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Pew 2021: 47% of currently married non-O Jews are intermarried, with 60% of those who married after 2010 and 18% of those before 1980. So, for those who are 40 y.o. numbers are like Avira says or higher.
other findings:
First intermarriage is quickly followed by 2nd: among those who have one Jewish parent, 80% have non-Jewish spouse.
40% Of R- have some “in common” to O-. 76% of C-s. No branch 24%/
50% O- feels some in common with R-, 63% to C-. So, it is about mutual.
Interestingly, in each group there are 7-9% of those who do not feel in common with their own group.Among 65+ 44% are R, 25% C, 22% none, 3% O
Among 18-29, 29% are R, 8% are C, 41% are none, 17% are OAmerican democracy is built on the free speech idea that everyone can say whatever they want, and, after hearing them all, the voters will make their reasonable, if not perfect, choices, and complicated multilevel system will make it so that one bad choice will not ruin the country, like it happened in Weimar republic.
Jewish debating rules are different, and we all are supposed to strive for truth and not mislead each other. So I am surprised to see here people repeating partisan slogans without trying to bring it to some level of truth. It is unbecoming.
When isro said Baruch Hashem, it was an embarrassment for the Jews.. so even then nonjews were faster at acknowledging Him. Jews tend to complain first.
I don’t know specific statistics of who is or is not Jewish in each temple, but there are currently millions of Jews either affiliated with reform or not affiliated who don’t know much and are being lost, and all most people here seem to worry is how they affect “us” … I understand such feelings during the time of tzoros like when reform or communists were attacking us, but not nowadays.
Ejmr, you are following Rehoboam preferring young advisors to older ones with disaster to follow. If you aren’t sure what I mean, ask your wife to locate this gemora for you
Ujm, it’s not just salary, it is also lifestyle choices. In some professional settings, people are tied to a conveyor, in others, you can take time off for learning and family … It is not of course fully goes by degree, there are lawyers on firms and independent ones, and there are plumbers who are in charge of their life, but generally more education gives you more control.
At the very least, the guy could have said: b’h there were only four people at the minyan!
Syag > erroneous view of what you are trying to fix
well, just list what you disagree with rather than musing about my character. I am really interested in hearing different opinions, especially if they give some explanations. You can also look at the nearby threat of colleges, where OP coming up with seemingly such list of colleges that give you BA for no work. Anyway, we need to define what the goal of the degree is and a path to it. But overall I think the middle path is the right one – not the fancy ivies and not the degree mills, but reasonably-priced local or online or NYC Jewish colleges that give quality education without exposing to hurtful environment.
RebE +10
similar quote: a person who tells his son to learn Torah will raise a man who will be telling his son to learn Torah.
EJMRBro, I applaud the idea of doing BA, or better BS, quickly and moving on Masters, but make sure you actually learn something. You don’t have to demand more from the college, you can use online resources like Khan Academy or MOOCs. If you end up a professional, whether a lawyer or an office manager, you need to provide honest service for the money you will be paid. If you can not, you will be stealing or fired or both.
Syag > how much enjoyment you get out of painting the learning community as a bunch
Syag, not much. I am saying what I am saying in a hope to make things better. I actually think it is very reasonable to send kids to a local cheap school. For sure better than to send to expensive mid quality school far away to study who knows what as many modern people do. I am sorry that I am not very good at cheering people up: when I start analyzing the problem, I immediately start thinking what can be improved. Offline, I might keep it to myself, but I see no reason not to express opinion here where we have a chance to discuss it. I am not the only one (not to compare, but to illustrate). R Steinsaltz once showed a video of some guy from CT approaching Lubavitcher Rebbe to tell him that their community just built a mikva. Rebbe replies I give you a brocha to build a mikva. The guy thinks that Rebbe is not hearing well and repeats louder that they _already_ built the mikva! The Rebbe repeats, the guy gets louder, etc, until the Rebbe clarifies – I give you a brocha to build the next mikva.
Touro
YU/Stern
Michlalah
Univ of Mryland, Baltimore
John Hopkins
Florida State
Arizona State
McGilljackk > They prevented the will of a majority of Americans. That is not democracy.
jackk, I don’t know how old you are or where you were born, but you need to level with the fact that you live in a republic, not a democracy. Pure democracy was considered a failure for most of human history, and I don’t think it was a Jewish thing also. 20th century “people’s democracies” just proved the point, that on an island with 9 poor people and one rich one, the nine will take everything from the rich and execute him even if they are losing the minyan.
