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As people here are saying, you don’t really if, and to what extent, this is true. But there is something to say about being your own person, and how this makes you behave more maturely.
The hierarchy of the question is not a big deal. He’s not trying to refute Chazal or the Nefesh Hachayim. He’s merely asking how the two can equate.
The problem is that the question takes a concept and runs with it way too far. To imply that there is no law of nature is wrong. It is likewise wrong to say that this is constantly a new world and all the items in it are replaced each instant. The idea, as expressed earlier, is merely that there is no external existence. The world depends and is made of a constant command to exist.
Rashi explains that one who recites Hallel every day is Mislotzes. He is looking fun of the lack of Nisim. This is similar to the Maharal’s explanation of the fact that there are things around that are contrary to Kvod Shamayim, and only the fact that there are rules of nature can explain this.
The more pertinent Maharal is this (from Gevuros):
וזה שאמרו ז”ל (שבת קי”ח) האומר הלל בכל יום כאלו מחרף ומגדף. פירוש כי ההלל תקנו על הנסים ועל הנפלאות שהשם יתברך עושה בעולמו, ומי שאמר הלל בכל יום, כלומר שהוא יתברך עושה נסים בכל יום מחרף ומגדף, שהרי אומר כאלו העולם אינו נוהג על הסדר והכל שלא כטבע ושלא כסדר הראוי לפי מנהגו של עולם, ואין זה חכמה וסדר אל הנבראים שנבראו בשמו ואין ספק שזהו חרוף. אלא אם שנוי הטבע והנס הוא בזמן מן הזמנים ואין זה תמידי, דודאי אם הוא בזמן אחד אין זה יציאה מן מנהגו של עולם, אבל אם אומר ההלל בכל יום הרי לא היה לעולם סדר מסודר ואין לנמצאות קיום. ואם בפירוש הלל לקמן יתבאר פירוש אחר שניהם נכונים ואמתיים.
And later, in the Pirush on Hallel (Ch. 61):
ובפרק כל כתבי (שבת קי”ח ע”א) אמרינן האומר הלל בכל יום כאלו מחרף ומגדף כלפי מעלה, והטעם שראוי שיהיה העולם נוהג כמנהגו ובשביל שהעולם נוהג כמנהגו מדותיו יתברך אמת, ואם לא היה זה שהעולם נוהג על מנהגו של עולם אם כן מדותיו יתברך אינם אמתים ח”ו כי הרשעים ועובדי ע”ז בטובה ואלו הצדיקים בצרה, אבל ענין הזה מפני שהעולם נוהג כמנהגו ולפיכך אין הקדוש ברוך הוא מאבד הע”ז מן העולם, וכך אמרינן במסכת עבודה זרה (נ”ד ע”ב) והגומר הלל בכל יום נראה שהוא אומר שבכל עת הקדוש ברוך הוא מנהיג עולמו בדרך נס, ואם כן למה הצדיקים בצרה והרשעים בטובה ואינו מאבד הע”ז מן העולם ואם כן ח”ו אין ביכלתו וזהו חרוף וגדוף. וזהו שאמרו בירושלמי שלכך הוא מחרף ומגדף מפני שאמר פה להם ולא ידברו וגו’ ואם כן למה אינו מבטלם כאלו ח”ו אינו יכול, אבל האומר הלל בזמנה אומר שהעולם נוהג כמנהגו רק בזמנים מיוחדים ולדבר מיוחד לא לכל דבר משנה הטבע רק העולם כמנהגו נוהג והקדוש ברוך הוא מחדש נסים בזמן מן הזמנים וזהו שבח לו
I wish I knew which Yerushalmi he’s referring to.
Besides for the ‘anger at Hashem’ and loss of belief due to the lack of open and speedy divine help, I’ve come to realize another cause for those who turned away from the path of their parents.
During the war, nobody was actively practicing Judaism. They couldn’t. After the war, many people found themselves technically not Orthodox. It was a decision to become again a practicing Jew.
One more point. There were those who became convinced that the world is indeed Hefker. But those who were ‘angry at Hashem’ could have been brought back with the right care. They didn’t lose their belief due to logical questions but rather it was their only way to release anger.
But not the Maharal’s.
This idea, that the creation is re-created at every instant is not found in Chazal or Rishonim. It first shows up in the above referenced Nefesh Hachayim. It is sort-of self understood within the framework of Kabbalah or Rambam ideology. If existence itself is lent from Hashem then it is a constant act of perpetuation of existence. This is applied to the Pasuk, בדבר ה’ שמים נעשו, that the substance the world is made from is D’var Hashem.
