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Shlishi: In fact, in the case of Rabbeinu Yom Tov, the Jews of York made the Brachah of “Asher Kidshanu B’mitzvosav V’tzivanu Al Kiddush Hashem” before killing themselves.
Curiosity: Um… I might happen to do one of those things on your list.
ONPA: It’s what I’ve seen everywhere I’ve been. And I mean evreywhere. And little kids aren’t necessarily a proof.
Shlishi: It exists in Arab cultures, Indian (as in India) cultures, Native American cultures, and possibly more. Some of those go very, very far back. Jewish references, not so much. That doesn’t prove anything, but it does raise questions.
Pashtus is that it had pagan meaning long before any Jews used it, but many Tzaddikim and Mekubalim have been known to have endorsed them throughout the generations. This is one of those weird areas in Halachah where Nigleh and Nistar seem to overlap and be at strong odds with each other.
Yitay: It should also be Nikkar as it will noticeably lighten the color of the coffee.
That aside, aren’t many Poskim Meikel by powdered milk anyway that it stays Parve?
And if whistling is Assur because of Sheidim, then those who whistle can probably rely on the Gra that Sheidim no longer exist.
WIY: It may take a while though. I really don’t recall precisely where it was at all. The page is taking shape in my memory, but I’ll need to look for a while.
Englishman: That’s not quite correct. It’s only Assur Mishum B’chukoseihem if they invented the practice for their worship. Not if a human action existed and they just co-opted it. Otherwise it would be an Issur of Chukas Hagoyim to bow or even to eat/drink or go to the bathroom because all of those actions were used for Avodah Zarah at one point.
HaLeiVi: Yes, but nowadays it’s known that people whistle for other reason than worshiping Sheidim (of course I agree that worshiping Sheidim is completely Assur). And if I recall correctly, the Maharam Al-Ashkar in a Tshuvah brings down that idea for more than just Zugos.
Shlishi: Some comparisons are obvious. Comparing R’ Moshe to any Shul Rav or Rebbe in a Yeshivah now is obvious. Comparing, say, Rav Schachter to Rav Belsky is not obvious at all. When people are levels apart you clearly can tell. That doesn’t mean that you can tell the difference between any two great Talmidei Chachamim (or even any two big, but not great, Talmidei Chachamim). Or are you claiming that you could look and tell the difference between Rav Ovadia and Rav Elyashiv. Or between R’ Mordechai Eliyahu and R’ Bentzion Abba Shaul? Or between R’ Chaim Kanievsky and R’ Shternbuch? Sometimes the answer is obvious. But sometimes it really isn’t for any individual to say.
Shlishi: Yes, but it’s not an assessment that should be made by individuals about individuals.
Shlishi: Why not? It’s still Talmud Torah. There’s nothing inherently special about Aramaic. It was the language of the time. I would assume one would also have to read the Artscroll footnotes though, as Artscroll themselves admit that sometimes nuances of the Gemara get lost in translation, which is why they have the notes in the first place.
Shlishi: I very rarely get involved in discussions of rating people. When someone is accepted by (almost) everybody as being a certain caliber, then there is no need to rate them. I think it’s more or less accepted who is of that caliber. When I said “fairly big”, I meant a Shul Rav or Rebbe in a major Yeshivah who is respected but is not recognized as being one of the generation’s leading Talmidei Chachamim.
WIY: That’s strange. I have heard the statement by R’ Shlomo Zalman said in several places so it’s fairly Yadua, and I will B”N try and find the place in the Igros where I saw something similar.
OOM: Although I’ve seen the father of the child be comppassionate toward her, It has been told to me that his parents never showed compassion toward him as a child,- it is possible tht it stems from this,
The “him” in that statement was referring to the father.
Itche: I don’t disagree. There are enough other options nowadays that the Heter M’chirah really shouldn’t be necessary. All it really is now is a “Limud Z’chus” on those who wouldn’t keep Shmittah at all anyway. I have heard some fairly big (no one huge though) Rabbonim say that because there are legitimate Shittos that hold of it it’s okay for those who use it.
Shraga: See the SH”A OC 553:3 (if I recall correctly) where he says “Yeish Mi Sheomer that it’s Assur to learn by Hirhur on Tishah B’av”. Thus, learning by just reading has some sort of tangible meaning, even though according to the SH”A you can’t make a Bracha on it. (I’m not sure what this Halachah proves though, as you could attempt to learn just about any way from it-that Hirhur doesn’t count but it’s M’sameach; or that it really does count as learning it’s just that for a Brachah you need a Ma’aseh, which reading only with one’s eyes cannot accomplish.)
