in Shabbos 104b says that it’s ben pandira, and the Yerushalmi says this is JC
    4. The Ritva is unequivocal that JC’s full name is יש״ו בן פנדירא and I believe the Ritva knew how to understand a Gemorah 🙂

    Your theories about there being misnamed legends about early xtians and that a Gemorah would repeat errors in these “legends” are ust that – internet forum theories and don’t stack up next to a Ritva. (Although of course, Tosafos does disagree but clearly not because of your “legends theory” but simply because they were missing some of the Yerushalmi!)

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2043369
    Ash
    Participant

    @HaLeiVi yes Shabbos קד

    And I misremembered the Ritva too. If fact, it’s in Avoda Zoro 27b and the Yerushalmi is also in Avoda Zoro (perek 2, halacha 2).

    The modern-day gemoras who have pre-censor defus-yad text add a whole chunk into The Gemorah in Shabbos 104b. (The Yerushalmi was never censored as the Bavli agageta were.)

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2042564
    Ash
    Participant

    @HaLeivi
    Yes קד not כד. The old defusos have clearer girsa, see Oz Vehodor gemorah
    The Ritvo is in ע”ז כז ע”ב.
    erushalmi is in ע”ז פ”ב ה”ב where the first is ישו בן פנדירא!

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2041732
    Ash
    Participant

    @Haleivi I don’t really get the idea that to conflate ישו הנוצרי with בן סטדא. Nowhere does the Gemara put them together.

    The Ritva on Shabbos 24b says they are the same person. Yerushalmi also. It’s night likely that the bavli too was clear on that point but removed by censor.

    in reply to: taanit notzrim #2041068
    Ash
    Participant

    @HaLeiVi I can’t remember mesachte and perek but there are rishonim that clearly link ישו הנוצרי with בן סטדא See IIRC commentries on the agageta of Miriam Megadle Searos in Chaggigah but the main sugya is elesewhere, I’ll try to remember to follow-up with correct marei mokom.

    in reply to: Non jewish isreilis #2041065
    Ash
    Participant

    There are Europeans who would reject a USA shidduch due to the lax standards of giyur in America in comparison to Europe and (for now) EY.

    in reply to: I have COVID #2038913
    Ash
    Participant

    @philosopher. Regading the UK:

    1. There is no money incentive
    2. Our death rate if anything is over-reported as it counts anyone who died within x number of days of having covid, not just a confirmed positive
    3. If our halthcare is so rubbish (it isn’t, except for some pioneering surgeries) then surely our death rate should be much much worse than the US from Covid. It isn’t. It’s better.

    Bottom line: the US, with its best-in-class healthcare has the worst Covid death rate per capita in the Western world and the worst update of vaccines and social distancing measures.

    You live in a conspiracy theory world, where the majority of doctors, all who recommend vaccines are either dishonest or fooled by “big pharma” or “Bill Gates” or whatever tinfoil hat thing you read or heard.

    Take the vaccine, and stop all these yiddishe lives being lost r”l.

    in reply to: I have COVID #2036606
    Ash
    Participant

    @Health if you Google “who hcq” it’s the first result from WHO’s website.

    Here’s the link, which mods may let through https://www.who.int/news/item/04-07-2020-who-discontinues-hydroxychloroquine-and-lopinavir-ritonavir-treatment-arms-for-covid-19

    I don’t get this obsession with HCQ, or any other treatment.

    This USA mistrust of doctors is an American machla because your healthcare is so monitised. Here in the UK where 99% of treatment for Covid happens in a NHS hospital there is almost zero way for anyone to make money out of surpressing valid treatments, and letting people die.

    And yet, UK doctors, medical cheifs and head scientists are pretty much unanimous that masks, and social distancing are necessary especially when there’s a new variant with unknown long-term effects on the spread, because there is no guaranteed treatment. (And all agree that HCQ is ineffective, as is some heirmishe Monsey doctor’s magical cocktail.)

