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“lesschumras, joint operation is nice, but brings up other issues.
Who do you allow to join this venture? Is it any Jewish school? Does that include reform and conservative? If no, where does the line get drawn? Some people on this site don’t think MO fits into the orthodox category, so its a very touchy subject.”
It’s not a question of who do you allow. You could have multiple ventures( i.e one for MO,another for chareidi, another for yeshivish etc ).It’s up to the schools themselves. In any event, the venture does not depend on hashkafa. In one example that I am aware of, one school is yeshivish, with separate ( 2 miles apart ) boys and girl’s divisions and the other is a MO coed day school. They have one dinner ( saving expenses , and it held in a manner that satisfies the yeshivish yeshiva ) and share all expenses proportionally.
POssible ideas:
1> consider “joint operation agreements” similar to those agreed to by newspapers.
In a number of cities with more than one paper, they each maintain seperate and
distinct editorial staffs, but share common costs to get better prices ( i.e.
newsprint ). Similarly, yeshivas could make similar agreements. Each Yeshiva
would continue to maintain their own hashkafa and education policies but would
but would operate jointly administatively. For example, 20 yeshivas would be
able able to get better prices on everything from supplies, group health
insurance and dinner expenses if purchased together as one large group rather
than individually. Some out of town yeshivas wher there are only 2 schools do it
and it works
I’m not saying that’s the way some people do things, but then don’t say women are treated with respect.
tell me again about how jewishfeminist doesn’t need feminisim because we treat women with such respect. Among the many examples on YWN threads:
* women can’t drive without the husband’s agreement
* women can’t leave the house without the husband’s agreement
* Men are machmir on eruvim, particularly in Brooklyn, because it’s the
women who must remain housebound for years until the last child can walk
while the men are free to come and go
* Men determine for their wives what they can wear and what is considered
tzniyas
* Women are forbidden to learn Gemorra, and probably lack the mental capacity
* Women must walk behind men in a subservient position
* Men are forbidden from opening a door of any kind for a woman
Did I leave any out?
to Intelligent,
I agree, we were. I was just offering my opinion of someone who would censor my ability to discuss a topic that I might be intersted in just because they are not.
Amichai nailed it on the head. One person’s addiction is anothers hobby. What’s the distinction? My obsession is a hobby, yours is an addiction. It’s like the old definition of the difference between comedy and tragedy. If you slip on a banana peel, it’s comedy. If I slip on it, it’s tragedy. We are , in theory all adults. If you like talking about cell phones,or sufganiyot fine. If you like to talk about sports, also fine. However, if you prefer not to talk about a subject, don’t assume the role of mashgiach and determine that noone esle can read what you don’t like. You have a choice. Exercise it by not opening up threads you are not intersested in.
Joseph
Member
jf02, its the screen name itself thats offensive.
Posted 2 hours ago #
but of course, you’re never demeaning to anyone.
to Brooklyn,
The problem, as stated above, is that the last ” Lipa ban ” caused a large financial hardship and, as Rav Kaminetsky of Philadelphia later admitted, he never actually read ( let alone investigated ) what he was signing. While he was the only one to admit it, there must have been others among the signatories and it results in other kol korehs being ignored. Gadolim are not angels and all-knowing in all areas. Going to a rav for all decisions is a chassidish, not a yeshivish custom.
Actually, the Gregorian Calendar was proposed in the 16th century but was adopted onlyu by Catholic countries as Protestant countries wanted nothing to do with any new item proposed by a Pope. It was gradually adopted over the next 200 years , with Britain and its Empire converting in 1752.
Intelligent,
I still find it amazing that ona web site that accuses people of anti-semitism for every real or imagined slight, and accuses other Jews of being frei if they offer any criticism, have no problem ” wanting to spit at their dcorations ” or calling blacks shvartzes. If you don’t want to see the lights, move to Israel or Saudi Arabia.
yankdownunder,
I’m wasn’t talking about Santa decorations. Why would lights need a hechsher?
Joseph,
You didn’t answer my question, as usual. Easter , not Christmas was the day that priests harangued christians to assault Jews. It was Jesus’s death ( around Easter ) that would inspire pogroms, not his supposed birthday. I remenber as an 8-year old in Brooklyn, an 8-year old christian neighbor approached me on Easter Sunday and asked me why I killed him. I asked him who he ( the muredered person ) was and he replied he didn’t know but he had just come from services where the priest said we did.