EEEE, could you recap?
Orange,
the main advance is having rapid tests that CDC/FDA was not approving for a long time because they are not as good as PCR. The role of the tests is statistical – it shows with high probability that someone is infectious right then, rather then telling 3 days later that someone has a minute amount of virus with 100% probability.It probably matters a lot for people who are in risky environment but not so much that nobody cares and everyone is getting sick … then, removing those who are sick will stop transmission even if it does not guarantee safety of one individual. There are lots of “interesting” techniques – batch testing, where spit of multiple people is tested in one shot; wastewater monitoring that quickly picks up the virus in population even if they don’t bother to go to doctors. I am not sure all of this is used correctly and timely, but it is getting better. Many colleges test a lot and post numbers publicly. One college near me has 100 times more cases this week comparing with October.
Orange, it is not just 4 tests. Starting Jan 15, insurance is supposed to reimburse everyone for several tests a month. It is a somewhat INSANE idea to make it go through insurance companies instead of government paying CVS directly – so that people are deterred by paperwork and paying upfront. It is a DOUBLE INSANE idea to see the problem growing in December and announce reimbursement from mid-January. I understand that in Europe these tests are all over the place, free or a couple of euros. If money is an issue with such large volumes, maybe make these tests accept batches from families, if this can work.
Same goes with masks – 3M seem to sell 60 N95 masks for under $50. Why are they not all over the place already and were waiting for the website to be built.
> And Yeshiva boys speaking inappropriately at the table or in the beis medrash or at any other time should also be corrected by their rebbes/menahels.
Rebbeim may not be there. I heard it from an esteemed Rav that when Magid Shiur will tell them that they are skipping the next blatt, the boys will be spending that might learning through it … Things are different now with Artscroll.
Ad kan? The kid went to school for like 13-14 years already, 9 to 6 every day. B’H she is going to be married in a couple of years. Maybe parents want to spend some quality time with the kid for a couple of years in between instead of sending her away to learn something else from some other people they (parents) do not know well?
+1
You also get a good feeling that you have at least one person reading your post – and carefully. In some cases, you are sure that it is exactly one person (unless there is a moderator review).
you start by Capitalizing I’s and proper site names, putting “the” where appropriate, and then davening. And using Oxford comma, of course. And not starting sentences with “and”.
RebE > What has the Senate done lately?
RebE, did you read Federalist 62 or 63 lately? [sorry for answering question with a question]
Syag, I agree that in many circumstances there is no need to test, especially w/ latest variant. I did not test so far. The reason to do home test would be if one heads to a meeting with either many people or an at-risk person and are going to be in close contact there. Then, a positive test – right before the meeting – would prevent risk. Not fully clear what does negative test mean. On one hand, stats say that those home tests are detecting 60-90% of cases. The claim on the other side is that they detect those who are most infectious at that moment, i.e. they detect the most dangerous ones.
There is an article on front page about the Rav who tested positive before his son’s wedding – after symptoms? Now, say the test would be negative – how would the grandfather pasken? Or maybe the father would not have even asked? Maybe they should do N-95 veils for kallot.
A week passed already – any good news?
Now you need awareness campaign for people who are “having a flu” to use the tests. Free might help. Maybe give prizes to people who get positive tests, or will this cause them to go out and get it? Get an extra aliya to say gomel?
We are not allowed to wear fully black, which is a non-Jewish minhag. Overall, there were different minhagim in history: in Israel, men would buy line for their wives; in Bavel – coloured clothes, if I remember correctly. Red was not OK. None were black.
Hashem sends medicine before the sickness. Not so (current) US government: it waits for a crisis, then starts sending out tests. After that, masks. After that, they’ll start working on speeding up medicines.
Gadol > there are multiple Republican leaders in the state and federal government whose policies are generally aligned with Trump but whose persona,
There are lots of leaders on both left and right who are “aligned” with the right policies, but are not capable of implementing them in real world. Say, Obama genuinely desired to have peace with the Muslim world, but ISIS refused to cooperate and Obama did not know what to do. Trump was actually able to do a lot of things he talked about, often in unusual risky ways.
Moishe, you are right that ISIS started to retreat by the end of Obama. But “started to retreat” does not mean it was “done” or that people expected it to be gone soon. See below a quote from foreign policy paper by a liberal prof. He mostly blames Obama for failure with Assad and initial ISIS growth, but you can see there that the expectation was that ISIS will keep territory and continue projecting terrorism threat to Europe. If you search news in 2016, you can see more of similar. Some specific action taken by Trump were: providing actual weapons to Kurds “as they were” instead of training some future pure force; allowing shooting targets without spending hours vetting with the White House; working effectively with Iranian militias in Iraq (thru Iraqis, without any formal partnership).
