Ex-CTLawyer

Has your 21 year old learned a trade, finished the required education to get a professional or tradesman’s license; prepared to work and earn enough of a living to support a wife/children without parental or government welfare?
If the answer is no, he is not prepared for marriage

@The Little I Know
I am also licensed in NY and do some work there, generally in Westchester County and upstate, not the city or Long Island,
I know about the Get Law. Any Civil Divorce I handle that involves Jewish clients has as part of the agreement that a Get will be obtained within X amount of time and be paid for by Y party. This agreement removes the impediment to remarriage and has satisfied the judges I have appeared before (I use this in CT also). I had a husband who refused to make the appointment for the Get as agreed in the Civil Divorce (I represented the wife) I hauled him back before the divorce judge on a contempt motion. The judge told him that if the terms of the divorce were not complied with the now ex-husband would be held in contempt, fined and jailed. The judge did not consider this a religious issue which could violate First Amendment rights, but a contract issue. The Get was just one required step for which there had been an offer, acceptance and consideration making the contract biinding on the parties. The appointment for a Get was made within 48 hours and one issued in 10 days.

The Get Beis Din which you refer to is the type I use most often. The sofer is the Dayan, his driver is often on of the three, or they are the aforementioned Rebbis from the local Chabad Day School. Again, because the Civil Divorce has already been granted they don’t have to deal with settlement, custody, counseling to save the marriage. They just make sure there is a kosher divorce and that the parties are free to remarry and that any future offspring will mt be momzerim.

BTW, as I have posted before over the years, I will not handle a divorce for a Jewish client unless they agree in advance to a get. It does not matter whether they are frum or reform, that’s my standard. These are not considered forced gittim (I asked the shailah decades ago) because the person seeking to engage my services is free to hire any other licensed attorney in the jurisdiction.

That said less than 5% of my divorce cases involve Jewish clients and I prefer it that way.

The easiest way to procure a rabbi who will facilitate the Get and not try to change your mind is to already have completed a civil divorce, custody and alimony arrangements (if need be) and no no longer be living under the same roof.

Rabbis generally accept those circumstances as a fait accompli. As a family law attorney who has handled divorces for many decades I am speaking form my clients’ experiences. I and a number of Jewish divorce attorneys keep a file of Rabbis who can move things along.

Locally, I use a Chabad rabbi (multi generation family in the community). He has one quick phone call with both divorcing parties, arranges a convenient date and brings in a scribe from NY and supplies the eidim from his school staff.
From start to finish can be as quick as ten days,
Some clients don’t deal with a Rabbi, instead they call a Beis Din directly.

Unlike years ago, now one must make sure the Get is issued by an authority recognized by the Rabbanut in Israel if there is a chance of either remarriage there or additional children that may be born who might want to marry in Israel in the future.

@DovidBT
I have no idea……I’ve never given it thought and haven’t seen a movie in many years

@Gadolhadorah
The government has to be cautious who they place children with. There is a great liability if bad things happen.
When Hurricane Maria hit Puerto Rico, there were thousands of youth (American Citizens) shipped to the mainland to attend school while PR rebuilt.
They had to first be assigned to licensed foster parents, unless a close family relationship could be proven (sibling, aunt, uncle, grandparent). CT DCF set up a rush licensing course for secondary relatives (Cousins, etc) that took 7 days of classes, home visits and background checks. Normally, the licensing process takes a minimum of 6 months.
Government can act fast if it wants to do so.

While many of you are making light of this.
Adoption is a serious matter.
I speak from personal experience as an adoptive parent and professional experience as a Family Law attorney who has handled many adoptions in Probate and/or Surrogate’s Court.

As mentioned above I have no problem with the old system of sponsoring immigrants and guaranteeing they will not end up as public charges.
Immediately after WWII, my zaidy Z”L sponsored more than a hundred survivors, bringing them from the DP camps and providing jobs in his clothing factories. In 1956, my father Z”L sponsored a dozen Jewish families who escaped the Hungarian uprising.

A legal adoption involves home studies by licensed professionals and proper documentation and court approvals, both in the country where the adoption takes place and where the adopted person settles with the new parents. One mistake can cause a lifetime of grief and aggravation.
It is neither cheap or quick.

Will gun control stop all mass shootings?
Will making heroin illegal stop its abuse?

The quick answer is no, BUT
Gun control will reduce the number of mass shootings. We saw that during the years we had an assault type weapon ban in place
Heroin is already illegal, so your question is flawed.
However, there are some people who might not try the illegal drug because of fear of the consequences of conviction of breaking the law.

