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Popa- I would like to try to explain the ROB/Modern Orthodox position a little differently than you (at least the way I understand it). I think MOs would agree that Mitzvos encomapass everything, that it means Hashem wants you to act in a certain way, and it’s not limited to just the halachos in the S”A. So why don’t they understand Emunas Chachamim as broadly as the Chareidim? Possibly because while Rabbonim do have a closer relatinship with Hashem and do have a deeper understanding of what He wants of us, the Rabbonim are not necessarily expert in every field under the sun. In terms of halachah, it is clear that they have a better understanding of what Hashem wants and we must listen even if we don’t understand. But in other areas like politics, economics, legal issues, medicine, etc… some people who aren’t Rabbonim may have a better insight of what Hashem wants, not because they have better understanding of Hashem but because they have a better understanding of those topics. It’s possible that an MO who doesn’t have such a “Charedi” understanding of Emunas Chachamim would argue that Emunas Chachamim does not mean that Rabbonim are expert in every area, and it doesn’t necessarily mean that Rabboni have a better insight into what Hashem wants of us in areas that they are not expert in.
It’s funny how most people think the Rama is a kula and want to be “machmir” like the S”A. For some people though, the S”A is a kula. They would be yotzei the halachah with the Rama but they want an excuse to get drunk so they are meikil like the S”A.
The fact is, the S”A (I think it’s the S”A) says it best- echad hamarbeh ve’echad hamamit, rak sheyechavein libo lashamayim- it doesn’t matter how much you drink, as long as you are lishmah. If you use drinking on Purim as an avenue to get to higher spiritual levels, and you will not violate any aveiros, then you can and should drink a lot on Purim. But if you are using Purim as an excuse to get drunk and to get wasted, then you are not allowed to be meikil like the S”A because you don’t have the right kavanah, and you are better off being machmir like the Rama.
Who cares if the oaths were violated? Does it make any practical difference whether the State was founded in violation of these oaths or not?
Hakatan- seriously? Ovdei Avodah Zarah? Do we even poskin like that R’ Elchonon? Would you go so far to assur non-mevushal wine from a Zionist winery because of yayin nesech? Are all religious Zionists chayav misah for being oveid avodah zarah? You go too far and it’s shocking that you don’t even realize it. To claim that such a large portion of Klal Yisroel who are otherwise shomrei Torah and Mitzvos, among them are huge Rabbonim and Talmidei Chachamim, are ovdei avodah zarah? I guarantee most Charedi Rabbonim nowadays (at least outside of Satmar and Neturei Karta) would never label so many frum Jews as ovdei avodah zarah, so maybe you should follow in their lead and cool down your misplaced zealotry.
Who cares if the state was founded be’issur or be’heter? What’s the nafka mina? If it’s beheter you must say hallel on Yom Ha’Atzma’us but if it was be’isur it’s assur? If it’s behter you must ignore all the religious problems with the state but if it’s be’issur you must ignore all the good it does for Yiddishkeit (like funding yeshivos and opening up the borders of Eretz Yisroel for Jews worldwide)? If it’s be’issur you must join Neturei Karta and support Arabs who want to turn the Land of Israel into an Arab state?
I dunno, I think this argument is theoretical at best. Whether be’issur or beheter, the state is here. The question is what do we do now? And the answer is, whatever is best of Klal Yisroel, regardless of how the state was founded. It’s time to stop arguing about the past with an argument that has absolutely no practical ramifications, and start focusing on the future, how can we influence the current state of events to benefit Klal Yisroel?
I dunno, I never found that question so compelling. Just because G-d knows what we’re going to do doesn’t mean he’s choosing it for us. G-d knows what decision we will make, but it’s still us making that choice. We’re not doing something because G-d knows what we’re going to do, G-d knows what we’re going to do because we do it.
And practically the question is irrelevant. G-d may know what we’re going to do, but we don’t. So from our perspective we’re making the choice, we’re doing what we decided to do, and nothing (at least from our perspective) is making us choose one way over another other than our bechira chofshis.
I think it makes sense for a wife to follow her mother’s minhag for lighting Shabbos candles as opposed to mother in laws. She is the one doing the mitzvah and she should do it in the way that’s most meaningful to her, usually it’s by following in her mother’s footsteps.
Who knows? I wouldn’t be surprised if deep in India or Africa or China there are people who know real kishuf.
I am absolutely sickened by same sex marriage. But at the same time, I understand that my disgust over it comes solely from the Torah. If I weren’t Jewish, or even frum, I would probably be pro same gender marriage, even if I would find it nauseating, simply because I would probably be pro-equality. That being said, I can’t find fault with people who are pro gay marriage as I would probably be one myself if I didn’t have the Torah. And since they don’t have the Torah to guide them, how can I impose my religious beliefs on them?
In addition, it doesn’t seem like there is any legal basis to stop it. The main argument is that it is immoral… but who decided morality? If the government has the ability to decide what is and what isn’t moral (assuming no one is being hurt), what’s stopping them from deciding that something that we do as religious Jews is immoral (like Bris Milah)? And since the protests seem to have no basis in US secular law, I think our protests would be looked down upon and seen as a joke.