    You USA-ers have got to start looking outside of your own country, at yiddishkeit worldwide and see how Eretz Yisroel reacts, and the gedolim there. The USA has one of the worst death rates from Covid in the Western world, and the yidden there someone think it’s a chov kodosh to keep the USA 11th commandment of freedom and almost entirely disregard the measures that the rest of the world, including frum yidden worldwide, think necessary.

    The halachoh is that we follow rov rofim. The halacha is clear that most poskim hold that dinei dmalchusa dine applies to matters of public health.

    This denial has much more to do with a misyavnim effect of valuing your USA-originating freedoms than a Torah viewpoint to do whatever we can to guard our health, obey the law of tha land, not to be misgreh b’umos and obove all to think critically and accept the majority worldview on health matters instead of conspiracy theories and quack doctors.

    in reply to: I have COVID #2035783
    Ash
    Participant

    WHO said HCQ doesn’t have an effect.

    in reply to: Chess Invented By… #2034725
    Ash
    Participant

    there are no proofs from gemorah or Rashi for this legend. The hametargem is only 130 in years old and is not considered reliable.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor Proclamation #2033217
    Ash
    Participant

    @ujm said:
    <i>How can you believe accusations from people that left their community, especially if they left in some disputed circumstances?</i>

    Yes, of course we <b>do</b> give heed to the words of Jews who have left this group. Ignoring those the few that went secular, most of the ex-members of LT reamined frum. The only reason we would discount a Torah yid who makes serious accusations against another, is under dinei loshon horah. Even under dinei loshon horah, the din of “michash miboi” and “kolo dlo posik” clearly applies here.

    We could be very suspicious, and I think there’s enough evidence that it can all be 100% beleived.

    Even without evidence from the inside (ex-members etc), anyone who does research on LT and look at the difference between a cult and a (lmoshol) chassidus, it’s very clear LT is a cult.

    Slavishly following the Rebbe like he’s G-d, or having extreme “kashrus”, and very restricted learning is only one aspect, and indeed one that’s harder to distinguish from true chassidus so it’s a red herring. (That said, there’s no chassidus that has all 3 of these extremes, and many more – except LT.)

    A chassidus does not ostracise those that leave it for another chareidi derech, and enforce entirely cutting off anyone that leaves even from their own family left behind.

    That’s without mentioning ask the other cultish aspects, such as the way medication and punishment is built into their system with the pretence that it’s yahadus and halacha.

    Lev lachim should rescue these poor neshomos.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor Proclamation #2033219
    Ash
    Participant

    In York, the accounts say they did kill them. But it’s very different comparing a vadai babtisim (as in 1100s it was absoutely certain they would be forced or killed immediately), and a horoas shoh from baalei tosofos who were present in that tower, from present day when, even if their children were removed it’s NOT a vadai that havroas hadaas will happen.

    And if the argument here is that it’s “mutar” in their preceived ciscumstances to murder children, then I think they should loudly proclaim that this proclamation is real and they are indeed prepared to murder children rather than allow removal from the cult. I think we all know how the yiddishe world will react.

    in reply to: Sleeping in the sukkah #2019187
    Ash
    Participant

    there are question marks because there were originally Hebrew words. Threads from a few years back containing Hebrew got garbled during their forum upgrade a few years ago (probably due to not taking into account encoding changes e.g. from utf16 to utf8). It’s a shame they haven’t managed to fix this.

    in reply to: ADHD can be an expression of the creative mind #2019115
    Ash
    Participant

    @ADHD if your condition has let to marriage problems, that’s serious. Too serious for internet forum advice. ADHD. Call Relief for recommended therapists and professional help, first yourself but with a goal too progress to couple therapy (with a therapist by Relief).

    in reply to: ADHD can be an expression of the creative mind #2018377
    Ash
    Participant

    @philosopher You’re out of date. ADHD does not neccessarily mean someone can’t sit still, or is incapable of concentrating. yes, the name is misleading but it’s here to stay.