Why ask this only of Democrats/Libs.
I know both Republicans and Conservatives in favor of Gun Control (I live within a 20 minute ride of Sandy Hook).
I don’t personally know a single adult advocating that heroin be made legal

@Coffee Addict
After Tisha B’Av we are entitled to levity and joy.
I closed the office for the day.
My family is all here at the compound. 85 degrees, sunny. The swimming pool is refreshing.
Just grilled a load of rib steaks, asparagus and native sweet corn for supper.
Tonight’s entertainment was a sons/nephews vs. sons-in law/nieces’ husbands basketball game. Aftler Maariv we shall set off legal fireworks.

Who needs to fight traffic to the Catskills or pay through the nose for camp. All the under 18 grandchildren, nieces, nephews, great nieces and great nephews have been here since school ended in June. The single 18-23 year olds will be here for bein hazmanim or until college/grad school starts. Mrs. CTL and my siblings are also here to enjoy and supervise. No worries about predators in camp counselor clothing. If at all possible family supervision is best, be it leisure, learning or business.

@Ubiquitin

“A Cake has to have some flour”

Really??????? Talk to me come Pesach when I make flourless cheesecakes and chocolate cakes

What about a cake of soap?

@Whitecar
I don’t often agree with Joseph, BUT I shall take up the first part of his post.
I was President of an OU synagogue that had an open parking lot 7 days a week. The Rabbi did not object, as long as he had a minyan of shomer Shabbos members, the rest could do as they wished. They made up the bulk of membership and paid the bills. He was not a YU type, but from a major Brooklyn Yeshiva and an honoree of the Agudah at their annual dinner in NY during my presidency.
His father, was Rav at another OU afilliated synagogue in CT and they also had an open parking lot.

Here in the country, most Jews do not live within walking distance of shul and many drive. Even the area Chabad shuls don’t chain the parking lots. My local shul is an OU member. We chain our lot, but most of the members drive and park at the church next door. The church members use our lot for overflow parking on Sundays which are not Yuntif.

I can not speak to the OO comment as I have no direct knowledge of that.

@Coffeeaddict
People such as my family, who ate out regularly would new places not in the neighborhood. If we didn’t care for it, no big deal, we’d try someplace else next time.
My grandparents who lived in Brooklyn and the Bronx had cars since the 1920s, so driving to Queens or Manhattan to dine was not unusual. No one had to schlep on the subway or bus.

@Yitzyk
I apologize for this late reply, but have had a client trial the past 2 weeks and little time for diversion.
Yes, I was able to pay my children’s tuition, by hard work and sacrificing other things. My kids and grandkids didn’t/don’t go to summer camp, they spend the summer here under family supervision at a much lower cost.
I was part of the movecause of ment to get out local day schools/yeshivas made constituent agencies of Federation for funding purposes. It also allows the Jewish Family Service to do the scholarship screening and tuition determination. This keeps all private information truly private and real professionals determine need.
In the late 1970s I spearheaded a major area fundraising campaign to guaranty no Jewish child would be turned away from the local school because of tuition needs. We raised more than $5Million from the greater community for an endowment. The endowment is managed by professionals of the local Jewish Foundation. No yeshiva administration can dip into the scholarship endowment for operational funds or to fix a leaky roof.
We have convinced local institutions to share costs and purchasing. The Chabad school and the Schechter school made a combined deal for computers and science lab equipment at a much lower cost than either could get alone.
We established a committee of professionals to write grant applications for funding from many private corporations. Most yeshivos don’t think the Fortune 500 Goyische companies are a funding source, but they are.
My youngest graduated high school years ago, but that did not stop my commitment to raise and give tuition assistance funds. There are many like me here OOT who are willing to work with the non-Frum community to assure Jewish education. I don’t see this cooperation in town.