This is a fine idea, but not essential to Judaism or the Torah. It is also, seemingly, an idea that was taken a bit too far. In fact, denying the function of Sheshes Yamim might truly be undermining the Torah. As we know, keeping Shabbos is like keeping the whole Torah.
So, while pondering the lofty concept of how the whole existence hangs on, and is made up of, D’var Hashem, let’s not lose sight of the basic idea of ‘creation’. Rules of nature were crafted and the world was formed back in Sheshes Yemei Bereishis. Existence was lent and is continuously breathed from then on.
So if said alongside regular Psukei D’Zimra it would be fine then?
“הקורא הלל בכל יום וכו the reason is that he only recognizes the great miracles and doesn’t realize that כל הנשמה תהלל י-ה, as the Midrash says, על כל נשימה ונשימה תהלל י-ה, we are suppose to praise Hashem for every breath take.
That’s not the reason and who told you that he only recognizes the great miracles? The one who only recites it by the actual ‘great miracles’ really means it always whole the one reciting it every day only recognizes the great ones!? That’s upside down.
The Maharal actually explains it’s because he considers everything a miracle and doesn’t recognize the order that Hashem created.
שבת קי”ח ע”ב
הקורא הלל בכל יום הרי זה מחרף ומגדףIn Shvuos 25b it is clear that there is a Chiyuv every day. The Gemara states clearly that you cannot swear that you won’t put on Tefillin that day.
Karkafta Delo Manach Tefillin is a separate issue. It is about that Tosafos says it refers to one who never put on.
Tosafos in Shabbos 131 seems to imply that any Mitzva which is constant is bound to each day.
Whoa. Chachmei Yisroel! He’s only as good as his sources. He did a great service with this compilation but he is not a witness. The Chida complained about why he gave this much credence to Shalsheles Hakabalah, which is a collection of stories from any source.
What does he say about Merlin?
Rand0m3x, I’m quite aware of both your points but they aren’t relevant to the multitude discussions of this thread.
Gaon, when was there ever a discussion between the parties about Tzimtzum. And, when do Chassidim discuss it among themselves to make it the central point. Also, why would a specific idea of how to work out a certain Sugya cause a movement?
laskern, if there’s any one central Nekudas Machlokes between Chassidim and their opponents it is whether or Chassidim are a deviant group.
Aosak, Joseph added, “despite having grown up in a Cholov Yisroel only home” precisely because of this point.
As to wondering who made this up, I’m with you on that one. So, I can declare, just like you, that it’s weird and funny. That’s where I get off.
What in the world does your medium of Gorel have to do with the Hetter!? Are you claiming that you just got Nevua because you opened a Tanach? If Gorel is Muttar they are all Muttar. If not, none of them are. If the idea is that you Daven to Hashem to send you an inspired guidance through the Torah which includes all knowledge, that is all very nice but it pertains to the discussion of whether it works or not. These beautiful ideas don’t change the prohibition of following a Gorel.
If you ordained your Gorel with wonderful ideas it becomes holy, all of a sudden? Perhaps using a Chumash is actually way worse since you are being Mishtamesh Betagga. It’s hard to see why that would be better than reciting a Pasuk onto a wound.
Perhaps you can answer that you aren’t really relying on where it opens but will only take a hint, a Siman. Nice Hetter, but this can apply to other mediums as well. We find in the end of Medrash Eicha where Rav Hoshia tells Rebbi to view an event in a certain light because of what they where Darshening that day.
Tosafos explains that Eliezer and Yonason where allowed to use the Nichush since they did it along with a Svara.
Notice – all these were done with the highest level of Torah or sort of NeVuah. The words of G-D i.e. Torah or Neviim Kesuvim. I never heard one opening even a Gemorah.
“Goralos” if you are referring to Goral Ha’Gra that is done with a Chumash as well…So you just made up a classification in order to have a Taana on people. You also ignored part of the list.
Well, I meant the Goral Hagra along with the the whole Sefer Goralos from Reb Chaim Vittal.
Neville, not at all. The point is that it is not a fair comparison. For Halacha we never followed any supernatural advice. But for other matters we’ve had Neviim, Urim Vetumim, Chalomos, Psok Li Psukecha, Goralos (not sure how some Goralos are better than others, but they’ve been around), signs from Shamayim (by those who got them), ‘Muskal Rishon’.