Now lights need a hechsher? Also, it’s not our holiday but does that make it ok to ridicule other people’s belief? And Joseph, do you ever admit you are wrong? It was always on Easter that Jews were forced to listen to priests accuse us of murder, not Christmas.
There is an element of the practice being a health danger. Many people who chew with open mouths also talk while chewing. This forces the airways in the throat to be open and allows for the possibility of food “going down the wrong pipe ” and choking. Heimlich Maneuver , anyone?
“This may end up in a chilul hashem, i dont think this should be discussed in a public forum that people can and will take it in the wrong way. This may also be considered loshon haa against the some “frum” or “jewish” people. Im not a rov but just a thought.”
Funny, you don’t have a problem with loshon hora when condemning people for violations of your znius standards
“Joseph
Member
Its simply wrong.
Now watch the religious leftists yell, mekor mekor mekor.
Its simply wrong. “
Joseph,
You’ve now revealed yourself as a closet Modern Orthodox. You paskened based on your ” feelings”
To the Moderator,
I think this going to go down an ugly road. I suggest that it be closed
Joseph,
1> If the wife stays hom, and the husband is in kolel, how do they eat and pay tuition?
2> The mother staying home, as mine did, is, I agree the ideal. I have good friends in Flatbush who wanted to the wife to stay home. However, to d oso, they needed a scolarship because the husband is a civil servant . The yeshiva ( not MO ) told them that the should get a job, no tuition assistance.
Joseph,
You were absolutely positive, until 20 minutes ago, that social host laws didn’t exist. How can you still maintain with absolute certainty that Purim is covered? Wanting doesn’t make it so. The woman in the article would not have been arreste with the call to the police. How do you know the same thing wouldn’t happen if police are called to a yeshiva Purim celebration and found significant amounts of alcohol being served to minors?
Joseph,
What about up to the point of ad she haim throw up? That’s when my friends, Chaim Berlin parents, put a stop to it. The sight of their 15-year old son coming home from celebrating with his fellow bchorim throwing up violently and sick to his stomach made them realize that teen agers had no clue where the line of ad dlo yoda was. Over the next few yearts he stayed home, under their supervision as to how much he could drink.
Joseph,
Please do not be so dogmatic. The laws are changing so that many municipalities prohibit SERVING, not just Purchasing. See the story below from the Aug 6, 2007 edition of Newsday
Mother arrested for serving alcohol to minorsBY JENNIFER BARRIOS | [email protected]
11:18 PM EDT, August 6, 2007
xxxxx xxxxx whipped off her sunglasses to reveal puffy, swollen eyes. She had to use her right hand, though — her left arm hung in a sling.
“Do I look like I would serve alcohol to a minor?” she asked. “On my dead father, I would never serve alcohol to a minor.”
On Sunday night, xxxxx, 45, became the first parent in Nassau County charged with violating the county’s new social-host law, which targets adults who permit minors to drink in their homes.
Police said xxxxxx, who was celebrating her birthday in the backyard of her West Hempstead home, allowed her 18-year-old son and his friends to drink alcohol at the party. A fight broke out, leading neighbors to call police at 10 p.m.
“hmh, some peoples common sense is to drive to shul on Shabbos. Youre not going to go to the ”extreme” and tell him better not to go to shul than drive there, now are you? Its just a matter of how we relate to those who observe Judaism differently, relating to G-d on their own (Shabbos driving) level, eh”
Joseph, you are mixing apples ( a tznius chumrah ) and oranges ( drining on Shabbos, an issur ) which clearly doesn’t make much common sense
Joseph,
You are so predictable. Where is your sense of humor?
dveykus613,
“IMHO, it sounds like you have an agenda here and won’t hear anything I have to say ” “But my kavannos are l’sheim shamayim, “
Nobody wishes to attack you, as far as I know. However , you set yourself up for criticism when you make satements like the two I quoted above. You ascribe agendas to those who disagree with you, and imply that the only reason your arguments are not winning them over is that they refuse to listen. On the other hand, you claim for yourself the holiest and purest of intentions. Try to be leave the personal out of the discussions.
By unanimous consensus, “The Coffee Room” agrees that cellular phones in the hands of the young, are worse than the great plague.
Joseph can make this statement because , in his view,his opinion is the only one that counts.
The problem most people have with supporting kollels is that their doesn’t seem to be any criteria similar to secular colleges for gaining admission or maintaining their academic standing. Not everyone graduating from a yeshiva high school is qualified to sit and learn all day yet they all seem to find a place to take them. Kollel is like graduate school, only the cream should be supported by the community. If someone who falls into bottom half of the bell curve wants to sit and learn, it should not be the community’s responsibility to support him.