    A major subtype, “Inattentive ADHD” is chracterised by a restlessness of thought, and the inability to concentrate on something that’s not interesting/stimulating but zero hyperactivity (even in childhood). It’s a major disorder, because few of us will go through life with learning or work that’s intersting/stimulating 100%, or even 65% of the time and so we may fail continually.

    In an ideal world, these teens could skip yeshiva and work in a craetive job but in practice most children would not want to skip yeshiva, which itself would get them labelled as very non-typical, but get help & meds and go through our (admittedly conformist) system.

    I speak as an adult with family who got through schooling and even yeshiva without major upset (although yeshiva was a deeply unhappy time, feeling like a failure for not being able to sit through a 90% of the sedorim), but the real cruch came to settling down with work.

    I had to quit my employment because I couldn’t do just get my job done, and failed again at running my own business because I was unable to focus on business goals that were profitable rather than interesting to me. I spent years changing the focus of my work and burning money without much profit.

    Finally I’ve been diagnosed as being ADHD and I’m on meds after decades of denial and it makes a massive difference. By now, I also need coaching from a lifetime of bad habits caused by ADHD. I deeply mourn the fact that I wasn’t diagnosed before adulthood.

    According to your criteria I would never have been “labeledl” ADHD, just creative, out-of-the-box thinker and all manner of good things but BH this label has made me be able to provide for my family and start repairing years of uttter fustration in trying to have a productive day.

    It’s vitally important that ADHD children are diagnosed (what you would term “labelled”) because otherwise the risk of failure at yeshiva or work is massive.

    in reply to: ADHD help #1982763
    Ash
    Participant

    Dear ADHD,

    I feel your pain as an adult with untreated ADHD.

    i can only echo @bigissy that if with current meds, it’s still affecting your marriage and mental health then it’s vital to <u>stay<u> with a good psychiatrist who can adjust and review the meds until you’ve got a level that works for you.

    If your marriage setup is that your wife needs you to babysit 7-8pm, but that the meds have worn off by then and it’s torture to just sit with the kids, then either (most likely) you probably need longer-lasting meds, perhaps with melatonin (crefully timed) to make sure you can still get to sleep.

    Or instead offer to get the kids ready for school in the morning when the meds are working fine, and explain that ideal babysitting for you in the evening is torture? Or perhaps it’s necessary to get a nightly babysitter no matter the expense.

    Playing video games with kids everytime you’re babysitting would drive any wife crazy, so perhaps music, an exciting book or something else can work that makes it possiblef or you to bear the understimulating activity of babysitting without resorting to activities that make it bearable for you, but aren’t an ideal way to take care of child. I find having a shiur/podcast/music on with wireless earphones and ability to pause with 1 button press makes it possible to watch the kids but also be there when needed.

    Take your wife with to psychiatrist! It’s vital she’s with you on the journey and understands your condition and realises what is and isn’t possible.

    And yes ADHD has many advantages, it’s part of your character and she married you

    Finally maybe try ADHD coaching e.g. Abraham (Avrohom) Beurer 845-459-3164. It’s costs money but can be cheaper than having real marriage issues and requiring couple therapy.

    in reply to: Internet filter #1857882
    Ash
    Participant

    Call TAG. They are the experts.

    But if you’re desperate for anonymous internet advice then I’d use NetSpark, most of those mentioned above aren’t good.

    in reply to: Yiddish at Siyum hashas #1751943
    Ash
    Participant

    The bickering here is fun by entirely besides the point.

    Clearly the siyum attendees, much like the posters here will have strong opinions whether the droshos should be in English or Yiddish.

    Unlike the posters here, they provide a simple solution in order to keep sholom: simultaneous translation.

    Some complained that they couldn’t hear on their phones but the solution is just as simple: bring along big headphones and plug in to your phone.