In general, the Sugyos of supernatural are very involved, as the Rashba points out, and unfortunately are almost always dealt with wide-brush, universal attitude one way or the other.
So R’ Moshe can do what a Navi and the Urim Vetumin can’t?
I actually have a hard time believing anyone is truly insulted. Rather, they are “offended” for other people’s sake. How dare you joke about eating if fat people exist!!? From the tiny sampling of posters on this thread, it seems that actual overweight people aren’t offended.
I didn’t even find this video gluttonous. It didn’t delve into how tasty steak is or how luscious and juicy some other food is. I get turned off when I hear inspirational speakers extolling the virtues of food and this was not in that category. But here too, if I weren’t actually repulsed by such talk, but still pontificate against it, I probably wouldn’t discern between them, and I’d attack this as well.
Why would you bypass a filter? Are you desperate to get something?
If you don’t want to browse throw out the browser? If you’re afraid that your shadow will re-download a browser throw out the store app. If your shadow might get hold of that too, he might also secretly buy a non-kosher smartphone.
Amaleq as a nation is gone since the days of Shaul Hamelech. Haman was an individual in Persia.
I didn’t speak of any noise.
You are going through contortions to different bridge between a timer and a thermostat. Well, the difference is clear. It all has to do with the beholder. An I watching Melachah going on by itself or a Keili that’s left on.
Soaking dyes over Shabbos can also be a factory in operation. However, it isn’t noticed. It’s missing the Avsha Milsa aspect.
Joseph, would you mind elaborating?
Neville, actually in my own childhood, IIRC, air conditioners didn’t completely shut off. The thermostat controlled the compressor.
The Svara of Reb Moshe that you can run a factory is not original. The Gemara refers to this as Avsha Milsa. This is not Maris Ayin. It is Zilzul Shabbos due to the fact that an overt Melacha is happening. We don’t care about Shvisas Keilim but something that we see as a Melacha is Zilzul Shabbos.
Therefore, this situation can and did change regarding air conditioners. Having a timer run a drill is Zilzul but having a timer or thermostat run an air-conditioner is just as good as leaving it on.
This is why I said that you don’t even assume someone turned it on. I’m speaking about a weekday. The sound of an air conditioner going on is not anymore the sound of Melacha.
If a Christian recognizes the inherent issue, don’t you think a frum yid will be asked (acher meah vesrim)how he can do something that even Christians realized was wrong?
Do you know Reb Moshe’s famous retort to that?
Zdad, wasn’t he somewhat religious?
The reason why his Psak would be different today is because when you walk past a house an you hear the air conditioner go on, you don’t even assume that someone just turned it on. The factors that go into making something a Zilzul Shabbos have changed.
The issue is not that by being healed the person is actually being Oved the AZ. The problem is that he’ll follow the belief. This can obviously not apply when there is no belief and only the detractors are trying to dig up Apikursus origins. The issue applies to the belief of the practitioner, not the history.
As I said, the Rashba even suggests that Kishuf should be Muttar for healing.
I have no issue with complaints against alternative stuff. You wanna make a public awareness of the dangers of not following your doctor? Fine. You want to explain that this is in fact Assur? Go ahead. Just don’t make up Halachos. We have enough things labeled Avoda Zara, Kefira, and even Chazer Traif. It’s time to pick another Issur. Conflating these Issues is Mamesh Kali Hakerem.
From now on just carry with you a Muslim rug. Just put it down in the gutter and nobody will bother you.
Avoda Zara means one thing only, Avoda. Avoda is worship. Believing or attributing things and power is bad Hashkafa. Call it Apikursus if you want. It’s not Avoda Zara.
Now, it’s obviously funny to call an act Apikursus. Well, it’s worse to call an act in your own livingroom Avoda Zara.
Our Masechta Avoda Zara is growing larger than that of Avraham Avinu. Add alternative medicine, joining the Israeli army, having a smartphone, going to a Mekubal, getting a Bracha from a Rebbe, asking advice from a Talmid Chacham. Wow. Each one has many Prakim. Vehamachmir Tavi Avdo.
Are you saying that whoever does Kishuf also did Avoda Zara? So does a Kishuf practitioner get Skila? Does someone getting healed through Kishuf get Skila? The Rashba suggests that Kishuf is actually Muttar for healing. If you want to invoke Darkei Emori that’s one thing. But calling everying Aoda Zara just because you already hate it and consider it fraudulant is not Kehalacha.