Excessive drinking on Purim is NOT ok, especially combined with the fact that they drive from house to house, drinking at each one. L’Havdil. 25 years ago the head of the Brooklyn Diocese stopped closing their schools on St Patrick’s Day because too many students were getting drunk at the parade.
to chasid of hashem,
If ” the reason that so many 20 year olds and young couples are divorcing is due to issues which were never addressed – be it unmedicated mental illness or a character flaw such as abuse ” , if the father was an abuser, and the mother stayed with him, is she a person whose judgement you’d want an 18-year girl to follow?
Joseph,
That was not my question. My question was ” Why is an 18 year old girl who is too immature to know what kind of man she wants to marry looking to get married? ” If the girl was mature, then fine. That is the reason why you cannot be a posek. You cannot apply a principle like a blanket to all people. This girl, and others like her who have no clue about the responsibilities and stresses that married life brings, is not ready for marriage at that young of an age.
Joseph,
And that is why there are so many 20 year old divorcees. A ketubah doesn’t make you mature enough for marriage. What you cited was not halacha; you are not required to marry before 20 years of age. Besides, I thought you don’t issue piskei halacha?
Why is an 18 year old girl who is too immature to know what kind of man she wants to marry looking to get married?
Because Yiddishkeit should be about how much I enjoy Shabbos and doing mitzvos and not about how much I can deny and make it harder on myself and others
Does anybody know why Queens Blvd ( a much larger road with more traffic ) does not invalidate eruvim in Queens but Ocean Parkway invalidates the Flatbush eiruv ?
With regard to the Flatbush eiruv. I didn’t use it when I lived in Brooklyn because the Rav of my shul ( a Young Israel ) paskened that we couldn’t use it. However, the question I asked then was if O.P caused the problem in Brooklyn, why didn’t anyone have a problem with Queens Boulevard in Forest Hills and Kew Gargens , among others. It is much larger than OP and carries far more traffic and, with all the apartment buildings has a greater population density.
I’d like to hear your explenation of fossils
to jewishfeminist02
“What’s wrong with me? Why aren’t I married already?” From my wife’s experience in trying to set up shidduchim, her greatest frustration comes from the refusal of young women to even go out on even one date because the boy doesn’t exactly match a list of
unrealistic criteria. As they age and MATURE, their requirements become more realistic but by then the pool of potential mates has narrowed appreciably.
If Joseph Lieberman had been elected Vice-President, would that have meant anti-semitism was dead? Of course not. Racism is alive and well unfortunately, despite Obama’s election. I’ve often been amazed how we, as a people, make broad negative characterizations about non-Jews, frei Jews, blacks, and Hispanics yet scream anti-semitism at every slightest perceived affront ( or accuse another Jew as self-hating if he says something you don’t want to hear )
Just by reading the responses to the death of his grandmother ( and comments about parking enforcement agents ), racism among frum Jews is far from dead
My experience with chazzanus has generally been negative and something to be avoided. It makes the davening take forever, it makes it difficult to concentrate since it interrupts the flow as you wait for the chazzan to stop repeating himself over and over. Generally ,you get the chazzan couldn’t care less that the olam is gertting antsy
to sammyjoe,
“who is not observent should not preach to observent jews how to lead their lives.”
“however when someone claims that “The orthodoxy we know is not true Judaism”, i will not stand idlely by and shviig (remain silent). B: there is only one truth. (not like the liberel minded think)”
Sadly, I must disagree with both you and Joseph. There has never been only one truth. The Gemorah, the rishonin,achronim etc are replete with conflicting positions on Halacha. The problem is that you think your truth is the only one and, to paraphrase your comment, the orthodoxy that anyone else knows is not the true Judaism.
to torahis1
“just because hashem as granted me the privilege to spend my days immersed in his torah- simply happen to know what G-d says on the matter and I don’t try to alter what he says to fit what I think proper morals SHOULD be.”
Next time you’re on the phone with Hashem, ask him when this economic crisis will be over. It is the height of gaiva to claim to have a pipeline to Hashem. Everything you say is, of course, your opinion, not fact. You base your opinion on the supposition that your world view of Yiddishkeit is the only one and that your view of ethics and moral is the only one. That, of course is only your opinion, which you have a right to.
to jewishfeminist02
As you have learned the hard way, open forum on this site is limited to those whose definition of Yiddishkeit matches theirs. Be prepared to be subject to namecalling or worse
To ses,
I guess I wasn’t that clear. I didn’t mean he died on the spot that he saw them, I meant he died ” on the spot ” meaning immediately right there on the platform .