As for your last request for donations to a specific yeshiva, let me tell you about the fundraising system in place in our area day schools for at least 35 years. In addition to tuition, each family is required to fundraise XXX dollars per year (selling raffle tickets, etc) OR write a check in that xxx amount. Those who can afford to write a check do so, others work hard to raise the charity funds. The schools also give x dollars credit for those who volunteer at school events, etc. It is not unusual to see grandmothers helping in the cafeteria every day. They get the benefit of being out of the house with young people and while not paid, the value of their time counts towards a family’s obligation.
What could you offer the school to offset some tuition and save them on expenses? You need to be creative in your approach. One of my neighbors had his teenage boys cut the Day school lawn and plowed snow in exchange for a needed tuition break

@Coffeeaddict
“Nobody knows the quality of the restaurant that isn’t in the neighborhood”

What a false generalization…………….
I was born and raised in CT. We did lots of eating out in NYC, not our neighborhood.
In my dating days, Top Manhattan picks were Moshe Peking, LaDifference and Lou G. Siegel…none of these
were in the neighborhood, but we sure knew their quality.
In Brooklyn we often ate at Shang Chai, not our neighborhood,

People who dine out with regularity know the quality of restaurants outside their neighborhood. The internet has helped provide that information.

Ancedote:
In 1972 I had an obligatory shidduch date with the niece of my 10th grade rebbi’s wife. I picked the young lady up at her home in Boro Park. She knew from her aunt that I had driven in from CT after work and that we were going out for dinner. We drove into Manhattan to the restaurant. After being seated and handed a menu she seemed confused with the process. It turns out at age 19 she had never been to a restaurant. The only time she had ever eaten outside of a home was at school or a simcha. She never had to choose a meal for herself from a variety of choices. Needless to say this was a one and done situation. She would never have fit in with my family and lifestyle.
The rebbi’s wife never bothered me again

@Workingboy

I understand your frustration.
Your shadchan did you a disservice in fixing , you up with BY and Seminary girls.
My sons and daughters are also professionals who finished Yeshiva then colleg and graduate degrees and professional licensing,
A competent shadchan would have been fixing you up with young ladies pursuing similar goals who don’t expect their spouse to sit in kollel and be supported by others.

The mothers and fathers network does a better job making introductions for those young frum adults in the professions and business world than the average shadchan can do,
It’s called networking and it works well.

My eldest daughter, an attorney in my firm, who also is an RN was set up with a Frum young man in her law school by a female Jewish professor who has taught both of them, though they had not been in the same class together. The professor had got to know both students well and made a great suggestion, They have been married a few years, both work in my firm and they have given us 2 lovely grandchildren so far.

Mrs. CTL and I were introduced by our mothers who knew each other well. It’s almost 50 years marriage for us. Both mothers knew we’d be college and profession types and had similar interests.

Over the decades, Mrs. CTL has invited young adults to our home for Shabbos and Yuntif to give them a chance to meet and mix. Sometimes, one of them will find that another isn’t for them, but might be perfect for a specific friend, the connection is made and there have been a number of marriages resulting.

My negative view of most shadchanim is that they do not really know the young adults. It is not like it was 50 or more years ago when one was likely to be fixed up with someone in your own community, shul, or relatives

@Redleg
Had Congress not raised the Social Security reserve funds for decades, they would have been earning interest to pay benefits.
In a Ponzi scheme, the capital never is invested, it is immediately paid out to early investors and the originator skims the bulk of the money.
For decades Social Security was solvent, then Congress misappropriated the capital. Congress also did not make sure the matching governmental contribution was made for each employee, thus causing the problem.

A Ponzi scheme is set up to defraud investors. Social Security was set up as mandatory retirement (and later disability) insurance. Congress defrauded the participants later on, but that was not the intent under the New Deal.

@Listenandthink
“There is no such thing as a conservative or reform “shul”….they are only referred to as “temples”

You are showing your ignorance, bias or a victim of self reference criteria reasoning.
‘Shul’ is a Yiddish word, not everyone speaks or uses Yiddish.

Temple is an English word.
My parents grew up in NYC. If they heard/read the word Temple associated with a synagogue name they assumed it was Reform, not Conservative.
In 1950 they moved to New England. In the Boston area many Orthodox synagogues has Temple as part of their name.
Typically Conservative and Orthodox synagogues here in CT use the word Congregation followed by a Hebrew word or two.
The oldest synagogue in NYC is Congregation Shearith Israel which is Orthodox, also Sephardic so the word shul does not apply.
I have been a member and/or president of 5 Orthodox synagogues in my adult life. One had 4 Hebrew words followed by the word Synagogue as its name. The other 4 were named Congregation XXXXX XXXXX.
There are Conservative synagogues I am aware of in New England that often the use the name Temple XXXXX, Some are old congregations (more than 100 years) that started as Orthodox and changed to Conservative in the mid 20th Century. An example is Temple B’Nai Abraham in Meriden, CT.