Both of these are brought down as things not to do in Kabbalistic sources. Pashtus is that we hold like the Gemara in the last Perek of P’sachim on these types of Inyanim.
Shraga: R’ Schachter once told me that you can make a Siyum if you only read the words and didn’t say them out loud.
Yekke2: The source for that is the Shulchan Aruch Harav in Hilchos Talmud Torah (brought down in the Kitzur Shulchan Aruch). For Torah Shebiksav you only have to read according to him. But Torah Sheba’al Peh you must both read and understand, if I recall correctly. (It is a Chiddush though. Pashtus should be that to get credit for Talmud Torah one would have to understand Torah Shebiksav as well.)
Vochindik: With all due respect to the Maharal, his works are Aggadic, not Halachic. Therefore, quoting him in a Halachic argument is not as powerful. Also, this position is seemingly against a Gemara. One Amora on Kesuvos 20a (if I recall correctly) tries to answer up an opinion by saying that R’ Meir must hold that lying on a Shtar is Yeihareg V’al Ya’avor for the Eidim. The Gemara rejects this opinion by saying that we know that only Shfichus Damim, Giluy Arayos, and Avodah Zarah are Yeihareg V’al Ya’avor, so it can’t be that even a Tanna (who we don’t hold by, in this case) holds that there is another one. Thus, it is very problematic for the Maharal here to be adding a fourth.
WIY: I do not think that’s true. I know of a very Choshuv Rov who has his son carry for him all the time. (That could be, however, because he refuses to use any Eruv, not because he holds that one in particular is bad.)
Kozov: On his Peirush on Avos by Chavivin Adam Shenivra B’tzelem and also quoted in the Machzor Vitry.
Shlishi: That’s not 100& accurate. Look at the Pischei Tshuvah on this Siman.
Wolf: In this case, one may not follow R’ Yaakov Emden’s position, even if one follows him for everything, because unless I am mistaken he based that position on the Sefer B’samim Rosh, which we now know was a forgery, not written by the Rosh, and actually was an attempt to undermine the Halachic system.
WIY: You need all 10 to have eaten. You just only need 7 who ate Hamotzi.
WIY: I believe R’ Shlomo Zalman and R’ Moshe, among others, say that as long as the person has a legitimate opinion to rely on then there’s no Lifnei Iver to give him something that you hold is Assur for you. The two examples that I hears B’Sheim R’ Shlomo Zalman (by a very Chareidi Rav, so this shocked me to here) were Eruvin and the Heter Mechirah.
So that’s the new order of the day? When an Adam Gadol says something that you don’t like, he’s just no longer an Adam Gadol? You should go to the Torah Temimah’s Kever and ask Mechilah.
I used to write in all of my Sefarim. Now I jot all of my comments (which aren’t many) in a spiral notebook.
It’s Siman 79, isn’t it? Porsin Al Shma? And the Shittos range anywhere from just 1 to all 10, if I recall.
Of course. The importance is understanding it, not just reading words. In fact, if you read the words in Aramaic but didn’t understand them then you cannot make a Siyum. (If I recall correctly, R’ Moshe has a Tshuvah where he says if you just learned the Gemara without Rashi then it’s like you didn’t understand it and you can’t make a Siyum.)
Rob: Even if they’re made for women, it could still be Beged Ish. It depends upon what the prevalent custom is as to who wears that type of clothing.
Ready now: In what several ways does the Torah make it clear that women didn’t wear trousers? In fact, Pashtus is that there is a Takanas Ezra that they have to (at the very least under their skirts).
Health: Maybe it’s because even with farmers attempting to irrigate it, Eretz Yisrael laid barren for almost 2000 years?
To second what Kozov said, someone who holds like Rashi on the corporeality of G-d nowadays would be an Apikores, plain and simple.
Der Rav: That wasn’t the Kiddush Hashem. I don’t think it’s a Chillul Hashem as she’s a Tinokes Shenishba, but yes, there were several Issurim involved in being a gymnast. However, that does not negate the Kiddush Hashem of what she did afterwards.
