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You are right. I am being influenced by a leaflet that my wife was given 4 years ago about tzniyus. The ikkur schar a women gets is from sending her husband to beis medrash and sons to cheider.
I was going to post that, but I forget if that is the main schar or the method to get schar limud (which is K’neged Kulam, but possible that other mitzvos can get more).
As an additional point, this is another example how these “leaflets” and other Tznius items twist halacha towards a specific untrue, non halachic outcome. It is why Tznius must also be learned from a real Halacha sefer (if you want the halacha).
PS: It makes sense that Tznius (of action, not only elbow & knees) is similar to Limud Torah for men, based on each gender’s specific main Yetzer Hara. (I believe I’ve posted on this before).
According to the GRA the ikkur schar a women gets is not from learning Torah but from her tzniyus.
The GRA you quoted says the Tznius is the main anti-yetzer hara potion for a woman, not that it is the “ikkur schar”.
According to the GRA the ikkur schar a women gets is not from learning Torah but from her tzniyus.
I may have asked this before, but source?
(seems to be my motto this afternoon)
I did not know that, thank you for the info.
mosherose is a classic case of Poe. You can’t be sure that maybe he really is that crazy.
BS”D
The story is from Rashi Avoda Zara Daf Yud Ches. Other Rishonim (IIRC) disagree with that being the issue of why that Tanna had to leave, and doubt Rashi’s story (saying that if she was actually M’zane, she would not have been note as she was in the Gemorah.) (Also (personally) noting that the Tanna in question had a similar situation (and failed) brought down at the end of Mesechta Keddushin, so her Z’nus would have not proved anything anyway regarding men vs. women & Da’atan Kalos).
However, IF THE STORY IS TRUE, you have to know who you are dealing with. Tannaim are not people like us, they are people. We are like Donkeys (and not R’Pinchas Ben Yair’s donkey either, and probably not even Billam’s Donkey)(quote). Respect to the point of awe is an absolute must.
Once the halacha is a certain way, we follow it even when the reason doesn’t appear to be applicable anymore.
Which is why Anaskis is Muttar, of course.
I believe you are correct regarding a Takana (which this would be), not a Halacha.
In New York children collect door to door, sent by their Yeshivos and approved by their parents (the kids are coming from their homes after Yeshiva) to collect tzedakah all the time.
Oh. I hope they go in groups.
I was talking about the “mitzva” of collecting, and how they need to learn how to do so for when they grow older. Who says the schools don’t teach a trade?
???????, ???????????? ?????????; ??????????, ??????????
Children are sent out collecting by many (if not most) of their Yeshivos to train the children in the great mitzvah of collecting tzedakah. It is a wonderful way to teach the children to collect tzedakah while at the same time raising tzedakah.
LOL. Serious or Poe?
I don’t see that.
I see the man and womans name.
Although I am curious how many Shetichye’s there are in the world, it seems like so many!
It must be changing the mother’s name to Shetichye is a segulah to get your daughter married.
Am I only in disdaining this practice??
No. I believe most people in my neighborhood do not participate in these schemes. Nor do I allow my children to go collecting (there was a thread regarding this before, IIRC).
gavra: Realistically it can’t work. A Reform husband and a Litvish wife??? Even if in theory it were doable (the two conditions you mentioned), it would never be practicable.
Prove it. It has happened in the past (One side BT couples).
For those suggesting that the ladies look at less frum men, what kind of gap are people suggesting? Assuming that the young women are Litvish/Yeshivish and lekhatehila would want someone similar, are we talking kippa sruga (no black hat) at an out-of-town Young Israel types? Avi Weiss types? “Traditional” conservative? Regular conservative? Reform?
Yes to all, as long as:
1: The girl will not do any Issurim in the process (Taharas HaMishpacha is upheld).
2: It is agreed the children will be brought up frum.
Having one parent frum and one not is not as uncommon as you might think, although in most cases (I believe) it is due to one becoming BT and the other not, but respecting his/her wishes.
I have a young married friend who told me that he finds it awkward when his wife’s brother comes for a Shabbos meal with his wife.
I’m glad someone brought up family relationships in this conversation. The Gemorah (Pesachim 113a, similar Bava Basra 98b) says that one must be careful with his wife and his sons in law. I find it difficult that we are discussing not having couples together, but we ignore the Gemorah and have sons in law by their Shviggers!!! Especially when the gemorah says about it that people must be careful.
One who is “sensitive” in these areas (eating with the opposite gender) must be sure not to go to their shvigger for meals, and certainly never to sleep at their home, CV! Also one must not invite their son in law for a meal or have them at their house.
Droid: Pashut. Ain Adam Masim Atzmo Rasha. But from someone else, he has to defend himself 🙂
It’s because they’re inviting other couples for a meal. 🙂
I wish I had thought of that!
Of course, it is possible that “No One Special” will win the lotto, but highly unlikely. It won’t happen B’derech Teva, if that makes you happier.
I agree with Shlishi, but will add that the “preconceived secular corrupting notions” are in many cases learned from seminary.
If we would all follow Rav Miller ZTL and have the husband be the king and breadwinner, we would Bezras Hashem see the divorce rate drop. Its when the wife is the main earner, and tells/nags the husband “But I learned in sem….” that the relationship fails.
saying that “No One Special” will not win the lotto tomorrow is bordering with kefirah r’l.