In conclusion, I detest gay marriage and I wish it wouldn’t be legal… but you won’t find me in public protesting, just praying to G-d that somehow it will end.
twisted- while I agree that in general there should be no redundancies in letters, I find it interesting how in many piyutim that go in alphabetical order, many authors sometime use a word that begins with sin instead of a samech. For example, Keil Adon in Shabbos morning davening. That seems to imply that somehow samech and sin are interchangeable… at least the authors of those piyutim thought so.
Shibboleth or Sibboleth. ??? ???? ???? ?????? ????.
akuperma- why is language any different than any other area of halacha? I mean, we are trying to fulfill G-d’s will… in essence we are trying to recreate the Torah that was given to Moshe at Sinai. Yes we believe halacha evolves in the sense that it needs to address new situations, but we don’t believe G-d’s will evolves or changes over time. Shouldn’t language be the same? Shouldn’t we be trying to speak the same way that HKB”H spoke to Moshe at Sinai?
I heard a theory that in Eastern Europe, people can’t pronounce the “th” sound. That’s why instead of saying “thank you very much” people from Eastern Europe will say “sank you very much.” It’s possible that the “s” sound for the sav only developed because Jews from that part of the world lost the ability to pronounce the “th” sound.
Maybe it’s the other way around… maybe pritzus and lack of tznius is a result of improper speech…
At the beginning of the game you get a choice to start in kollel or to start in kollel.
RI- what bal tosif? The strings are allowed to be any color. There is a minhag and a chumra that the color of the strings should match the color of the beged, but you could technically have other colors and still be yotzei tzitzis without violating bal tosif. IMHO, it makes sense to say that safek deoraysa lechumra overrides that minhag.
Personally, I don’t wear techeiles, but for no other reason than most of our gedolim don’t. But from a logical and halachic perspective, all the arguments point to wearing techeiles.
I haven’t been following everything but I saw some talk about Mesorah vs. sdl. I think someone said that Mesorah changes the chazakah and therefore removes the safek. I think that’s a valid point but it doesn’t seem to apply here. Correct me if I’m wrong, but we don’t have a Mesorah that what people use today ISN’T techeiles… we just don’t have a Mesorah telling us what IS techeilies… meaning that things that meet the halachic criteria can be techeiles, we’re just not 100% positive because we lack a Mesorah. In other words, it’s a safek. For all we know, when Mashiach comes, we’ll find out that it really is techeies… there’s no Mesorah contradicting that. It seems to me that sdl would fit very nicely here.
apers- you say that ???? doesn’t override ????? ???? That may not be true. When the ???”? argues on the ???”? and says that ???? ??? ????? is one of the ???”? ?????, he actually uses the phrase ????? ????- that ???? ??? ????? and ????? ??? ????? are connected. Now, a ????? ???? definitely overrides ????? ??? as there are few things more life threatening than fighting a war… and if ???? ??? ????? is part of a ????? ????, that might mean it also overrides ????? ???.
‘why is their kanaus limited to the learners that are not mekayim the being nehneh from their own work (which the chofetz chaim describes as at best midoh tovah) and not to the much larger groups of “earners” that are not mekayim the “aseh torascho kevah” which is, and always has been, the very basic fundamental obligation of every male Jew?’
Even if that were true, I think the answer is as follows: it bothers people more when a righteous person does something wrong than when someone less righteous person something wrong. If a person decides that he wants to work and not learn a word, that’s awful. But odds are, nothing I say can change that. My protest would be coming from the perspective of Torah and he already made the decision that Torah isn’t that important to him.
However, a person who is learning is obviously interested in doing the right thing. He is obviously genuine. And when people see a person who’s in kollel but not really made for it. He can’t really keep his sedorim because he’s not that good at it. His family is struggling because he’s not making a parnassah. His wife is forced to go out in the working world (possibly a violation of tznius- kol kevudah bas melech penimah) and he’s not learning enough to make it worth it. This person is trying to do the right thing, but is arguably doing the wrong thing. For this person, a macha’ah may work. For this person, if he realizes that full time kollel isn’t necessarily for him, and HKB”H wants him to be working, he would.
Or the flip side, is that this person knows he shouldn’t be in kollel but stays because he wants the prestige, or because of peer pressure, or because of simple laziness… so then he’s the worst of the worst because he’s using and taking advantage of Torah for his own personal gain… and this cannot stand.
I have heard the argument that kollel should not be limited for only the elite learners because learning Torah is about quality not quantity. It’s not about how much you know or how smart you are, it’s about your effort… that’s what you get sechar for. People who say that learning should only be for the elite are closing the door on those who aren’t as smart but willing to put in as much, or more, effort in learning… and that can’t be.