Twisted: R’ Schachter and he has a whole list of those who agreed with him (I don’t quite recall who, but I think he always started by quoting R’ Shlomo Zalman, but I could be mistaken). It’s the one Shittah of his that’s bothered me for years. I think it’s against a B’feirush Yerushalmi.
Yytz: I know. I have sent many things to him that way.
DH: Many who don’t have the luxury of living in New York hold by R’ Moshe.
Ready now: You entirely missed my point. I was trying to, in a very nice way, say that my Rebbe’s reason is not the one the Poskim bring down.
And Shlishi, please bring me any source at all that says that the issue is that it shows the separation of the legs and not that it’s form-fitting.
Just one question Shlishi: How do you know that?
yytz: That’s strange. It’s against an explicit Gemara in Rosh Hashana (14b or 15b).
Hello99: Doesn’t the Kitzur Shulchan Aruch bring down that you may ask a second Rav so long as he’s greater than the first and as long as you tell him the P’sak you got first?
Ready now: You are mixing concepts and arguments like nothing else. My Rebbe told me that the reason women can’t wear pants is because it shows the separation of the legs. Which is fine. So I would be uncomfortable saying that a girl can wear even very loose pants. But when most of the Poskim talk about it they say that the issue is that it shows the form of the legs, not just the separation. So if they were loose enough to not show the form at all then there shouldn’t really be a problem. And if the Poskim say it’s not a problem, then that means that a normal guy wouldn’t think anything improper if he just sees her. It’s nice to bring up additional concepts to worry about, but if the Poskim weren’t worried about it then why are you?
Shraga: It is possible to watch the Olympics without seeing non-Tznius women, isn’t it?
Shraga: Maybe, maybe if a person knows for sure that he will feel no attraction or have Hirhurim from the events then it’s Muttar to watch, but it would very much not be recommended. And to anyone who would claim that they can watch without any attraction, I would quote R’ Bina: “You’re either lying or you’re gay.”
I forget the name. There was something called Heaven’s Bakery or Heavenly Bakery that makes oat Challah. But a fair number of Poskim do hold that oats aren’t Hamotzi as the cause of being Hamotzi is the fact that they have gluten.
Choppy: True, which is why I wouldn’t watch it. But you can’t say anything personally against her as she’s a Tinokes Shenishbah.
RA: Hal’vai that I could make a living as a Ba’al Korei.
PBA: I don’t know about that. There’s nothing wrong with respecting someone for being best in the world at something. They can be an inspiration. HKBH gave them Kochos and they used them to the utmost. I respect the world’s greatest athletes the same way I respect the world’s best artist or musician, etc. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. (Respect doesn’t mean wishing to emulate; many of these great athletes earn respect with their accomplishments but lose personal respect because of their other actions.)
I once heard a Rov state it best: Judaism does not believe in relaxation. Purposeless relaxation is a waste of time and Assur. However, we do believe in recreation. Recreation means any activity used to recharge so that one can return to Torah stronger. This can include anything from taking a nap, a walk, following sports, or even hobbies like building model cars or doing puzzles. The main point is that Kol Kavanosas Yih’yu L’sheim Shamayim and that the person be honest with themselves about this.
Choppy: That’s precisely my point. When you take Kashrus too far, it’s not Kashrus anymore. When you take Shabbos too far, it’s not Shabbos anymore. Just like when you take Lashon Hara too far, you’re not even within the parameters of Lashon Hara anymore. Halachah gives us parameters. And some Shittos are more Meikil and some are more Machmir. In some concepts, we look for the Mekilin. In some, we look for the Machmirim. In most, normative Halachah is somewhere in the middle. But when you completely leave the parameters then you are not even in the Parsha of that Halachah anymore. So yes, it’s possible too go overboard on any concept, either so far Lekula that you are no longer within the parameters of the Halachah or so far L’chumra.
I don’t understand the whole concept of saying Ein Simcha Ela B’vasar by Simchas Yom Tov anyway. Doesn’t the Gemara immediately say that that was only referring to Basar of Korbanos?
Choppy: Well, it seems like I had that explained before your post even showed up. Do you disagree with me about how that can have terrible consequences as well?
Choppy: Actually, this was a not Frum woman. Apparently those pants were considered very stylish a few years back.
Choppy: I didn’t say it was okay or right. All I was saying, after the fact, is that there may not have been actual Chillul Shabbos involved.