Syria Will Stain Obama’s Legacy Forever
Yet a third result of Obama’s ineffectuality lay in the rise of the Islamic State, a terrorist organization even more bloody-minded and bent on conquest than the al Qaeda fragments from which it sprang. Obama obviously did not create the Islamic State, contrary to Donald Trump’s absurd campaign-trail slanders. But his administration was laggard in countering its gathering strength. Although the terrorist outfit is on the defensive now, it continues to orchestrate deadly strikes in Europe, and, indirectly, to inspire lone-wolf attacks in the United States, guaranteeing that terrorism will remain a major threat on both continents for years to come.Avira > Rav belsky would tell some talmidim
And I believe the same is true for many other Rabonim, including R Feinstein, that their private advice depends on a person, including Rav Pam’s advice to someone NOT to go into teaching. I’ve seen some who did not ask R Pam. Obviously, only the best should go into teaching, and traditional halakha approach of allowing unlimited competition between teachers works towards same goal.
I understand the idea of learning without thinking of college. This is fine as long as there are responsible adults who will direct the turn when appropriate. But where the focus is on learning and discarding those who do not keep up, may work well to train talmidei chachamim, but less so to develop a healthy community.
Gadol, I know a number of people going this way, I just don’t know how prevalent it is, maybe others can enlighten us. Even when I was looking for a shidduch in the previous millennium, one shadchanit was musing about Lakewood bnos figuring out that learning SW in a small local college ad working as programmers is a great way to support their kollel husbands. But if this is under-radar and b’dieved, this is probably not done the best way. Kids have limited community support and insight into what they are doing and probably getting more of a diploma mill. For example, it is rare when people complain about English education, but English skills on average are horrible. It is just everyone feels inadequacy in math or science, but it seems to many that as long as you can talk in some English, this is enough. I would guess inability to write well is a barrier to a lot of jobs. You will just not be told after you send an email.
Avira
Rav Moshe re: “bnei yeshiva”
this is an important distinction that is somehow lost in translation. For me personally, it is obvious that someone going into Rabbonus & Chinuch should spend 110% of his time on limud, and maybe another 10% on getting some general knowledge so that he can apply his learning to current life and relate to his students. You don’t need to become a boke in science, but you need to acquire enough worldview to be able to learn later in life.Now, for the rest of population, we currently have multitudes going to yeshivos (parallel to masses going to college) – which is a good thing in general, but we need also to train them to earn an honest living. They do not need to go to Ivies, but they can go to local/Jewish/online colleges – and the question should be how to make it safe, not whether. For example, use yeshiva classes/CLEP/AP for humanities to avoid indoctrination, do not dorm in strange places, have hevrusas, combine w/ learning (when R Twerski wrote to Steipler whether he can go to Med school, Steipler replied – with daily hevrusa, mussar/chasidus learning, mikva, I think). I believe this is actually happening under the radar, with people using small NJ colleges to pass at lowest requirement level.
ujm, note that R Moshe is writing about 60 years ago. A lot changed. Threats changed. At that time, a college was a direct path to assimilation. Nowadays, it is still for some, but there a lot of observant professionals who have no such problems. The balance for “need” of college to earn parnosa also changed a lot. Lots of jobs that required high school only are not there any more. This caused a lot of social problems not just in a Jewish world. Note that people did not become noticeably smarter, so a lot of current “college” is really remedial high-school with credential for an office job, and not the high end college that R Feinstein was talking about (and that BY aspires to).
before election day:
61% of Ds, 64% of Rs and 63% of others planned to be vaccinated.
right after, Ds jumped to 75% Rs stayed the same. This is when a gap started.more fun stats on effect of media:
More viewers of Newsmax (40%) and Fox News (34%) correctly estimated the COVID-19 mortality rate than viewers of CNN (22%) or MSNBC (24%). Twenty-one percent (21%) of One America News (OAN) viewers correctly estimated the coronavirus mortality rate. Among Americans who say they don’t watch cable news at all, 38% correctly estimated the mortality rate as less than 2%.and some other covid numbers from the survey that some might be curious about:
those not vaccinated: 30% were positive
those vaccinated: 17%
keep in mind that 1 out of 2 years were before vaccine and number of deaths is same by year,
then year 1: 15% both groups are positive, and year 2: 15% v 2%. This may be an over-estimate but points that the difference is drastic.even better predictor of who is likely to get covid:
answer to “Which is more effective in preventing COVID-19?”