Which one of the 13 ikarim is it in violation of?
Hu Borah Imanhig.
if you don’t see why we need to believe he can do everything, talk to your Rav.
(I believe this is called “appeal to probability fallacy”?)
Write more.
Yet another horror story related right here in the CR. Shall we now also ban biking?
Yes. I also know someone who develped Yena Machla from smoking. If we could only ban that too….
I have gedorim from my Mashgiach as per what I should do. Each of you can ask your own personalized question, as only someone who knows you well can give you the answer that is right for you.
A minyan at a baseball game is like a minyan in back of an airplane. It can be done, but in most cases you are better off davening B’Yechidus when you get home.
There are of course exceptions. An empty Camden Yards on a weeknight has plenty of places where you can gather a minyan and no one will bother you while you daven (I don’t know about the NY stadiums).
adams:
That’s what I said in the beginning of the thread:
A third of Litvish families I know, have one or more single daughters 25 and up
Case in point: Due to various circumstances, I davened at the “late minyan in town” (9:00) on a recent shabbos. about 15-20 people were there for brachos, more for Yishtabach. A number of older (male) singles walked in between Shema & the end of laining. Your typical BY girl may have already rejected her zivug by being “too” frum (and yes, I don’t like that term here either), and not willing to be happy marrying a boy like this (who will not marry a nagger who tells him he has to go early to minyan).
In short, Adams & I agree that a significant part of the problem is the disconnect on frunkeit levels between the available boys and girls.
BTW, why in the world should the less frum boys agree?
In my experience, the boys don’t agree, and would rather remain unmarried (as I posted earlier in the thread).
So now they say the Ultra-orthodox are crazy fanatics who run around beating people.
What, you want them to lie?
This is a similar question to the more general question of:
The torah says to destroy all Avoda Zara. So what about Molech, Markulis, Ba’al, Ov, and the other Avoda Zara mentioned in Tanach & Chazal? How about the Issur of “lo Yishama Al Picha”, how can one mention the names even in context of Torah?
A simplistic (and perhaps correct) answer is that once they are discussed as Torah, those words are no longer part of the Avoda Zara, but part of Torah. I think the same idea can be applied here as well.
🙂
ItcheSrulik: I have weighed moving to EY (which is somewhat easier for me, due to various circumstances I won’t discuss here). As of this point in time, to my regret, I don’t see raising children in EY. Perhaps when I retire, or when the society there is more accepting (which it is moving oh so slowly). At this point, it is not the best thing for my family.
Did someone come to your house and tell you that your women must dress a certain way or suffer consequences?
Quite common in EY & Europe (and certain areas in the US); its called schools & shidduchim. 🙁
(Please excuse me, I’m in a cynical mean mood. Take everything I say with multiple grains of salt)
1. Believing that people are motivated by self-interest; distrustful of human sincerity or integrity.
what are the BASIC rules of tznius
LOL.
Each community has their own Rabbonim who Pasken for them. For eample, there are (valid & real) Rabbonim that Pasken that woman’s pants are not an issue (I think).
Good luck.
(PS. Joe will argue, but he is not so “basic”).
Rabbi Avigdor Miller, z’tl, held strongly and said time after time that the death penalty is a strong deterrent to murder.
Rav Miller ZTL would also not have stood up for Grossman. He also would not have sold out for Yeshiva funding.
?????? ??????? ????????, ??????? ????????? (To quote).
BS”D
At least Feif Un is consistent.
Bais Din would not have executed him either (no Aidim). And killing as a deterent is only if “Shechichi”, so that others shouldn’t do it. That is not the case here.
I think 600K said it the best yesterday. Prison justice will take care of it.
Never, ever, ever talk or go with strangers, even if they are (or look) frum.
Practically, the question does arise with test-tube grown meat (Don’t know if this is Star Trek enough), does it require shechita, and can it be the type of a non-kosher animal?
So I thought about it, and decided it is probably Taloui on the Machlokes Amoraim/Rishonim in the seveth Perek of Nedarim regarding Rabu Heter Al Issur legabai Shvi’is.
I thought the problem with folding a tallis is that you are preparing it for the next Shabbos.
Interesting. I was told that you can fold it, but only if the next time that you will use it is a shabbos, not a Yom Tov (Or Vice versa, including another day of YT).
Joe: Chashud. 🙁
Also, the couple can get more money from the government (and/or stay on the parents’ insurance) if not married, thereby enabling them to stay in Kollel longer. It is the same principle.
Wolf? I would expect you have something to say here?
Practically, the question does arise with test-tube grown meat (Don’t know if this is Star Trek enough), does it require shechita, and can it be the type of a non-kosher animal?
DY: My R”Y (a member of the Moetzes) never inquires about civil registration when he is mesader
As has been proven, the Moetzes is not a rayiah when gelt is involved. 🙁
My Rov has told me many times I have no Chiyuv to give anyone who does not have a letter from our local Va’ad.
Besides I agree with apushatayid. Every penny I give to someone means someone else doesn’t get it (excluding my own additional generosity, of course :-). Best to give it to the people who need it the most.