Because he died in a public place, it took the intervention of our Rav and our dr to stop the DOH from conducting an autopsy
To jent1150,
I am moichol you. Please have a chasima and chasima tov and an easy fast
Intelligent,
He told us the story the night before at dinner.please read again
” In 1964, my family was eating dinner one night when he told us this story. He was on his way home from work and standing in the subway “
“The following morning, getting off the train on the Manhattan-bound platform, as he stepped on the spot where he had seen his mother and grandmother, he had the stroke that killed him. He died on the spot.”
to jent1150,
During aseres ymai tshuva how can you make fun of my father, A’H’. and his effort to become a baal tshuvah? I find it very hurtful.
Jent1159, you might be surprised but I believe it because it happened to my father, who was a baal tshuva at age 40.
In 1964, my family was eating dinner one night when he told us this story. He was on his way home from work and standing in the subway platform when he saw his mother and grandmother on the Manhattan bound platform waving to him to come to them. This startled him since they appeared as flesh and blood but had passed away in the 1930’s.
His train then arrived . The following morning, getting off the train on the Manhattan-bound platform, as he stepped on the spot where he had seen his mother and grandmother, he had the stroke that killed him. He died on the spot.
My father was the 3rd generation in his family and was by 1948 they were totally assimilated. As a condition of marrying my mother, he agreed to kashrus and shmiras Shabbos. It took great misiras nefesh in 1948 to tell his boss he would no konger work on Saturday and to face the ridicule of his family. I was the first boy in his family to have any Jewish education in 60 years and he lived long enough to make sure that both myself and my younger sister were enrolled in Yeshiva high school ( my sister ahd just started Esther schoenfeld in boro Park weeks before he died ). He was rewarded with 2 frum children, 5 frum grandchildren and, so far, and 9 frum great grandkids.
to the Big One,
In giving to Kollels, I make the following distinction. I ask the kollel if they only admit those who are the cream or do they admit anyone , regardless of ability or talent. I give to the first, not to the second. There are more pressing needs for Tzedakka than to suport someone who wants to sit and learn but has no talent for it. I’m not saying that that person shouldn’t sait and learn, just that he shouldn’t expect the community to support him.
Unfortunately, it’s not just Boro Park. Last week I was shopping in Brach’s in the 5 Towns ( and which has a big parking lot ) . When I emerged with my shopping cart, I found a minivan parked in the fire lane and blocking the curb cut. Inside was a young child. Even though there were spots available, she chose to force other shoppers to walk to the other end of the store to use the curb cut and block the fire lane. We were about to call 911 when she came out of the store.
Today, ith desktop publishing, anybody can call hiumself a rav or make up a story about a sick family or a wedding. In our community, because it was getting so out of hand with people coming to the door, we did what many have done. Anyone wishing to collect door to door must go to one of the rebbeim in town and present their credentials. If it checks out ( i.e the yeshiva is real and the person is actually authorized to collect ) the collector is given a letter of approval. It has cut down the traffic considerably since many,particularly who had only well-worn photocopies of letters from yeshivos were not legitimate. One collector was not even Jewish but dressed and spoke the part. So, I agree with just me. I only give to those organizations that I recognize and that I know are real.
our davening started 8 am and finished 12:45. It did not feel rushed and we had plenty of niggunim. There is no reason to stretch it out two more hours
I agree with smalltowngirl. In my old shul im Brooklyn we had a “tzaddik” who sat in the front of the shul and davened with unbelievable kavanah while his SIX kids ran wild in the rest of the shul preventing others from davening with kavanah. It’s easy to say, just block it out, snd I’ve tried. But the effort I expend to block out the noise takes away from my davening. As a moshel ,let’s say you had to be on the 20th floor of a building for a minyan, but you’re forced to take the stairs, not the eevator. Sure, with effort, you can climb the 20 flights, arriving huffing and puffing just as minyan starts. Do you think you can put in the same effort if you had taken the elevator?
Last year two tourists from Sweden were arrested in Manhattan for child abandonment for leaving their child outside a store.
Feivel,
All the learners in all the great Yeshivas in Poland and Lithuania did not prevent the Holocaust. How could you be so sure your dtastmen t is correct?