Please don’t label Jews and their synagogues based on your limited knowledge or how it is done in your neighborhood

ADHD is commonly diagnosed so that schools will receive state special education funds.

@NevilleChaimBerlin
I don’t know why you tagged me in your post of May 20 2:18PM….
I had not posted in this thread. Perhaps you meant to tag CT Rebbe

As someone whose children have been out of yeshiva for decades and handled tuition by just write check….
Please explain what an admission card is, and why it might be stealing?
Thanks

@Millhouse
we weren’t talking about Germans in Frankfurt understanding Yiddish, we were talking about Swiss in 1970
Stop trying to start arguments about nothing

You had nothing to add to my post and trying to prove others wrong by changing facts and situations is obnoxious.
In the future please scroll on by my posts as I shall do with anything you write

@Joseph
“Yiddish is the language of Ashkenazic Jewry.”
Wrong……………….
Yiddish WAS the common language linking much of Ashkenazic Jewry.
BUT it wasn’t the language of my maternal German forebears. My Oma always referred to Yiddish as a gutter language.
It wasn’t the language of much of Hungarian Jewry
My Litvish great grandparents and great great grandparents spoke Polish, Russian, Lithuanian and Yiddish.
My paternal grandparents born in NYC in the 1890s did not speak Yiddish. My father A”H born in Brooklyn 100 years ago and myself born in CT more than 65 years ago only learned Yiddish for business reasons. My siblings some as old as 75 do not speak Yiddish.

“There are those who speak Yiddish that don’t know English well (or even at all.)”
If they live in the USA, it’s about time they learn to read, write and speak English. That sentiment does not apply just to Hispanics (as the right wing complains).

“Yiddish is a unifying language for Jews from different countries and national languages (i.e. English, French, Ivrit, German, etc.)”
A completely meaningless point for an AMERICAN event. and as I’ve stated many times it is NOT a unifying language for German Jews. OMA never felt unified with the ‘peasants from the east’ who could not speak ‘real German’
My 70 year old sister went to seminary in Switzerland in the 1960s. Those girls who spoke Yiddish had a very hard time dealing with the locals, shopping, using transportation, banks, post office, etc. She learned German from our Great Grandmother and had no problem.
I learned Litvish Yiddish, I haven’t got a clue what most Galitzianers are saying when speaking Yiddish, especially when they substitute the P sound for B.

My forbears chose to leave Europe for America 150 years ago. Our unity with fellow Jews was belief and practice, not Yiddish.

If you want to attend an event that has almost all speeches in Yiddish, fine, I would not enjoy it. I’d mail my contribution and not attend

@lakewhut
Please don’t put words in my mouth.
The OP is asking about Law School Admissions, and who you know will not generally get you admitted. That said, your name, such as Kennedy, Rockefeller, Bush might move you up on the list. Legacy admissions are far more prevalent in undergraduate admissions that professional school.

I spoke about who you know aiding in bring in clients to the firm.
OP says he wants to practice corporate law, he would not generally be involved in bringing clients.

Unlike most jobs, what you know is determined by the licensing exam (Bar Exam).
If you pass, you are qualified to start working, much of what you’ll do has to be learned on the job, it isn’t taught in law school.

For example, I teach as an adjunct at a law school in Massachusetts. They have a completely different court system than CT. Civil suits less than xxx dollars and criminal cases with penalties less than one year in jail are in District Court. Bigger cases are in Superior Court. CT has no District Courts, everything starts at the Superior Ct level. A new lawyer coming out of Harvard Law working in CT would have to learn our court system and filing requirements. The CTL firm is in the Family Law, Wills, Trusts and Estates Business, In CT Divorces are part of Superior Court business, In Mass they are part of Probate Court.

I’m also licensed in NY. Your basic trial court is called Supreme Court, in 40+ other states, that’s the name of the highest Appellate Court. You have Surrogate’s Court, similar but not the same as Probate Court in other states.
Most small firms don’t want to bear the expense of a new associate having to learn how it works in the firms’ state, sop will look for graduates of state law schools, or those who have interned in the state. Easy in NY, but CT only has three Law schools: Yale, UCONN, and Quinnipiac, so most applicants come from out of state schools. Our firm has work in MA, CT, NY and FL so I look for associates who are admitted to those Bars first.

I currently have 2 application from graduates of UMICH who are following spouses going to Medical School at Yale. Impressive resumes, but training cost is too high, knowing they’ll leave withing 3 years when spouse gets an intern match out of state, so I’ll probably hire local grads for the two opening I have this year.