    In the UK siyum they don’t rely on phones but have a radio broadcast system with special headphones which seems to work just fine

    So mods, can we close the thread? 🙂

    in reply to: Lev Tahor and other frum cults- and don’t misunderstand me #1628332
    Ash
    Participant

    Slavishly following the Rebbe is only one aspect, and indeed one that’s harder to distinguish from true chassidus so it’s a red herring (or a trollish attempt to bash Lubavitch).

    Chassidus, even Lubavitch, does not ostracise those that leave it for another chareidi derech, and enforce entirely cutting off anyone that leaves even from their own family left behind.

    That’s without mentioning ask the other cultish aspects, such as the way medication and punishment is built into their system with the pretence that it’s yahadus and halacha.

    in reply to: STOP MULTIPLYING!!! #1422740
    Ash
    Participant

    My preferred response would be to stand opposite him with a sign reading “STOP DIVIDING”

    Ash
    Participant

    @Godolhadorah I did not mean for this thread to become an extension of what seems to be an ongoing exchange of insults and venom

    Excuse me while I take a few minutes to draw breath again …

    You seem entirely oblivious to the utter hypocrisy you’ve just espoused.

    You have spend months using the most disgusting language about Peleg and its rabbonim and wished awful things would happen to them. You have been one of the primarily culprits of hysterical reaction, and now you dare to take the moral high ground here and ask for reduction in venom.

    Take a very long hard honest look in the mirror before commenting again.

    in reply to: Mesichists Explained by ChabadShlucha #1412447
    Ash
    Participant

    @MochiachChat I happen to do it on occasion as I’ve never seen someone freak out about it before.

    I assure you every Torah yid doesn’t and wouldn’t accept it. Do yourself a favour and stop. Since at least the times of Mishna no-one has referred to gedolim vtzadikim without their title.

    And as the Rambam says (פ”ו מהי’ ת”ת הי”ג) this was the final cause of churban yerushalaim – the polar opposite of what ostensibly is your lief goal.

    in reply to: Mesichists Explained by ChabadShlucha #1412032
    Ash
    Participant

    @moshiachchat I am disgusted at your referring to Harav Again R Moshe Feinstein zt”l without the title Rav let alone a proper honorific. Ditto Harav Mordechai Eliyohu. I’d like to believe it was an error, except you repeated this gross error twice in the same post.

    If this was intentional it says very little of the maalos of following a rebbe even after his petira.

    See what the rambam writes about bizui talmidei chachomim bring the main cause delaying moshiach. Oh, the irony!

    in reply to: divorce prevention tips! #1392192
    Ash
    Participant

    Joseph, you have a habit of presenting your boich svoros or incomplete knowledge as fact.

    The Halacha clearly states that any money or assets a wife comes into possession of during the course of her marriage is the full property of the husband.

    As always, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

    Actually, halachah also says she can claim איני ניזונת ואיני עושה which means of she’s earning she can keep it all – during marriage and beyond.

    in reply to: The EXPLODING Opioid Crisis In The Frum Community #1391062
    Ash
    Participant

    [C&P of comment on related news article]

    The real reason why opioids are the big problem in our kehillos is because it’s possible for a non-drinking, non-smoking, Torah-learning father of 8 (or bubbe with 20 einiklech, or the shtarkest bochur in yeshiva) to get hooked unintentionally on heroin.

    Here’s how: painkillers. The father of 8 is involved in a car accident, the bubbe gets persistent arthritis, the bochur gets a slipped disc dancing at a chasuna. Let’s say they have poor insurance, or great insurance but a overworked doctor. So instead of getting real treatment like expensive physio therapy, the doctor proscribes Oxycodone, oxytocin, or even regular coedine.

    The pills provide relief, but they’ve only been given a certain dose and once that’s over the pain returns. The father can’t work, the bubbe can’t enjoy her day, the bochur can’t learn. It’s too much. So they pester the doc for more, or go to a medicine gemach.

    In some of the cases, unwittingly they get hooked. Once hooked, they are an addict. They cannot rationalize, cannot control, cannot resist. It’s no longer bechirah, it’s just a uncontrollable need.