Natural immunity – 36% got it
Vaccination 14%
Equally 18%
Not sure 11% (maybe these are those who thing that none are effective and are careful?)jackk, here are self-reported numbers from Rasmussen – 26% of Rs report being positive for Covid, 21% of Ds and 18% of the smartest ones – independents. So, from this sounds like there will be indeed less R voters, although knowing age distribution by paty would help.
Other interesting stats of self-reported covid:
22% of men and 20% of women
22% married and 20% not married
24% children at home, 19% no (hey, kids!!! but could be also age)
(these 3 may explain some of the of R/D difference – R are more men and married)
13% for age 65+, 23% before
19% white, 18% black, 27% other, presuming mostly Hispanicvaccinated:
D 80%, R and independent 60%BY, I see where you are now – already away from home and looking for an Ivy.
I think your choices are
– large MO school – NY, Atlanta, Boston, LA. Each of them have strong communities and kollels where you may find a family that will help you stay strong.
– small yeshivos in same type of cities. They are often started by people who want same as you. In those places, they would know what quality secular education is and somewhat compete with those MO schools
– go back home and together with your parents organize your own education – possibly Jewish one in one place and general in another. Be creative – find partners for each of them. Say, one semester/year in a yeshiva, and one semester/year in general studies, plus summer. Tutors. Summer schools in colleges. One resource that I am using for my kids – online state schools. My older kids did this for just two last years and went to a mid-tier (online) college, having 4+ GPA and access to AP classes. Maybe more than 2 years would be needed. If your parents have time to engage with you, you can achieve a lot. My kids are saying that they are 2x more efficient when they don’t need to treck to school a t a certain time, can skip or repeat classes as they need. They are having less fun, but I don’t think that is what you are looking for.Gadol > For less than $30,000/year
Others called you on too many lawyers, but I’d like to question this fantastic number. How did we get there? For even a family of 3-4 kids, that is $100K a year – post-tax. So, for many people this means two parents working hard full time just to stay even and spend 3x time of college for 12 years of school while still facing semi-observant classmates and other problems. I know kids are priceless, but l’maaseh this means stressed unhappy families teaching kids the same.
ujm > a preferable situation if we would indeed not learn English even at the HS level
I’d love to see a pasuk that proves this. Also, who were those apikoiresim who served in Sanhedrin and knew 70 languages. Also. when Rabban Gamliel had same – 1000 – people studying Greek, as studying Torah. And how you call “non ideal” situation where we have tens of thousands boys and girls learning Torah, when 200 years ago, the only Yeshiva, Volozhin, had 400 students. (I am putting aside social issues related to assimilation, just purely focusing on learning per se).
ujm, who are those evil Ballei Batim who pay for the school but have chutzpah to insist on secular studies? At this point, they are not recent arrivals from secular Poland, but most likely graduates of the same yeshivos. Somehow, the yeshivos did not manage to skip Kiddushin so they learned that they need to teach their kids professions. The question is, if your picture is correct, and schools provide general studies reluctantly – how good they are at that, or is it really waste of time to calm down the parents? I suggest test kids where they stand in their general studies and then maybe send them somewhere else to learn those in the afternoon if ujm’s theory is right.
> Pythagorean Theorem in Kilaim 5,5 in the name of Chachmei Hamidos.
a good call not quoting in the name of Reb Pythagoras – there is no proof that he actually is the author of the theorem.
TS Baum,
you don’t need to be something just because someone else is. My personal opinion is that it is preferable to do something that you find meaningful, enjoyable, and fits your skills. For many people, a job is a way to earn parnosa, and then, after work, his “real life” starts – family, friends, learning, mitzvos, whatever.This is OK if you have to, but you are throwing away 8 or more hours a day. It becomes a real nisayon then – do you need to work so many hours just to earn money for, say, vacations, schools, house, clothes. You literally paying with your life for any spending. You can still console yourself that you take care of negative commandments – not stealing, yuhud, kahsrus, etc but not much positive.
At the same time, if you do something meaningful – being a teacher, a doctor, etc, then you are involved in mitzvos and helping people all day round. You can really enjoy that vacation (or choose to stay at work). These choices can be within a profession – you can write software for medical applications or for entertainment companies.