IMHO, that argument is false and misleading. Yes, it is true that the true sechar comes from effort and not amount of Torah… however there is a ma’amar Chazal that says “if a person says he tried and succeeded (in learning), believe him. But if a person says that he tried and didn’t succeed, don’t believe him”. We have a promise that when we put effort in learning, we will succeed. If a person is of the age to learn in kollel, and isn’t successful enough to be considered elite, it demonstrates that he has not put in as much effort as those who really are elite. Those who are elite are also the ones who have put the most effort in Torah.
nisht- come on… obviously a possuk has more weight than a kol korei. But unfortuantely some people aren’t listening to the pesukim. The kol korei may help in putting public pressure on a person who would otherwise ignore his halachic and moral responsibilities.
WIY- a kol korei won’t stop WOW either. The kol korei isn’t for the violaters, it’s for the tzibur to step up efforts to stand up to such people to ensure that their crimes don’t happen again, or just to make a public outcry that we are enemies of those who violate G-d who do such acts.
In ???? ??????, there is an ????? of ????? in ??? ??: ???? ?. On the spot, ??”? explains based on the ???? and the opinion of ?’ ????? that this is an ????? to attribute significance to certain times. For example, to say this season is a good time to start something. Doesn’t the idea that ??? is a time of good fortune and ???? ?? is a time of bad fortune violate this ????? ?????????
PBA- what do you mean that Hashem doesn’t act this way with us? According to R’ Aisenstark (at least the way I understand it), at some point you can’t show your child unconditional love (that doesn’t mean you don’t have it) and you must kick him out of the home. At some point, when we reached a low level, Hashem hid his face from us, and kicked us out of our home.
Also, people argue it’s one of the 7 Mitvzos Benei Noach. So? Is it our responsibility to do kiruv among the Goyim? According to many, Chirsitianity is AZ for Goyim… should we be embarking on a campaign to make that illegal because they’re violating one of the 7 mitzvos benei Noach? If a candidate is pro gay marriage but willing to give a lot of $$$ to yeshivos… should we oppose such a candidate? We have to sacrifice Torah to do kiruv for Goyim? We care about them more than we care about us? Maybe we should worry about increasing Torah and doing kiruv for not yet frum Jews before we start worrying which one of the 7 Mitzvos Benei Noach that the Goyim aren’t keeping.
Personally, I’m against gay marriage… but I hear the other side. The fact is, the only reason we know gay marriage to be immoral is because the Torah tells us. If it wasn’t for the Torah, nowadays, in our society, most of us would probably be pro-gay marriage. Now since we have the Torah we think it’s wrong… but if we would recognize that without Torah, we would probably agree with the pro gay marriage platform, how could we expect others to accept an anti-gay marriage platform without Torah? As immoral as we believe it to be, we only believe it to be immoral because the Torah tells us. How could we impose our religion on others? If we could impose our religion on others, what’s stopping them from imposing their religion on us?
As a man, I would rather have Sunday as an off day instead of Friday. If Friday is an off day, then I have to help for Shabbos. What kind of off day is that? But if Sunday is an off day, then someone will get our home ready for Shabbos (thank G-d for wives!) and I get an off day to do fun stuff with the family that I wouldn’t be able to do on Shabbos.
I’ve always had an issue with women working in order to support their husbands in learning. Women ideally aren’t supposed to work. They’re supposed to be full time mothers. Kol kevudah bas melech penimah- tznius seems to say that a woman should be living her life in private, not in public. Now, if a woman decides to work because of her menuchas hanefesh (she can’t be in the house all day) or because her husband’s salary isn’t enough to provide for the family, that’s one thing. There is no issur for a woman to work, it’s just a hashkafic issue. I don’t think this hashkafic issue is a reason for a woman to live with less menuchas hanefesh or in poverty (assuming no actual halachos are broken).
Working to support a husband in learning is different though. Talmud Torah is not just an ends in and of itself, it’s also a means to an end. The end being living a life of more Avodas Hashem. Talmud Torah is supposed to make us (and our families) better ovdei Hashem. It doesn’t seem like we’re suppose to make concessions in our Avodas Hashem, and our (or our wife’s) tznius in order to learn Torah. That seems to be backwards. Talmud Torah is supposed to lead to a life of greater tznius, not the other way around.
Really? Who feeds your ox?
I find it strange that in some places in this weeks ????, the ???? uses the words ?? and ?? interchangeably. For example, ???? ask to curse ??? ????? using the word (?? (??? ??? ?? ???? and ?’ responds using the language (?? (?? ??? ?? ???. Usually we don’t assume that two different words are synonymous in the ???? (especially here as ??”? tells us that these are two different levels of curses), so why the inconsistency?
ub-
That’s my point. The Orthodox community seems to be pinpoint homosexuality as the most crucial value when selecting a politician, yet other values don’t seem to be as important. I don’t understand why we should care about any values held by a politician. When we vote, we should be focusing on who is the best for our community, in other words gelt! Who will give more money to yeshivos and shuls, and who will do the most to enable the frum community to survive financially. Why should we care about anything else?