    The father finds he needs the pills to function, the bubbe thinks there’s nothing wrong with these pills when she takes about 10 pills for other ailments daily anyway and the bochur knows that without pills he’ll feel terribly sick, start shaking and needs to pop another … just to get through another day.

    Once the source of pills stop, they discover a guy who’s can give them fen***** and once they discover pills don’t satisfy, they start inhaling, then snorting, then …

    It’s a short road from severe pain and accidental dependence on opiod painkillers to heroin.

    And it can and does effect “der shentzer in der bester mishpuchos”.

    Wake up yidden!

    in reply to: divorce prevention tips! #1390179
    Ash
    Participant

    JJ, it’s expressly prohibited for a Beis Din to use secular/non-Jewish laws instead of using Halacha/Shulchan Aruch. They can’t say even though halachicly this is your asset, since non-Jewish law says to award it to the other party, that’s what we’ll do.

    Nonsense. You know neither choshen mishpat, nor have experience of typical dinei torah (momonus or gittin). Unless it’s masne al mah shekosuv batorah you can absolutely agree that a transaction is per law of the land, and if it comes to beis din then secular law is what the beis din we’ll have to evaluate (frequently with Council’s opinion).

    Yerushah also, if it was a matono mchayim.

    in reply to: Are all these protests in Jerusalem really a kiddush hashem? #1387639
    Ash
    Participant

    ;The legal method is to simply register and get your deferment, as has been done for decades

    This shows a profound ignorance of the crucial changes in the last 5 years and the changes in the 10-15 years before that.

    If you don’t have knowledge of the way the law has been changed, then you cannot hope to understand the cause that these that Peleg are fighting for.

    I don’t excuse the heter for these type of protests, but there is certainly a huge threat to Torah in EY caused by the Lapid/Kadima-Bennet/Bayit Yehudi coalition changes to the status quo.

    From the abolition of the Tal law, reversal of vaad hayeshivos control of the situation, imposition of mandatory quotas of chareidi recruits, forcing bochurim to come to army offices for deferment, etc etc this is certainly not the way things have been for decades. In fact, not even the way things have been for one decade.

    Never before has there been such a threat to conscripting those in full time learning into an army that is becoming an ever more unacceptible place for a frum yid.

    in reply to: A Sukkah’la lyrics #1376677
    Ash
    Participant

    When I did the search there were fewer than 20 results between them 180 vs 160 or something. Anyway, you can try other words and examples.

    I don’t get your distinction and what are words that “contain yiddish vowels”? Every word can be written with “yiddish” vowels.

    The suffix thing shown that sometimes the vowels are left out when it doesn’t add. There are better examples no doubt.

    I am making up rules based on experience not formal knowledge of grammar, but I suspect that your “yiddish vowels” rule is similarly made up. True?

    in reply to: A Sukkah’la lyrics #1372612
    Ash
    Participant

    without question.

    Very much with question. Do a google search for “זיי נישט קיין נער” (with quotes, ideally) and then for “זיי נישט קיין נאר” and you’ll find they have a very similar number of results, and many from heimish websites/publications for both.

    I don’t know about WIVO or academic yiddish but for an actual first-language Yiddish speaker it would be quite odd to spell it in a way that it too similar to “nohr/nur” (“only”) IMO and in colloquial Yiddish it is very common to write hebrew words as-is (like שבת) not because of the lack of ambiguity because many words are simply written in Hebrew. This trend is compounded by the transliteration and appropriation of many English words into Ivrit.

    In Yiddish it is quite lengthy גאלדבערגער with the א…ע..ע serving as vowels,

    Almost. Hungarian Yiddish (e.g. perhaps Satmar) usually leave ער at the end of words, but for the “er” suffix (and other similar suffix), Litvish or Polish Yiddish would leave out that final ער so it would be written גאלדבערגר.