If the person bows in front of the idol but has in mind that he is bowing to Hashem (sort of how Yaakov Avinu bowed in front of Esav — no Issur anyhow) he did not actually transgress Avoda Zara and it isn’t punishable.
Let’s fix that up a bit. This is correct only if bowing is not actually its Avoda. If bowing is its Avoda then he has to bring a Chattas but there is no Misa.
Who says it doesn’t work? I once saw somewhere (I don’t remember where) that the ta’ava for a”z was that it worked – through koach hatumah. Not ch”v a separate r’shus, but rather allowed by Hashem to to give us s’char for following His will even if it means foregoing the benefits.
You are referring to the Machloqes Rebbi Yosi and Rebbi Akiva in Sanhedrin 90.
Who said it’s a lifestyle?
Quoting Rabbi Miller about the internet today is as relevant as quoting Reb Moshe on the use of timers.
Daas Yochid, that is in front of the idol. Bowing is an Avoda to it. Besides, as you probably know, Ahava v’Yirah is actually not considered real transgression of Avoda Zara. Only when it is actually accepted. If the person bows in front of the idol but has in mind that he is bowing to Hashem (sort of how Yaakov Avinu bowed in front of Esav — no Issur anyhow) he did not actually transgress Avoda Zara and it isn’t punishable.
RebYidd23, meditation, positive thinking probably helps more than placebo.
So a spiritual dream is Avoda Zara?
There is no Avoda.
The practitioners’ beliefs are okay, but they’re doing an aveirah.
This is upside down. How can someone be Oved Avoda Zara without Avoda Zara!? Please find me an example. Is this really worse than actual Kishuf? Kishuf is based on Avoda Zara ideology but is still not considered Avoda Zara.
Zdad, regarding protests not help the Shabbos cause, absolutely. In fact, I doubt anyone here argues.
Ubiquitin, yes the Rambam says that a king has the right to create laws on top of the Torah, for the sake of society. And he may create his own punishments as well. In fact, even Beis Din can punish more severely than what is prescribed in the Torah if they see that the times call for it.
However, deciding between two people who is the rightful owner is different.
You want to see a protest against some neighborhood youngsters? Protests, by nature, are against a government. Youngsters are admonished.
However, you do give up admonishing after a while. But maybe we can be Yotze armchair Macha’a right now:
Antagonizing soldiers is wrong, counterproductive, despicable, and a Chilul Hashem!
There isn’t an actual Halacha derived. It mentions a Psak in the story. That is not the same thing.
For example, the Gemara discusses distances on earth in relation to the Zmanim. We know they meant it in the full meaning of the word since they are discussing practical ramifications. However, in this case, Chazal hadn’t derived anything practical from the story.
In fact, we don’t ‘Pasken‘ like any of Shlomo Hamelech’s trick Psakim. We can’t use motherly love, as proof of parenthood, in a Beis Din. Shlomo Hamelech saw the whole situation, it might have included Ruach Hakodesh, and being an undecidable case it might have allowed for Shuda deDayne—assumption of the judge.
As to the oddity of the story, first of all, this is not in Gemara or even Medrash Rabbah. So, if you have a hard time with it ignore it. There are other weird stuff about Shlomo Hamelech out there which, given the obsession of other nations about Shlomo Hamelech, I assume there are stories that originate from without.
This is what happened with the famous story of the two brothers trying to lighten the load of the other in the middle of the night, on the spot of the future Bayt al-Maqdis. It appears to be an Arabic story that made its way in a couple of centuries ago.
However, being that Tosafos mentions it, I’ll regard it as legitimate.
Now, a Sheid is not completely a physical being. They drive physical things and are basically related to the material world, but they aren’t actually composed of matter. Perhaps it can be said that just like our soul is manifest in a body, their personality is manifest in motion, changes, and action. Therefore, the whole story about the capture of Ashmedai should be read in this light. Shlomo Hamelech knew how to capture this non-physical being to be able to utilize it’s resources. To the outside observer, there was nothing to see other than amazing success.
In this story too, this strange guy showed up from nowhere, or perhaps he was born to a local family this way (which would explain the marrying and application of Jewish law) and the Medrash is informing us that this was Ashmedai’s doing. He pulled up this form of human from other worlds and applied it here.
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