And enjoying and matching skills will ensure that you are successful at your job.
BY,
you first need to consider whether it is worth getting away from your parents. If you hopefully have good environment at home and your parent are supportive of your goals, you will achieve more while staying there. I heard it both from Mark Twain (“When I came back home from college, I saw how much smarter my father became!) to an O- Rabbi who spent years dealing with O- students at an OOT Hillel and penned an article calling parents to send kids to college close to home (undermining his own job). Kal vehomer for high school.So, then, find a high school in your area that is solid religiously and makes some moves towards college prep. Then, you or your parents should talk to them and see how to enhance it, or let you learn on your own for some classes. Maybe take some enhanced classes somewhere else, possibly in college.
jackk, I admit that we are losing voters with Covid. Mabe that’s why Biden is so strategic in waiting when to send out tests and masks?!
I am not sure though that your numbers add up, unless you bring some proofs:
Most unvaxed R-s are in remote areas, most unvaxed D-s are in dense cities. It may be that most of them never voted in their life. “All talk and no cattle”.On a more cheerful note, Gallup averaged their surveys over whole 2021 and concluded that country went from being +9 D to -5 R during the year. almost 10 out of those 14, though, were gained around and after election to J6. so total, it seems that R-s stand 4% higher than before 2020 elections.
Chicago has U of Chicago, Northwestern, nearby: Urbana, Indiana U/Purdue and Bloomington. Depends on the course: U Chicago is place of world-known economists, Purdue – engineering, Bloomington – business.
jackk > Palestinians knew that Trump wasn’t a fair third-party so they completely ignored any overtures for peace that he proffered. For 4 years , peace in the ME was not on the table.
You are just ignoring everything Trump actually achieved in ME, just because he did not achieve it thru the way preferred by you (and tried by others with no success), from ISIS to Abrahamic accords to Yerushalaim to pressure on Iran
> Putin is still in Crimea and is poised to go into Ukraine. Trump did zilch with him.
Trump started giving actual weapons to Ukraine and stopped further losses. Ukraine’s democracy continued to become stronger, NATO troops now “rotate” to Baltics. He send envoys to Europe to fight Nordstream 2 and also blocking Chinese participation in telecoms irritating Europeans.
>> President’s shouldn’t react to the media . They should be level-headed and listen to their advisers and decide on the best course of action.
R- presidents can’t rely on media to reach the people, unless they already chose, as you said, to listen to Fox. Trump was able to reach a lot of voters outside of traditional R-s, such as Hispanics, both by his policies and messaging.
jackk > Can you bring a single proof to these 2 points
Most thoughtful republicans and a number of moderate D-s, when interviewed at length, agree with most of Trump’s policy positions and achievements. Another experiment that you can make yourself to avoid bias: look at what was said about Trump’s ideas at the beginning: vaccine, pressure against Nordstream2, Israel-Arab talks, economic policies, stay in Mexico, tariffs on China, Covid stimulus … all were laughed at. Then, after a success, “everyone would do that”. Look how many are still in place or repeated by Biden. Yes, he did not buy Greenland yet, and HCQ did not work out for everyone, but the list of successes is impressive.
BY, you need to define what is a “good” university that you will want to attend and plan accordingly. Gadol seems to think that this got to be an Ivy. On many other places, you can get solid education as long as you are taking a harder version of each class in a non-fancy school.
Are you are looking for a career path where you are super-employed full time at a law firm or a trader? Then, you probably need to go to an Ivy. Are you planning to learn a trade, like software developer or a nurse, or an engineer? Then, you can do well with a state school or an online school if you don’t want to dorm in a non-observant place. Also, take into account our family finances. If your parents work and are paid well, they better be prepared to pay a lot for luxury colleges like Ivy or Jewish ones, it would be more rational to go to a less fancy college. If your family is not well off and you get great grades, you can get a scholarship and plan to get to MIT or Columbia.
smerel > ENDLESS investigations and allegations
I am very surprised, if not in owe, that so far none of them showed any results. Given type of businesses Trump is involved, you would think you can find enough underpaid contractors, illegal gardeners, shady tax loopholes. Remember some women nominees who turned out not to pay taxes for babysitters. So far, current worst is that T paid tzedokah to Jewish schools that were actually an indirect payment to his accountant, so the accountant had to pay taxes.
Would you eat “Esav-K” (looks like a K with hairy hands)? It was good enough for Yitzhak-avinu.