    Name’s aren’t a good example though as they tend to be spelled the same way as they first were written long ago but any other word e.g. “הייליגר” / “הייליגער” might be a better example.

    in reply to: A Sukkah’la lyrics #1371895
    Ash
    Participant

    @DY that’s not quite right. In yiddish an aleph is used for kamatz or pasach sound (almost like vowels in English), and an ayin for a segol sound when using a native Yiddish (or German or English) word. Hebrew words are usually written in their proper spelling especially if they’re clearly not Yiddish in origin.

    (Exceptions include שאבעס for שבת but even that spelling is not usually used and even then only to show that it’s the “heimish” pronunciation.)

    So נאר is “nohr” which means only, whereas נער in the first version is clearly the Arameic word (for fool, the line means “on’t be fool”) and so would be written with an ayin.

    All the IIRC.

    in reply to: Video of Throwing Towels #1205968
    Ash
    Participant

    That video is an extreme example, presumably taken at a yeshiva without supervision, rather than a shul. As someone commented on the article: many would fulfil this minhag by half heartedly throwing a towel or two, not the litzonus and disregard for safety shown on that particular video.

    in reply to: abuse #1200731
    Ash
    Participant

    Don’t abuse the word abuse by describing grabbing an out of control kid as abuse.

    Bad chinuch, probably. But using punitive legal action like CTLawyer’s is equally disturbing without finding out the teachers, and school leadership version of events.

    in reply to: Thank you yeshiva world #1198212
    Ash
    Participant

    Agreed but please change it to some colour other than blue which makes it look a link (like the comment anchor is).

    in reply to: Small Claims Beis Din #1194695
    Ash
    Participant

    Try a borerus which is like an ad-hoc beis din.

    A borerus should be cheaper, and most of the time much faster. Each side chooses a dayan (which, in a “treifa borerus”, can actively defends their side – or alternatively they both should be somewhat impartial) and these two dayonim each choose the third rav/dayan.

    As someone above suggested, an even simpler solution is agreeing on a single rav/dayan (the now-classic “Let’s ask Rabbi Dayan” solution) and agree in advance in writing that you’ll both accept his psak. With this method, it’s often practical to put both sides positions in writing first and then have a 40 minute meeting with the rov where each side gets equal amount of time to speak and submit evidence. This ensures that it won;t drag on into multiple meetings or phone calls.

    in reply to: Anual kapporos argument #1185709
    Ash
    Participant

    Isn’t it possible to preserve the minhag of kaparos with chickens but not be oiver on tzaar baal chaim?

    Yes of course it is. Like my local (London) minhag kaporos centre, where they are transported in the same manner as all fowl (x number of chickens per crate) in the early evening, each one taken out, shlugged, and put into another crate where they are loaded onto a truck and taken to the shachthois.

    I don’t see anything in that 1-2 hour excursion that is tzaar bar lchaim and indeed the local animal rights people couldn’t find fault!

    I strongly suspect that most of those protesting are just embarrassed about this minhag yisroel torah. Otherwise, they’d speak about bringing takonos and easing regulation to ensure those sites that mistreat or waste chickens change their ways.

    Instead they invent new arguments each year, much like the anti-shechita groups, not to reform or better things, but to abolish and mock.

    in reply to: Anual kapporos argument #1185694
    Ash
    Participant

    I’m confused. Do you think when they’re transported for shechitah each chicken gets to go in a Learjet, premium corn and water from glass Ein Gedi bottles served by a stewardess? And when they arrive, they wait in a private lounge until the shochet comes and sings them to sleep before shechting them?

    in reply to: Why do we let go of the Tzitzis at ?????????? ???????????? ?????? #1185631
    Ash
    Participant

    The sefer Ishei Yisroel on tefillah says that it comes from the siddur Yaavetz and it’s because this is the second ??? in two sentences, and twice ??? is gematria ???? and this is segulah (I think) for protection (I think) of one’s ???? (head). Look it up.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor – what now? #1184435
    Ash
    Participant

    @dovrosenbaum Because it’s not a derech, and there is little decision involved once you’re sucked in to the cult.

    Please answer your own question: why do rabbonim and erliche yidden see this as very different than any other sects?

    Why did the Mishpacha – who lovingly cover all strands of Torah jewry from MO to extreme chassidus – and does not publish coverage of individual scandals, but chose the very risky position of “outing” LT as a cult?

    Why does even the Eida Chareidis declare burka wearing as not halacha, mesorah or minhag?

    You’ll ask me: what exactly is the line between extreme frumkeit and non-Torahdik extreme living? I don’t know exactly where it lies but I do know LT is far over that line.

    And why is it a cult, rather than just a kehillah not conforming to any mesorah? Because it fits the definition: it’s based on the charisma of one person and his deputies who controls every aspect of their life from novel rules on eating, socialising, bringing up kids, shidduchim (decided by leadership not only parents!), not to mention restrictions on leaving the group that make it close to impossible unless you’re willing never to speak to your parents, siblings or children ever again.

    There have been many examples given (including by me), but here’s a simple one: Is there any chassidus that would ban all familial contact with someone who left their kehillah to become “merely” a litvak or MO (but still Torah Observing)?

    in reply to: Zionists, Chareidim, and Handouts #1181114
    Ash
    Participant

    Satmar and Brisk also pay taxes such as arnuna, VAT ma’am, etc. etc. etc. They don’t pretend to live in a bubble 100 feet above EY.

    in reply to: Zionists, Chareidim, and Handouts #1181113
    Ash
    Participant

    @Yserbius123 “And these people have a ton of acceptance and support among certain Chassidim and Yerushalmis.”

    I don’t believe so, and I don’t believe you know that to be true. As you’re a redditor, may I say: [citation needed]

    and “You should hang around Meah Shearim and ask people what they think of them.”

    Have you?

    Speaking as someone who did spend a lot of time around Meah Shearim and speak the vernacular like a native – I doubt that normative residents of Meah Shearim do agree accept Weiss and his ilk.

    Like I said, all ultra anti-Zionists may look the same to you, but there are many shades of anti-State-ism and real hashkofos behind each one.

    And to turn your statement around, one could argue that if you are in favour of the state, what you are doing is supporting total secularism of Jews in Israel. Which is equally not true – the two sides are more nuanced than that.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor – what now? #1184432
    Ash
    Participant

    dovrosenbaum, I’m not throwing that label around. If you do all your research on LT and look at the difference between a cult and a (lmoshol) chassidus, it’s very clear LT is a cult. And I do not “throw that term about”.

    To pick but one additional example, they do not deny that if you leave LT for the normal chareidi world, you’ll be cut off from your family. No chassidus would do this. A cult does.

    I hope Lev Lachim are on their case, as they are as bad as any missionary group and are taking yidden away from yiddishkeit into the religion of Helbrans and his deputies. At least Lev Lachim can distinguish brainwashing from frumkeit and perishus.

    @apushatayid, you’re misunderstanding cults as much as Frankfurter did. No, it’s possible those children were truly happy and carefree. The fact remains they are trapped inside a cult and observing practices made up by a meglomaniac, not from our holy mesorah.

    Like many cults, LT have learned to modify many of their obviously extreme traits that would get them into trouble (like beatings, refusing to give kids toys, trying to be self sufficient economically and failing dismally) but they are still a cult and their members are trapped.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor – what now? #1184431
    Ash
    Participant

    dovrosenbaum, I’m not throwing that label around. If you do all your research on LT and look at the difference between a cult and a (lmoshol) chassidus, it’s very clear LT is a cult. And I do not throw that term about.

    To pick bury one additional example, they do not deny that if you leave LT for the normal chareidi world, you’ll be cut off from your family. No chassidus would do this. A cult does.

    I hope Lev Lachim are on their case, as they are as bad as any missionary group and are taking yidden away from yiddishkeit into the religion of Helbrans and his deputies. At least Lev Lachim can distinguish brainwashing from frumkeit and perishus.

    @apushatayid, you’re misunderstanding cults as much as Frankfurter did. No, it’s possible those children were truly happy and carefree. The fact remains they are trapped inside a cult and observing practices made up by a meglomaniac, not from our holy mesorah.

    Like many cults, LT have learned to modify many of their obviously extreme traits that would get them into trouble (like beatings, refusing to give kids toys, trying to be self sufficient economically and failing dismally) but they are still a cult and their members are trapped.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor – what now? #1184426
    Ash
    Participant

    *Yad Lachim, that is.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor – what now? #1184425
    Ash
    Participant

    dovrosenbaum, if they had a choice. From all the reports and the nature of the cult, the children, and even the adults after indoctrination have no choice.

    Frankfurter of the Ami was fooled because he went there with false notions of what a cult looks like. He went expecting to see malnorished children with haunted eyes, but found happy children. That is a fundemental misunderstanding of how cults work and operate and the effect they have the one the lives of the cult members. Three year olds may be made to daven shacharis for 3 hours (to quote one allegation that even the Ami admits), and still laugh and play that afternoon when the reporter visits. That same child, with the unperscribed pills, fake chassidus, and total control over his avodas hashem will not grow up to be a healthy minded adult or fulfil Torah kitikunoi.

    And there are no r”l second-generation Lev Tohar families (not to hard when you marry off girls in their early teens) who will never know the true beauty of yiddishkeit unless we rescue them.

    Do Lev Lachim operate outside of EY?

    in reply to: Zionism, Apikorsos? #1185453
    Ash
    Participant

    Avi K, trying to say the chofetz chaim, the moetzes, or any of the non-aguda gedolim we not anti-Zionist is rewriting history. Their position pre-war is a matter of plain historical record.

    Aguda’s position, and that of the gedolim of the prewar and post moetzes, as well as the gedolim of Degel (which includes gedolei bnei brak), and basically the entire Torah world except Satmar and Toldos AY/A and the Daati Leumi) was that the State should never have been established, but once it was established we have to work with them by voting, establishing political parties. Poloei Agudas Yisroel (???”? – originally the workers branch of aguda) was slightly more conciliatory, and eventually even had (has!) two kibbutzim — but the basic position remained the same.

    That every Torah yid has always wanted to settle in EY (whether controlled by Ottomans, British, or secular Jews) cannot be bought as proof to the state.

    Rav Kook is always trotted out as an example of a godol more or less supporting (Religious) Zionism, but actually he was about the only rov of that stature who did. the Satmar Rov Rav Yoelish was also indisputably a godol batorah but very few ascribe to his position on the State (much less what some in Satmar have turned it into).

    I have the greatest of respect for the daati leumi and their rabbonim, but it saddens me that many DL with excuse the grossest excesses of the state and throw chareidim under a bus because of the debate over the mitzvah of yeshivas eretz yisroel, when there is much more that unites us than divides us including 99% of Torah and mitzvos.

    Look around most Israeli cities and tell me – in your own layman’s opinion, whether you can truly claim the open peritzus, toevah, and entire secular nature (exemplified by much of the Army culture, for instance) is what rotzon hashem is r”l.

    in reply to: Lev Tahor – what now? #1184416
    Ash
    Participant

    That is unfortunately true. We’re at the whims of this cult because throwing them financially and politically off a cliff might mean that their children get fostered by goyim. So some askonim think supporting them prevents a worse evil. Which makes it doubly important that we show a united front against this group, taking Jewish families away from yiddishkeit, and destroying children’s chinuch al derech haltorah.

    Unfortunately, my own kehilla in North London (Stamford Hill) is one of the few kehillos where many support them without question and giving to their occasional fundraisers. They paint themselves as a Satmar-like anti-Zionist chareidi kehillah and chassidus when in fact they share as much with chareidim as Jews for J.

    This ignorance about the true nature of this cult means that this situation could continue indefinitely r”l.

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